SCOTUS Strikes Down ObamaCare Individual Mandate

[manwithnoname]

How about this gem (thanks to LRC)?



Translation: It's not a tax so we can get away with taking the case...now that we have the case, it is a tax so we can uphold it.

Thank G_d we had a Republican in office to appoint this asshat...just imagine how a Kerry appointee might have voted...oh...wait.

Someday people will wake up. Until then, liberty will continue to be eroded at an ever-accelerating rate.

Well said, Sir.... though you may be more optomistic than am I on whether or not people will wake up... at least before it is too late.

 

[buckstopshere]

Does anyone here actually know how the Greek government works? Based on my very unscientific observations, it seems to be a sort of a free for all where the government asks other governments to bail them out of their problems. The last class I took on Greece was one that involved ancient mythology, you'd think the guys who invented democracy would've perfected it by now.

It's a parliamentary republic. Prime Minister is head of government. The PM and the cabinet run the country and they decide a President who has some executive authority but mostly ceremonial.

Cabinet is elected every four years.

It's a facade. They're the future of us.

 

[Lex Concord]

Back when I was 20 someone told me, "If you're not liberal by the age of 20 you have no heart. If you're not conservative by the age of 40 you have no brain.

If you're the type who generally likes to earn his own way, life has a way of beating the liberal out of you. Liberalism makes an interesting philosophy but it's not very practicable, for long. Just ask the EU.

They always leave off the last part...

"If you're not a libertarian (note the small 'l') by the time you've endured three full presidential election cycles you're not paying attention."

 

[PKendall317]

It's a parliamentary republic. Prime Minister is head of government. The PM and the cabinet run the country and they decide a President who has some executive authority but mostly ceremonial.

Cabinet is elected every four years.

It's a facade. They're the future of us.

No, they're a POSSIBLE future of us. We can still change things before we reach the level of disaster that Greece has reached. Greece has been around for thousands of years and it took them a long time to get to this point, the United States is barely 300.

 

[buckstopshere]

They always leave off the last part...

"If you're not a libertarian (note the small 'l') by the time you've endured three full presidential election cycles you're not paying attention."

QFT!

 

[Caleb]

Just great! We been sold out!

 

[.45 Dave]

1. Whether or not I stay up late is none of my Father's damn business!
2. I never said I didn't have a problem living in a country that tells other people how to spend their money, and have already said I don't agree with the government requiring people to buy health care.
3. Give me an example of which laws violated the amendments I mentioned?
4. History is one of my favorite subjects

Just a word of caution--don't get in an argument with 88GT--she'll rip you a new one, stuff it with sausage and serve it to you for breakfast!

 

[Caleb]

No, they're a POSSIBLE future of us. We can still change things before we reach the level of disaster that Greece has reached. Greece has been around for thousands of years and it took them a long time to get to this point, the United States is barely 300.

Yea, there is still time but we're going downhill faster then you leading on

 

[Lex Concord]

Well said, Sir.... though you may be more optomistic than am I on whether or not people will wake up... at least before it is too late.

I don't know that I'm optimistic, as I never alluded to timing.

Many Soviet Citizens woke up upon their arrival in the archipelago....too late, as you mentioned...i don't know that most in the states will awaken any sooner...it's possible it won't go quite that far...but there will be an awakening...even if at the final moment.

Those who haven't read Solzhenytsin's "Gulag Archipelago" should do so post haste.

 

[Tsigos]

The top 1% make $350,000/ year. Income in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Kind of hard to call that middle class.

However, I think the real difference is between the wealthy and non-wealthy. The $350k a year guy is like the middle manager who thinks he indisposable but is really just another disposable employee. He is not all that different from the middle class. He likely has nicer toys and a few less worries but would be in trouble if he lost his job.

Wealthy people generally can't spend money faster than the interest they earn and generally make the vast majority from interest on wealth and or assets. They may have zero income taxed at the income tax rate.

Be careful sighting wikipedia, not all the information on their is 100% accurate. But what would you define as middle class?

The source is the 2005 U.S. Census Bureau. Feel free to find something to disprove me but please don't simply call my support inaccurate without your own backup. At least I took the time to backup my point unlike most of the misinformation in this thread.

Everyone has a different definition of middle class and it's usually one that places themselves as being near the top of what they consider "middle class". I would not consider anyone in the top 10 or 20% of earners to be "middle class" but I would say that the vast majority of high wage earners deal with issues not all that different from the "middle class". The real difference is between the wealthy and non-wealthy. Unfortunately, the wealthy have used their money to convince the non-wealthy to argue against their own interests.

 

[Hop]

So this issue is blowing up on faceobook as much as on here but there's a lot more lefty libtards out there. I'm trying to be civil in my disagreement and I can tell that soon my "FB friends" will resort to name calling, claiming I'm a racist, blocking me, deleting me, etc... They are already calling me missinformed, some rich guy that doesn't need health insurance, claiming I have some other motivation...

Am I wrong to believe it's my responsibility to take care of my family, my bills and not the .gov?

These lefties truly have no sense of personal responsibility. Even some of the people that work in health care don't see that they themselves are part of the overall cost of healthcare.

SmileDocHill pointed out a bumper sticker a couple weeks ago that said "Health care for profit is immoral". I had to LOL at that mentality.

 

[buckstopshere]

No, they're a POSSIBLE future of us. We can still change things before we reach the level of disaster that Greece has reached. Greece has been around for thousands of years and it took them a long time to get to this point, the United States is barely 300.

Yes, it's a possible future but when I'm involved with reading, listening or talking through arguments why Romney is the answer and my vote is wasted on someone like Gary Johnson ( a true conservative with a track record of fiscal responsibility) then I have my doubts. That future is coming quick.

Greece didn't become the mess it is today overnight but it accelerated in 2000 by joining the EU. That was the game changer. Too many entitlement programs, not enough rich people to pay for those programs and boom, party is over.

We started social entitlement programs under FDR so we've been living this experiment for several decades. Our money is running out so our party is almost over as well unless we fix our economic crisis and that only happens when the .gov is shrunk and can't spend any more of our money on anything that's outside of the responsibility of the fed.

 

[Tsigos]

If you don't put your money into a retirement plants save for retirement, it gets taxed. If corporations don't reinvest profits, the profit is taxed. Now, if are rolling the dice and freeloading on the health care system by not having health insurance you get taxed.

Governments around the world will always try to find a way to squeeze an extra penny or two out of the pockets of their citizens. The only question is how much will we let them take?

So your argument is not about the healthcare law but about taxes?

 

[.45 Dave]

So this issue is blowing up on faceobook as much as on here but there's a lot more lefty libtards out there. I'm trying to be civil in my disagreement and I can tell that soon my "FB friends" will resort to name calling, claiming I'm a racist, blocking me, deleting me, etc... They are already calling me missinformed, some rich guy that doesn't need health insurance, claiming I have some other motivation...

Am I wrong to believe it's my responsibility to take care of my family, my bills and not the .gov?

These lefties truly have no sense of personal responsibility. Even some of the people that work in health care don't see that they themselves are part of the overall cost of healthcare.

SmileDocHill pointed out a bumper sticker a couple weeks ago that said "Health care for profit is immoral". I had to LOL at that mentality.

All I can say is just wait until they don't get the money they expected in their tax returns. Then suddenly they'll understand.

 

[buckstopshere]

So this issue is blowing up on faceobook as much as on here but there's a lot more lefty libtards out there. I'm trying to be civil in my disagreement and I can tell that soon my "FB friends" will resort to name calling, claiming I'm a racist, blocking me, deleting me, etc... They are already calling me missinformed, some rich guy that doesn't need health insurance, claiming I have some other motivation...

Am I wrong to believe it's my responsibility to take care of my family, my bills and not the .gov?

These lefties truly have no sense of personal responsibility. Even some of the people that work in health care don't see that they themselves are part of the overall cost of healthcare.

SmileDocHill pointed out a bumper sticker a couple weeks ago that said "Health care for profit is immoral". I had to LOL at that mentality.

Step 1, delete your Facebook account

Step 2, eat some bacon

Step 3, spend time and effort on those who actually have an open mind to the truth

 

[Tsigos]

The main differences between the Democrats and Republicans - at least at the highest levels--is that the vast majority of Democrats made their money as lawyers. The vast amount of Republicans were businessmen and businesswomen.
So you have a polar difference on the way they see the world which translates to the different way the parties govern. Lawyers do not really produce anything--hot air maybe, incomprehensible legal briefs perhaps, but they really do not produce any goods or products. Business people do. This is why, in an economy like ours, it would be better to have business people in charge. They at least understand something about how economics work.

Yeah. Business people never use lawyers. They never ask for legal advice or use a lawyer to exploit tax loopholes. The people we select to make laws and draft legislation should be inventors and producers of widgets. They are the most qualified.

 

[PKendall317]

So your argument is not about the healthcare law but about taxes?

Ok, this is going to be my last post before I call it a night. My argument against healthcare law is and always has been that the government shouldn't tell me that I have to buy a product or pay a penalty. When I said that "Governments around the world will always try to find a way to squeeze an extra penny or two out of the pockets of their citizens. The only question is how much will we let them take?" all I meant is that governments will find ways to increase their revenue.

Anyway, I enjoyed the discussion even though harsh words may have been said. If you have any questions or wish to rip on my some more, feel free to send me a private message and I'll gladly get back to you. Good night to all, I will see you in the morning.

 

[PKendall317]

Step 1, delete your Facebook account

Step 2, eat some bacon

Step 3, spend time and effort on those who you actually have an open mind to the truth

Ok I lied, this is going to by my next post.

Step 4, eat some more bacon!

 

[aikidoka]

Correct. 10th Amendment as to the states. Article I as to you.

I want a mandate of a gun, a Bible or you pay a tax of $50,000 to the CMP.

Awesome sauce!

 

[Lex Concord]

Before we condemn Roberts, we need to understand why he did this. Supposedly his writing the opinion saves us from a liberal justice writing it and screwing things up more. (if that's possible) I'm sure we'll get plenty of discussion on this going forward. I can also see flint and powder sales going up.

BS...all he had to do was vote the other way and, again, no liberal justice would have written anything but the dissent.

Edit: I missed your flint/powder statement...methinks maybe I missed some implied purple