"Smart" guns -- shut off remotely by the Feds?

[Jerchap2]

As the article says, it is the ultimate wet dream of the liberal gun haters.

They Are Pushing 'Smart Guns' Which Can Be Shut Off Remotely

 

[Mosin Mounts]

Don't worry, it'll never fly.

 

[metaldog]

I'm pushing the big red KILL switch. That was EASY!

 

[1911ly]

Before it would work you would have to be stupid enough to buy one! I'll pass. I will decide when my gun goes boom!!

 

[TopDog]

A couple of previous threads on this subject:

https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/general-firearms-discussion/305453-rfid-closer-reality.html

The thread above references a thread prior to it, in the first post.

 

[jwh20]

Don't worry, it'll never fly.

In my opinion, gun owners and others concerned about the erosion of rights protected by the 2A should remain vigilant about this sort of idea. It's easy to say, "this will never fly" but in fact lawmakers in places like California are already moving this way. They already have an "approved" list for guns. They are enabling a previously passed law requiring "microstamping" now that such technology may actually be available, and this will certainly be a part of their plans as soon as it can be implemented.

If it can happen in CA, it can happen anywhere in the US. All it takes is the right combination of "progressive" politicians.

So ultimately these things get started or ended at the ballot-box. Vote the Constitution FIRST because without it nothing else matters.

 

[level0]

In my opinion, gun owners and others concerned about the erosion of rights protected by the 2A should remain vigilant about this sort of idea. It's easy to say, "this will never fly" but in fact lawmakers in places like California are already moving this way. They already have an "approved" list for guns. They are enabling a previously passed law requiring "microstamping" now that such technology may actually be available, and this will certainly be a part of their plans as soon as it can be implemented.

If it can happen in CA, it can happen anywhere in the US. All it takes is the right combination of "progressive" politicians.

So ultimately these things get started or ended at the ballot-box. Vote the Constitution FIRST because without it nothing else matters.

Spot on...sadly. Remain vigilant!

 

[HenryWallace]

from a previous thread...

tradertator

• View Profile
• View Forum Posts
• Private Message
• Add as Contact
• Send Email
• View Forum Threads

Master

---

Join DateJul 2008LocationPeoples Republic of BloomingtonPosts4,773

What the hell is this?

I recently bought an 870 Police, and found this hot glued to the inside of the stock body. Its a police trade in, and I figure its some sort of RFID for the department that issued out the gun but I thought I'd see what you guys think.

Reply Reply With Quote

---

02-07-2013 #2
chezuki

• View Profile
• View Forum Posts
• Private Message
• Add as Contact
• View Forum Threads

The cake is a lie.

---

Join DateMar 2009LocationDriftin' driftin' driftin' awayPosts3,318

Rf ID chip. In case it was stolen.

Just like you could have implanted on a pet.

Originally Posted by the1kidd03
Personally, I like to target non-gun owners, violent crime victims, and youth.





The Smart 'turn off' style hasn't hit the streets yet, but the tracking has. I believe one MAJOR mfg was already implementing this tracking as a standard now.

Ahh, just found this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcIpmAaFjGE​

 

[CathyInBlue]

RFID ≠ smart gun
smart gun ≠ RFID

 

[level0]

RFID ≠ smart gun
smart gun ≠ RFID

True, but in my view it's step in the wrong direction. I'm a high tech guy, I make my living in high tech, and I'm generally for more technology everywhere...but I want my guns decidedly low tech.

 

[MikeDVB]

An RFID in you gun makes it just as track-able as your lost pet with an RFID.

[In short: somebody has to actually have an RFID scanner and look for it on the gun.]

It's not some magical GPS-enabled disable-your-gun device ... duh.

Now as far as them pushing 'smart' guns ... Wonder what happens when the batteries go dead? They going to pass a law that requires solar panels or that you keep fresh batteries in it? .

On second thought, I suppose the gun could require batteries to operate [i.e. dead batteries = no bang]... That's a scary thought - the one time in your life you actually need your gun and it fails to work... Wonder who you would sue - Energizer? Duracell? The government? That is if you survive the encounter...

Wonder what happens if the 'accidentally' disable the wrong gun and said gun is then useless when the owner actually needs it... Lawsuit?

It's a big can-o-worms that I don't think they really want to open ... or maybe they do ... they don't tend to be all that smart or so it seems.

 

[Dauvis]

I've had this dystopian story bouncing around in my head that I should try writing down some time. Not that anybody is interested that. These smart guns (I call them safe guns as that is how they will be marketed) will eventually become fully electronic. The only moving parts will be the projectiles (look up metal storm as a real example). That will enable for them to receive and send transmissions and be controlled by an external party. Imagine the scenario of a hostage situation. The LEOs will be able to transmit a code that will disable the hostage takers guns. Have kids? Turn the gun off. A passcode will keep junior from accidentally killing himself. No gun zones can be created to protect important people. It easy and most importantly, it's safe. Why would anyone would want to use one of those "unsafe" mechanical guns that only criminals would use? It need not be liberals who would back the use of these guns. Those of an authoritarian bent would love them as well.

I think I got my tinfoil hat on too tight this morning.

 

[TopDog]

On second thought, I suppose the gun could require batteries to operate [i.e. dead batteries = no bang]... That's a scary thought - the one time in your life you actually need your gun and it fails to work... Wonder who you would sue - Energizer? Duracell? The government? That is if you survive the encounter...

I believe that is exactly how it works. No battery power equals no bang. Disabling the device disables the gun. Sure you more than likely would be able to monkey with it and get it to work without the device. Then you would be violation along the lines of filing off a serial number.

I really think this is coming and if it's not stopped right now before it gets implemented there will be no turning back. This is exactly what the Democrats and anti gun folks want - CONTROL.

Give them an inch and they will take a mile.

 

[CathyInBlue]

[In short: somebody has to actually have an RFID scanner and look for it on the gun.]

Or, and follow me here, have a high power RFID transmitter and a high sensitivity RFID receiver, not a standard RFID scanner, and then they can bathe an area in RF energy and listen indiscriminately to all of the RFID tags in that area of whatever type whatsoever and so be able to discover the existence of all kinds of items that would be virtually undetectable upon intensive hand searching or on a wholesale scale that would otherwise require untennable amounts of inconvenience to the proletariat or an untennably large workforce. Want to move from area A where your guns are legal to area B where your guns are illegal but not disclose that you're going to be retaining your contraband firearms in your area B home? Too bad. Just travelling across the border will get your entire U-Haul RFID scanned and they'll see the tags belonging to banned firearms clear as day. Those red and blue lights in your rear-views are not the colors of freedom.

Or, they just want to keep tabs on where people with legally permitted, but only begrudgingly so, firearms are travelling, so they pepper the roadways with RFID trackers like cell phone towers. You may not have made a trip to City X, but the authorities know your handgun sure did.

 

[MikeDVB]

Or, and follow me here, have a high power RFID transmitter and a high sensitivity RFID receiver, not a standard RFID scanner, and then they can bathe an area in RF energy and listen indiscriminately to all of the RFID tags in that area of whatever type whatsoever and so be able to discover the existence of all kinds of items that would be virtually undetectable upon intensive hand searching or on a wholesale scale that would otherwise require untennable amounts of inconvenience to the proletariat or an untennably large workforce.

I'm not super familiar with RFID but from what I do understand what you're talking about would require waves powerful enough I doubt the FCC would permit it - that said the FCC is a branch of the government so who knows.

Want to move from area A where your guns are legal to area B where your guns are illegal but not disclose that you're going to be retaining your contraband firearms in your area B home? Too bad. Just travelling across the border will get your entire U-Haul RFID scanned and they'll see the tags belonging to banned firearms clear as day. Those red and blue lights in your rear-views are not the colors of freedom.

I believe the RFID antenna would have to be fairly large to be detected and read at that sort of distance through that sort of interference. That said - if you were set on smuggling contraband - you'd probably find a way to block the radio signal [not terribly hard to do].

Or, they just want to keep tabs on where people with legally permitted, but only begrudgingly so, firearms are travelling, so they pepper the roadways with RFID trackers like cell phone towers. You may not have made a trip to City X, but the authorities know your handgun sure did.

I don't believe current RFID devices would work in such a manner based upon what I know about the technology.

Is it possible to adapt it so that it would work like that? Possibly - but I'm not an engineer.

That said - if I'm wrong - feel free to set me straight - I don't purport to be an expert .

 

[CathyInBlue]

Hackers have managed to read RFID chips in the wild from more than the width of a four lane rural interstate.

 

[MikeDVB]

Hackers have managed to read RFID chips in the wild from more than the width of a four lane rural interstate.

With equipment that the FCC would license under the current radiation laws/limits?

 

[Redhorse]

No offense but this is total crap. There's 300 million+ guns in the US, there's no way to control them all, lets be reasonable instead of paranoid. I can see this happening in the uk but not here.

 

[TopDog]

No offense but this is total crap. There's 300 million+ guns in the US, there's no way to control them all, lets be reasonable instead of paranoid. I can see this happening in the uk but not here.

I doubt it would happen overnight. I think it would go something like, in general like this. First they would introduce the new device in newly manufactured weapons. Next some sort of legislation would be introduced to gradually require all civilian weapons (long guns and handguns) to incorporate the new technology. If you watched the video in the link you know that the device can be installed in removable grips on handguns and I am sure something as simple for long guns. Eventually it would be illegal to own a weapon that does not have the technology incorporated either as a new manufacture or retrofitted. So yes there is a way to control them all. If it would be successful? I doubt it, not overnight. A lot of people would simply refuse to incorporate the device in older guns. But if no one stops it, years from now there would be very few guns that didn't have the device left in the hands of civilians.

 

[Dauvis]

I doubt it would happen overnight. I think it would go something like, in general like this. First they would introduce the new device in newly manufactured weapons. Next some sort of legislation would be introduced to gradually require all civilian weapons (long guns and handguns) to incorporate the new technology. If you watched the video in the link you know that the device can be installed in removable grips on handguns and I am sure something as simple for long guns. Eventually it would be illegal to own a weapon that does not have the technology incorporated either as a new manufacture or retrofitted. So yes there is a way to control them all. If it would be successful? I doubt it, not overnight. A lot of people would simply refuse to incorporate the device in older guns. But if no one stops it, years from now there would be very few guns that didn't have the device left in the hands of civilians.

Don't forget that the marketing machine will also work to turn public perception of those old guns as something that only criminals would use.