Russia vs. Ukraine Part 2

[Michigan Slim]

F that...but one on my porch will do.

I'm not sure a pallet of cash dropped on my porch would be worth enough to pay for the damage to the porch.

 

[oze]

I'm not sure a pallet of cash dropped on my porch would be worth enough to pay for the damage to the porch.

It would create an opportunity for an interesting cost/benefit analysis. Hell, sign me up. I'll give it a go.

 

[foszoe]

I'm not sure a pallet of cash dropped on my porch would be worth enough to pay for the damage to the porch.

You must have a nice porch!

 

[smokingman]

The Times finds that "Less territory changed hands in August than in any other month of the war" and that "While Ukraine made small gains in the south, Russia took slightly more land overall, mostly in the northeast." And in total, the report says, "When both sides’ gains are added up, Russia now controls nearly 200 square miles more territory in Ukraine compared with the start of the year."

Who’s Gaining Ground in Ukraine? This Year, No One.

Although both sides have launched ambitious offensives, the front line has barely shifted. After 18 months of war, a breakthrough looks more difficult than ever.

www.nytimes.com

One Map Summarizes Status Of Ukraine War & Russia's Strategy | ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

 

[DoggyDaddy]

The Times finds that "Less territory changed hands in August than in any other month of the war" and that "While Ukraine made small gains in the south, Russia took slightly more land overall, mostly in the northeast." And in total, the report says, "When both sides’ gains are added up, Russia now controls nearly 200 square miles more territory in Ukraine compared with the start of the year."

Who’s Gaining Ground in Ukraine? This Year, No One.

Although both sides have launched ambitious offensives, the front line has barely shifted. After 18 months of war, a breakthrough looks more difficult than ever.

www.nytimes.com

One Map Summarizes Status Of Ukraine War & Russia's Strategy | ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

""Forward!" he cried from the rear
And the front rank died
The general sat and the lines on the map
Moved from side to side" -- Roger Waters

 

[erasure]

You see Boris, if we hold secure position, it create illusion that position is securely held! it is diabolical plan.

 

[smokingman]

View attachment 302265

You see Boris, if we hold secure position, it create illusion that position is securely held! it is diabolical plan.

I pointed out to those here using "thestudyofwar" a long time ago who owned it. To say it is an institute of politics and not study of anything but narrative generation is an under statement.

I can not wait for them to say "Ukraine can not win due to demographics, lack of supplies and weapons that work, we did not help enough...we must negotiate a settlement based on that strength." or something along those lines. It may take every Ukrainian dying, but eventually I believe the USA will push and push hard for a settlement and likely give Russia anything they ask for to get them to accept it. When that happens we will likely overthrow Zelenski, or let azov do it(like maiden).

I do not think anyone who understood how much Russia produced and could produce,plus the mentality of typical Russian's would have ever questioned the outcome.

They did manage to plant the seed in 3 new generations that Russia is our enemy. One day those generations will likely be called to to actually go to war with them(along with probably 1 maybe 2 new generations). Have to keep feeding the machine after all.

 

[erasure]

I pointed out to those here using "thestudyofwar" a long time ago who owned it. To say it is an institute of politics and not study of anything but narrative generation is an under statement.

I know nothing about these people except that ****-brained take, who does own them?

And I am worried that settlement will come late. After Americans are openly fighting in Ukraine and wherever else the conflict will spill. Half of our government is corrupt, the other half insane.

 

[smokingman]

I know nothing about these people except that ****-brained take, who does own them?

And I am worried that settlement will come late. After Americans are openly fighting in Ukraine and wherever else the conflict will spill. Half of our government is corrupt, the other half insane.

"explains to the American people what they need to know about their security." quote from their website found here https://www.understandingwar.org/planned-giving
Sums up the attitude of the people running it.
I think I edited my original post about them. I draw enough attention already. Best to just say look at who is on the board of directors.

 

[smokingman]

 

[JettaKnight]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/pm-orban-says-hungary-no-133055003.html

Hungary clashed with Ukraine over what it says are curbs on the rights of roughly 150,000 ethnic Hungarians to use their native tongue, especially in education, after Kyiv passed a law in 2017 restricting the use of minority languages in schools.

"They want to transform (Hungarian schools) into Ukrainian schools and if that does not work they want to close them," nationalist premier Orban said in his speech, adding that his government would fight for the rights of ethnic Hungarians in western Ukraine.

"We do not support Ukraine in any issue in the international scene until it restores the laws that guarantee the rights of Hungarians."

A lot of us aren't fans of immigrants speaking Spanish, especially in education, so should I expect different in European countries?

 

[smokingman]

A lot of us aren't fans of immigrants speaking Spanish, especially in education, so should I expect different in European countries?

It would be more like Canada outlawing English than the USA immigrants speaking Spanish comparison.

It was not just education. For example no official government document could officially be translated and presented in Russian.

No court proceedings were allowed to be conducted in Russian,and in the legal realm from 2015-current you could be facing a trial in a language you did not speak without a translator(unless you could afford your own). Something that would never be allowed to happen even in most of the third world.

 

[Ark]

Ukrainian trans fighter ‘Sarah’ Ashton-Cirillo duped into interview with Russian prankster duo, calls for Ukrainian special forces to conduct attacks on Russian propagandists, TV hosts after kill list controversy

“They do come from a grouping of people who are wanting to be slaves and want to be led.”

humanevents.com

Another article on it. Kinda hard to find, if Glenn Greenwald hadn't brought it up I probably would have missed this story.

Mask off moment for Nazi ideology in Ukraine. Apparently this war is actually about keeping the subhuman mongoloid races from the steppe out of Europe? Remarkably similar to what the Ukrainian Nazi units had to say about Russia last time around.

You know I went into this thinking that people like the Azovs were a fringe who were only being tolerated because they were willing and pretty good at actually fighting and dying in the trenches. I used to not believe they were actually representative of broader beliefs in the Ukrainian military and government. Every time one of these mask off moments happens, I believe that a little less.

 

[JettaKnight]

It would be more like Canada outlawing English than the USA immigrants speaking Spanish comparison.

It was not just education. For example no official government document could officially be translated and presented in Russian.

No court proceedings were allowed to be conducted in Russian,and in the legal realm from 2015-current you could be facing a trial in a language you did not speak without a translator(unless you could afford your own). Something that would never be allowed to happen even in most of the third world.

Russian? I thought Orban was complaining about Hungarians?

 

[smokingman]

Russian? I thought Orban was complaining about Hungarians?

True. But the same law applies to both groups.

In 2017 there were 71 Hungarian Schools in Ukraine with 16,000 enrolled students. In 2019 there were 72 secondary education Hungarian Schools in Ukraine with 13,247 students plus 26 (secondary education) schools with mixed Ukrainian language/Hungarian language education. All of then were located in Zakarpattia Oblast.

It is a bit odd on the Hungarian bit though,as the law itself says English,and all EU languages are still allowed(in print,and in official translations of documents). However, in practice Hungarian is still not allowed in printed media or official translations, likely because Hungary has not sent Ukraine weapons only humanitarian aid.

New Language Requirement Raises Concerns in Ukraine

A new legal provision on the use of the Ukrainian language, part of a broader state language law, raises concerns about protection for minority languages.

www.hrw.org

Our Ukrainian ambassador back on April 26,2023
"As the United States Ambassador, I have heard, repeatedly, from senior Hungarian officials concerns about the treatment of ethnic Hungarians in Ukraine. We take – I take – those concerns very seriously. And, more importantly, I know Hungarians, across this country, take those concerns very seriously. This is an issue that merits our attention. And it has it. In any society, laws affecting language and education have a profound impact on affected communities – and on their dignity. We recognize this, and that’s why, in virtually all of my meetings with Hungarian officials whose work touches on this issue, I tell them the United States is your friend. We are prepared to work with you to address this. Tell us how we can help resolve this issue of contention between our ally Hungary and our close partner Ukraine. If this is a serious issue, we should address it seriously and make an effort to solve it. If there is genuine political will to solve it, make no mistake, it can be solved. We remain ready to work with our Hungarian allies and Ukrainian partners to engage if it would be helpful in finding a resolution. . "

It would be better if he was not idiot though contradicting himself, and note that was 5 months ago, we must be experiencing a lack of political will.

 

[Magyars]

 

[Route 45]

British troops could deploy to Ukraine for first time to train soldiers, says Grant Shapps

Defence secretary says proposal being discussed would reduce reliance on UK and other Nato members’ bases

www.theguardian.com

 

[SEIndSAM]

 

[Hawkeye]

True. But the same law applies to both groups.

In 2017 there were 71 Hungarian Schools in Ukraine with 16,000 enrolled students. In 2019 there were 72 secondary education Hungarian Schools in Ukraine with 13,247 students plus 26 (secondary education) schools with mixed Ukrainian language/Hungarian language education. All of then were located in Zakarpattia Oblast.

It is a bit odd on the Hungarian bit though,as the law itself says English,and all EU languages are still allowed(in print,and in official translations of documents). However, in practice Hungarian is still not allowed in printed media or official translations, likely because Hungary has not sent Ukraine weapons only humanitarian aid.

New Language Requirement Raises Concerns in Ukraine

A new legal provision on the use of the Ukrainian language, part of a broader state language law, raises concerns about protection for minority languages.

www.hrw.org

Our Ukrainian ambassador back on April 26,2023
"As the United States Ambassador, I have heard, repeatedly, from senior Hungarian officials concerns about the treatment of ethnic Hungarians in Ukraine. We take – I take – those concerns very seriously. And, more importantly, I know Hungarians, across this country, take those concerns very seriously. This is an issue that merits our attention. And it has it. In any society, laws affecting language and education have a profound impact on affected communities – and on their dignity. We recognize this, and that’s why, in virtually all of my meetings with Hungarian officials whose work touches on this issue, I tell them the United States is your friend. We are prepared to work with you to address this. Tell us how we can help resolve this issue of contention between our ally Hungary and our close partner Ukraine. If this is a serious issue, we should address it seriously and make an effort to solve it. If there is genuine political will to solve it, make no mistake, it can be solved. We remain ready to work with our Hungarian allies and Ukrainian partners to engage if it would be helpful in finding a resolution. . "

It would be better if he was not idiot though contradicting himself, and note that was 5 months ago, we must be experiencing a lack of political will.

So is he complaining about Russians or Ukrainians? Two different countries, people and languages.

 

[smokingman]

So is he complaining about Russians or Ukrainians? Two different countries, people and languages.

Neither. I was complaining about the government of Ukraine making teaching or printing anything in a language other than Ukrainian illegal. Around 38% of Ukrainians do not even speak or read it. This happened in 2017,but is ongoing.

Even our ambassador to Ukraine in 2023 said " This is an issue that merits our attention. And it has it. In any society, laws affecting language and education have a profound impact on affected communities – and on their dignity. We recognize this...."

He was speaking only about the Hungarian language, but it is the same law that impacts those who speak Russian or Polish.

Criticism of Ukraine's language law justified: rights body

Ukraine's neighbors have a right to criticize a new Ukrainian law banning schools from teaching in minority languages beyond primary school level, a leading European rights watchdog said on Friday.

www.reuters.com