Sources on setting up your own gun drills?

[ctbreitwieser]

I've gotten to the point where shooting, just for the sake of shooting, is no longer fun to me, and only feels like a waste of ammo. I shoot 3 gun matches when I have the time, and it has curved my shooting interests to focusing more on getting more out of my shooting. I do not want to pay someone to attend a class, as I feel the Marine Corps taught me plenty as far knowing what I need to know about that stuff. I want to start focusing more on speed and accuracy. I have plenty of land to set up my own senarios and drills, (I've actually hosted a couple of 3 gun events on our farm), my biggest problem now is finding a source for different drills that I can set up myself and allow me to enhance my skills.

Ive read reviews on Magpul's videos and a lot of what I read says they do not give much advice on setting up your own drills, and the ones they do show are quite elaborate and require lots of setup. Where could I find more info, books or DVDs, that would give me actual drills I could set up and run through by myself and with my fiancé, for both handgun and rifle?

i hope I don't sound arrogant when saying I don't think a class could help, I know I am far from an expert in anything, and there is always something new to be learned from others, but I do feel that my money would be better spent towards ammo that I could use when practicing on my own.


Does anyone here run gun drills on their own, or seen and used drills that you felt were helpful?

 

[FishnHunt]

I bought a couple of training books by Mike Seeklander and Ben Stoeger earlier this year, I think they have a bunch of drills with explanations. I'll look at them tonight, see if I can post some examples. They are pistol-orientated, but I'd think you could adapt them for rifle (especially 3-gun type rifle stuff).

 

[Never A Victim]

I've gotten to the point where shooting, just for the sake of shooting, is no longer fun to me, and only feels like a waste of ammo. I shoot 3 gun matches when I have the time, and it has curved my shooting interests to focusing more on getting more out of my shooting. I do not want to pay someone to attend a class, as I feel the Marine Corps taught me plenty as far knowing what I need to know about that stuff. I want to start focusing more on speed and accuracy.

I'm not trying to start an argument here, but there is no replacement for taking a firearms training course. You can watch all the youtube or magpul videos you want, and there is nothing that will replace getting instruction on how to run your gun from a good company/instructor. From all the training I've taken with the Marine Corps as an 0311, to the past 8 years as a police officer, I can tell you with certainty the best firearms training I ever got was from a civilian firearms training company. I was like you, I thought that because I was a cop and a Marine, that I didn't need to take any classes. I was wrong.

 

[EyeCarry]

You may already know of this site: pistol-training.com » Drills. I have been using some of their drills for practicing.

 

[AngryRooster]

Agreed, a class is the best.

However sometimes that's not an option for one reason or another. A friend and I just started something different from the square range shooting. We set targets up at 7, 10 and 15 yards in 3 different shooting lanes. Standing in the center lane with the 7 yard target in front of us we will draw from a retention holster and engage the targets in different set orders. I have a shot timer and use the B27 targets (IIRC) so we can keep track of improvement. We change the order of the targets, number of shots, throw in a reload, sidestep to a different lane occasionally, just things to change it up some. It's simple to do, more fun and adds a bit more to standard lane shooting. Both of us are prior military and we both have seen improvements over the past month of doing this. Our times have came down and our shots are becoming more centered and tighter each time. We go at least once a week.

At some point I want to take another class but with things that need done on the farm I don't really have the time. Maybe next summer.

 

[Alamo]

Ditto what Never-A-Victim said. You don't know what you don't know. I am sure there are some schlubs out there teaching that know less than you do, but going with a recognized name shouldn't hurt. (Which one is a whole 300 post thread in itself, no doubt.)

As far as shooting drills: Greg Ellefritz has a blog/website where among other things he regularly publishes shooting drills that he comes across and likes. Here's a link to that category on his website. Shooting Drills | Active Response Training

Good luck.

 

[ctbreitwieser]

Thanks for the replys, guys! That's just the stuff I was looking for.

As as far as the classes go, like I said, I know is a lot I could learn from a class, but at this point in time, I am comfortable enough with my shooting skills that I feel I can effectively train myself with more shooting and better drills to aid in my training. There's also the fact. that I live in an area where a class would require me to travel a good distance and I would have to stay in a hotel or some other form of lodging. It's a cost I can't currently justify. I m not knocking classes at all, I think I would really enjoy it.

I would love love to have a book if possible. Something I could bring with me and reference as I'm shooting. I'm gonna be sure to look around at knob creek Saturday and see if I can find something as well.

 

[Coach]

I've gotten to the point where shooting, just for the sake of shooting, is no longer fun to me, and only feels like a waste of ammo. I shoot 3 gun matches when I have the time, and it has curved my shooting interests to focusing more on getting more out of my shooting. I do not want to pay someone to attend a class, as I feel the Marine Corps taught me plenty as far knowing what I need to know about that stuff. I want to start focusing more on speed and accuracy. I have plenty of land to set up my own senarios and drills, (I've actually hosted a couple of 3 gun events on our farm), my biggest problem now is finding a source for different drills that I can set up myself and allow me to enhance my skills.

Ive read reviews on Magpul's videos and a lot of what I read says they do not give much advice on setting up your own drills, and the ones they do show are quite elaborate and require lots of setup. Where could I find more info, books or DVDs, that would give me actual drills I could set up and run through by myself and with my fiancé, for both handgun and rifle?

i hope I don't sound arrogant when saying I don't think a class could help, I know I am far from an expert in anything, and there is always something new to be learned from others, but I do feel that my money would be better spent towards ammo that I could use when practicing on my own.


Does anyone here run gun drills on their own, or seen and used drills that you felt were helpful?

How did they teach you plenty about shooting but not give the drills with which to practice those skills?

 

[ctbreitwieser]

How did they teach you plenty about shooting but not give the drills with which to practice those skills?

I'm trying to find more drills to use. Most of what we shot was controlled pairs, hammered pairs, and failure drills on sillouette targets.

 

[iChokePeople]

I'm trying to find more drills to use. Most of what we shot was controlled pairs, hammered pairs, and failure drills on sillouette targets.

Wow, the USMC has really changed since my time. I don't remember EVER doing those things. If you're where you say/think you are, I think you should be able to assess your own strengths and weaknesses and design drills to help in the areas in which you need help -- why rely on canned drills that someone else designed to help with issues you might not have or to strengthen areas in which you might already be strong?

Ammo cost vs. instructor cost: You'd be money ahead to pay a good instructor rather than throw more rounds downrange, IMHO. This statement isn't about you, specifically, but about MOST people. With the possible exception of guys like Rob377, who is very analytical, very smart, and uses video to assess and presumably improve his performance, MOST of us would be better off with a good instructor. That includes me.

 

[Coach]

I'm trying to find more drills to use. Most of what we shot was controlled pairs, hammered pairs, and failure drills on sillouette targets.

My point was that you have enough training. Your words. Why do you need more drills than the ones the Marines provided? Enough training but not enough drills is not consistent.

 

[ctbreitwieser]

My point was that you have enough training. Your words. Why do you need more drills than the ones the Marines provided? Enough training but not enough drills is not consistent.

I never said I have enough training. I said I've been taught enough to feel comfortable with my overall shooting techniques (ie: stance, grip, and malfunction correction, and weapons handling). I'm not here to try and say I'm better than any instructor, and I'm not going to talk about what training I have or what all I've done to back my claims, and I'm not saying there isn't much I could learn from a class. I'm simply stating that I am comfortable enough in my weapon handling abilities to be able to learn from myself through different techniques that I may have never tried. It's much easier and more practical for my current situation for me to go out on the farm and shoot drills versus attending a class.

This is is no different than someone who has attended many classes asking for more ways to help them improve their skills at home.

 

[Coach]

I do not want to pay someone to attend a class, as I feel the Marine Corps taught me plenty as far knowing what I need to know about that stuff. I want to start focusing more on speed and accuracy.

?

Speed and accuracy are pretty significant element of shooting and for competition shooting they are big. Shooting drills from a video and a book are not going to get you to the next level if you don't know what to do and what to look for. Once you know what to do and what to look for while you are shooting then you can make up your own drills to test those skills. Jake Martens has posted several videos over the year from the big name guys telling you what you need to know. You can get that info for free. That would be the place to start. The Marine Corp did not teach you what you need to know about speed and accuracy for what you are trying to do. Find out about calling shots and snapping eyes and then practice. Speed and accuracy are as simple as that.

 

[ctbreitwieser]

Speed and accuracy are pretty significant element of shooting and for competition shooting they are big. Shooting drills from a video and a book are not going to get you to the next level if you don't know what to do and what to look for. Once you know what to do and what to look for while you are shooting then you can make up your own drills to test those skills. Jake Martens has posted several videos over the year from the big name guys telling you what you need to know. You can get that info for free. That would be the place to start. The Marine Corp did not teach you what you need to know about speed and accuracy for what you are trying to do. Find out about calling shots and snapping eyes and then practice. Speed and accuracy are as simple as that.

Maybe I'm just reading your posts in the wrong context, or maybe I did a poor job stating my intentions, but the vibe I'm getting from you is that practicing on my own is pointless and I can only get better if I attend a class. If im reading out of context, I apologize. If I'm understanding you correctly, that's pure BS.

Now let me restate my intentions. I'm looking for ways to mix up my shooting, when shooting on my property, to make it both more fun and more beneficial.

I understand you' teach classes, and I respect that, but that is not what I'm currently looking for. When time and finances provide me the opportunity to start taking classes, then I will begin looking for a class that fits what I'm looking for.

 

[bwframe]

...
Ammo cost vs. instructor cost: You'd be money ahead to pay a good instructor rather than throw more rounds downrange, IMHO....

This right here ^^^.

 

[David Rose]

This right here ^^^.

Ctbreitwieser, I know you may regard the responses you are getting as argumentative, don't. There are a lot of people here who have walked this road already.

 

[Coach]

Maybe I'm just reading your posts in the wrong context, or maybe I did a poor job stating my intentions, but the vibe I'm getting from you is that practicing on my own is pointless and I can only get better if I attend a class. If im reading out of context, I apologize. If I'm understanding you correctly, that's pure BS.

Now let me restate my intentions. I'm looking for ways to mix up my shooting, when shooting on my property, to make it both more fun and more beneficial.

I understand you' teach classes, and I respect that, but that is not what I'm currently looking for. When time and finances provide me the opportunity to start taking classes, then I will begin looking for a class that fits what I'm looking for.

The fact that I teach classes has nothing to do with my posts. If you simply practice on your own without knowing what you should be doing then you are wasting your time and your ammo and the money involved. You are wanting to shoot faster and more accurately for 3 gun competition. Do you know what snapping the eyes and calling shots is all about? If you don't you are wasting the time and the money you want to save. Call it BS all you want. You are wrong. There are 3 dozen people or more on this website that could save you hundreds and maybe thousands of dollars with a lesson or two.

 

[Rob377]

Wow, the USMC has really changed since my time. I don't remember EVER doing those things. If you're where you say/think you are, I think you should be able to assess your own strengths and weaknesses and design drills to help in the areas in which you need help -- why rely on canned drills that someone else designed to help with issues you might not have or to strengthen areas in which you might already be strong?

Ammo cost vs. instructor cost: You'd be money ahead to pay a good instructor rather than throw more rounds downrange, IMHO. This statement isn't about you, specifically, but about MOST people. With the possible exception of guys like Rob377, who is very analytical, very smart, and uses video to assess and presumably improve his performance, MOST of us would be better off with a good instructor. That includes me.

Has someone else been logging in under my name?

I just use shooting videos to get chicks. Sadly, it hasn't worked as well as I'd hoped. YET.

In all seriousness, a few years ago, I thought I was hot sh*t because I was double expert in the Corps, shot a more pistol than anything as part of my MOS...yadda, yadda, yadda. Went to a USPSA match and was surprised that I was at best lukewarm sh*t. So I took classes with guys like Coach, Steve Anderson, and Ben Stoeger, and learned that I didn't know it all. Shocker, right?

I can understand the skepticism, because my personal .02 is that half the "trainers" out there are completely full of excrement. Find ones that aren't, you'll be better off for it.

But to answer the question more directly: Skills and Drills: For the Practical Pistol Shooter By Ben Stoeger

 

[remington870]

There are two I do. One for the handgun is the 2-2-2 drill. At 20 feet, you fire off 2 rounds at a standard size index card from concealment in less that two seconds. Then you have the 2-5-2 drill that I saw Chris Costa run. This is for your AR/combat rifle. You have three separate targets set up, roughly 18-24 inches apart. Starting at 7 yards, fire 2 rounds at the first target, 5 rounds center target, 2 rounds end target. Then you move back to 10 or 15 yards. Run the same thing. Then 20 or 25 yards. If you want to continue farther back, by all means go for it. A variation of the 2-5-2 is after your intial run, back track. 2 rounds, 5 rounds, 2 rounds, 2 rounds again, 5 rounds back at center, and 2 at the first. The handgun drill is very useful for practicing fast sight alignment and has helped me. The rifle drill is to train you for the possible situation where an aggressor may not be neutralized with the average 2-3 rounds. I would also recommend looking up Chris Costa and Travis Haley if you already dont know about them.

 

[cedartop]

I've gotten to the point where shooting, just for the sake of shooting, is no longer fun to me, and only feels like a waste of ammo. I shoot 3 gun matches when I have the time, and it has curved my shooting interests to focusing more on getting more out of my shooting. I do not want to pay someone to attend a class, as I feel the Marine Corps taught me plenty as far knowing what I need to know about that stuff. I want to start focusing more on speed and accuracy. I have plenty of land to set up my own senarios and drills, (I've actually hosted a couple of 3 gun events on our farm), my biggest problem now is finding a source for different drills that I can set up myself and allow me to enhance my skills.

Ive read reviews on Magpul's videos and a lot of what I read says they do not give much advice on setting up your own drills, and the ones they do show are quite elaborate and require lots of setup. Where could I find more info, books or DVDs, that would give me actual drills I could set up and run through by myself and with my fiancé, for both handgun and rifle?

i hope I don't sound arrogant when saying I don't think a class could help, I know I am far from an expert in anything, and there is always something new to be learned from others, but I do feel that my money would be better spent towards ammo that I could use when practicing on my own.


Does anyone here run gun drills on their own, or seen and used drills that you felt were helpful?

Finding and setting up drills is easy. Figuring out what they are supposed to do for you is a different story. I can got to a bunch of different websites and get drills to run and then run them and get better at them. If I don't understand the why or what I am trying to accomplish, that can be next to worthless. I am not new to this, yet when I want to know something specific that I am having problems with I go somewhere that I can be helped. Recently I felt I needed help on transitioning between targets. I went to a private lesson with Coach. He showed me what I needed to know, coached me on it, and then gave me some drills to work on. Now it is up to me to improve those skills. If you know enough to know what you need to work on and why, you should be able to pick the drills you need and then implement them. Resources abound. If what you are looking for is competitive shooting, the book Rob listed is very good.