Profiteering Off Personal Protection

[BehindBlueI's]

When did gun owners start hating capitalism so much? If you don't like the price, don't buy it. If you don't like it, look in another direction or ignore it.

The market will bear what you are willing to pay.

Adam Smith - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Complaining is not the same as hating capitalism, no one is advocating regulations to stop the practice. Why in the world would you have to ignore it? Isn't the ability to complain and/or boycott also part of capitalism?

 

[2cool9031]

I couldn't agree more. In my opinion INGO has had it's share of profiteers for a long time now. Saturday I did a trade with a guy for a Rossi single shot rifle. I gave him $75 and 6 AK mags which I valued at $75 ...thats $12.50 a piece.
I couldn't get myself to ask for more...that's all I felt they were worth in spite of what I could have got for them.
Ammo prices have gone through the roof too. Although I did buy some 00 buck for my HD shotgun at regular prices...It doesn't seem the panic has hit there yet.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Brother, I agree with your position 100%. I have 5 kids at home (and my older 2 boys shoot with me regularly). They just got a Savage mark 2 each for christmas. Before all this nonsense, my wife and I planned in the budget for me to get an AR as next on my list.. I began shopping around and looking. The plan was to put one on layaway so by spring, it would be paid for and ready to roll. THEN all this nonsense happend. There's no possible way I can squeeze $2k from my budget right this second to go get one. I was looking for a stripped lower to build when things calm down, can't find one. Mags are gone. There is no hope left for me (at least) to get a gun that I really had my heart set on.

There is a member here that has a gun shop that said the customer will not pay more until the owner pays more. I immediately sent this member a PM about my situation asking if there's a deal that we can work out. No response. Not a 'screw you'.. not a 'can't because of the demand'... nothing. Preach here about something, then come up missing. (you know who you are.. I won't out anyone though)

Sickens me that this is what 'we' have become (gun owners and/or community)

/rant

I feel your pain. I was planning on buying my first AR next year as a birthday present to myself. I'm hoping the prices correct themselves by then. I had contemplated pulling the trigger early, before all the wells ran dry, but doing so at Christmas time is not such a good idea.

Just like a fully automatic firearm, I may just never own an AR.

 

[theweakerbrother]

I couldn't agree more. In my opinion INGO has had it's share of profiteers for a long time now. Saturday I did a trade with a guy for a Rossi single shot rifle. I gave him $75 and 6 AK mags which I valued at $75 ...thats $12.50 a piece.
I couldn't get myself to ask for more...that's all I felt they were worth in spite of what I could have got for them.
Ammo prices have gone through the roof too. Although I did buy some 00 buck for my HD shotgun at regular prices...It doesn't seem the panic has hit there yet.

Do you have anything else to trade? I, too, would like to rip you off... errr... get a good deal.

 

[theweakerbrother]

Complaining is not the same as hating capitalism, no one is advocating regulations to stop the practice. Why in the world would you have to ignore it? Isn't the ability to complain and/or boycott also part of capitalism?

Do you often complain about the things you don't hate? It is your right to complain about capitalism. It seems pretty irrational to think that you like something that you would also complain about.

Things I like: guns, Ferraris, single barrel or single malt Scotch, boobs and dead languages.

I'm not complaining about guns I don't own, Ferraris I can't afford, Scotch I've never tasted, boobs I can't grab or languages I don't understand. If I didn't, I probably didn't like those things or I am what those young hipster kids ironically call "haters" of those things.

 

[LarryC]

I am sorry, but I disagree.

First of all, the whole "community" angle your pushing is purely socialist BS. It is not my responsibility to worry about those who are unprepared. Nor, is it my problem to concern myself with those who have finally seen the light and have just started their "collection".

Now, before you get on your high horse and make some incorrect assumptions about me, I am more than happy to educate folks and give advice on firearms subjects that I know well, for free I might add. But if some slack jawed, booger eatin' moron, wants to jump into the fray without educating themselves, well, I offer zero remorse.

The fact is, in the real world, life is not fair and can be cruel, dangerous and expensive to the stupid and uninformed. I suggest asking a lot of questions, do some serious research and wear a helmet.

I have to agree. My home protection gun is a Colt Double Eagle 45 ACP handgun. It has an 8 round clip - short of having a dozen people break into my home - I am quite sure it will suffice. I do own several semi auto rifles - AK, SKS's Lar 308, Tokorov SVD 40, K31, Mausers, Enfields, M1 Garand, M1 carbine etc. and shotguns and semiauto handguns along with wheel guns so the use of my home defense weapon (and EDC) is by choice, For those who feel a SHTF situation is imminent, I seriously doubt the effectiveness of multiple 10 round mags is much worse than a couple of 30 round. As to the AR frenzy, I did buy a couple of stripped lowers, one before the shooting - and one after at normal cost. I have an LR-308, just finished it and did need a couple more mags. Ordered them from Midway at reg prices, received them yesterday. The facts are that I sincerely hope there is NO ban, if there is, I doubt it will make a whole lot of difference to the gun buying community. The manufacturers will find loopholes just like the last time (Sportster AK etc.). I sure don't blame the retailers for making reasonable profits as any ban may effect them in the short term. The ones that make a profit now can ride out the "ban" issues. The op has to think - would he sell HIS guns for what they cost him + 10% if he wasn't sure how long it would be before or if he could replace them. Supply and Demand is the rule in our capitalistic society - and I for one like it that way. I would say 90%+ of the people buying the HC magazines and AR's are doing so just to be sure they will own them after the (perceived possible) ban - not for resale. I collect firearms, and haven't sold one in several years, nor do I intend to sell any of my firearms or ammo or accessories. I am quite sure the parts to finish AR's - if you have the lower, will be plentiful in a short while regardless of whether any ban happens or not. The remainder of the parts are not and have never been classified as "firearms" and unless a major change occurs, will be just like the de-milled machine gun kits.

 

[Stickfight]

Complaining is not the same as hating capitalism

Yes it is. The fundamental basis of capitalism is the ability of people to voluntarily participate in markets. You are complaining about exactly that.

Profit is not evil.

Agreeing to sell a person something for a price they are willing to pay is not evil.

Offering goods at any price, no matter how exorbitant, to buyers voluntarily participating in a market, is not evil.

None of this is bad in any way at all.

People want AR15s. Sellers provide them. These are both good things. Both the buyers and the sellers leave happy. Why should you be able to dictate to either party how they should behave?

 

[theweakerbrother]

I have to agree. My home protection gun is a Colt Double Eagle 45 ACP handgun. It has an 8 round clip - short of having a dozen people break into my home - I am quite sure it will suffice. I do own several semi auto rifles - AK, SKS's Lar 308, Tokorov SVD 40, K31, Mausers, Enfields, M1 Garand, M1 carbine etc. and shotguns and semiauto handguns along with wheel guns so the use of my home defense weapon (and EDC) is by choice, For those who feel a SHTF situation is imminent, I seriously doubt the effectiveness of multiple 10 round mags is much worse than a couple of 30 round. As to the AR frenzy, I did buy a couple of stripped lowers, one before the shooting - and one after at normal cost. I have an LR-308, just finished it and did need a couple more mags. Ordered them from Midway at reg prices, received them yesterday. The facts are that I sincerely hope there is NO ban, if there is, I doubt it will make a whole lot of difference to the gun buying community. The manufacturers will find loopholes just like the last time (Sportster AK etc.). I sure don't blame the retailers for making reasonable profits as any ban may effect them in the short term. The ones that make a profit now can ride out the "ban" issues. The op has to think - would he sell HIS guns for what they cost him + 10% if he wasn't sure how long it would be before or if he could replace them. Supply and Demand is the rule in our capitalistic society - and I for one like it that way. I would say 90%+ of the people buying the HC magazines and AR's are doing so just to be sure they will own them after the (perceived possible) ban - not for resale. I collect firearms, and haven't sold one in several years, nor do I intend to sell any of my firearms or ammo or accessories. I am quite sure the parts to finish AR's - if you have the lower, will be plentiful in a short while regardless of whether any ban happens or not. The remainder of the parts are not and have never been classified as "firearms" and unless a major change occurs, will be just like the de-milled machine gun kits.

I thought it had an eight round magazine...

TROLLOLOLOLOLOLOL

 

[cobber]

Just a thought, if they were concerned about personal protection and needing the tool to do that, why didn't they act before?

Can the ants take care of all the grasshoppers? As much as we would like to.

How about the folks spending all the $$$ on ARs and mags take some of that energy and write to congress, join a RKBA org, etc.

Sit on the fence too long and you won't have many choices left.

 

[Liberty1911]

Ever complained about the Sheiks in the middle east jacking us on oil? Did you guys agree with that? Well someone tell me the difference?

I didn't see this point addressed, so I will.

The difference is that they conspire together to manipulate oil production and prices, i.e. OPEC.

That isn't free market capitalism and is completely different from individuals selling at market prices to willing customers in a free market.

 

[Slapstick]

This whole mess with the prices of late reminds of a quote that hangs in a Courtroom in Tippecanoe County. "Just because you have the right to do something doesn't make it the right thing to do."

(The irony is it hangs in a Courtroom where the meaning is lost on the presiding Judge.)

 

[UncleMike]

Profiteering is why I buy my stuff thru on line dealers a lot. Everyone says to "support your local gun shops", well where is the support from the local gun shops at times like this. There is none. They want the big profits regardless of who they screw. Gun shops do not do you any favors, they are in business for themselves, not for you.

To be fair......
Not all LGD's are raping the Public.
I had been planning to buy an AR platform rifle after The Holidays but when the SHTF I decided to look around before it was too late.
My local LGD sold me his last Bushmaster for the straight retail price.

 

[Colt556]

While I've complained about the insanity and have asked people to calm down and things will work out in time I have also put an AR in the Classifieds for WTT. It is an extra that I'd thought about selling before but just never got around to it. I don't feel right asking what they are selling for right now so I put a WTT ad for it. I'm not asking for $2K in trade but I'm not going to give it away either. If things are going in the 1500-2000 range right now that is their price, not what they cost 6 months ago. So if someone really wanted an AR and couldn't pay for it a trade might benefit both parties. At least that's how I try to keep my conscious clear. I trade a lot on here and try to be fair and both parties usually end up happy. If those of you worried about others not being able to afford and AR for "Personal Protection" you can sell them one of yours for what you paid for it. I doubt many of you would. I've lived through these things 3-4 times now and things will settle down, believe me. There will be new regulations I'm sure but I doubt if they outright make all the ARs out there illegal. They will make them expensive though. Look at HK 91-94 prices. Before 94 you could buy them very reasonably but now they are above $2k for a nice original 91, well that was before last week! They may make it illegal to produce rifles capable of holding more than 10rds and mags will be restricted to 10 rounds and no more collapsible or folding stocks or bayo lugs. No more importation of "Assault Rifles" or kits and mags could also be possible. I've seen it all before. Nobody knows what is going to happen and nobody knows what the best course of action is. But I do know that things will settle down and whatever happens we will adapt to it.

 

[LarryC]

I thought it had an eight round magazine...

TROLLOLOLOLOLOLOL

Yep - you are correct - old habit, I was taught gun handling, hunting and target shooting in the 1950's by my BIL (who kind of took over advising me after my father passed when I was 10 yo). He probably didn't care much about terminology. I do think he knew the correct terms as he was a Sergeant in WW2, fought through Europe, took a 30 cal round they couldn't remove at Normandy, had a Silver star and a couple of Bronze to go along with his purple heart. I really never thought I had a right to correct him about the term Clip Vs Magazine. By the way I have many "Clips" for my Garand, K31, Mosion's, and plenty of "magazines" for my LAR-308, AR, AK, SKS, and handgun Mags for my TTC, Colt, M1 Carbine (I could go on for a while). Been collecting for many years, do know the difference - just really believed most intelligent people know what is used in a Colt semi-auto handgun.

 

[04DarkShadowGT]

So what is the acceptable profit you can make when selling something?

Are those people who bought Saigas and AKs 10 years ago for $200 or less now obligated to sell them for what they paid back then? No of course not, they sell them for the current market value. Just so happens the current market value is very high.

I dont imagine any of you folks who buy a stock at the bottom will complain when you try to sell it when its higher.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Ever complained about the Sheiks in the middle east jacking us on oil? Did you guys agree with that? Well someone tell me the difference?

Surely you know the difference between a free market and cartel operated floor pricing?

I see nothing wrong with buyer and seller coming together and conducting business absent fraud or misrepresentation.

 

[bulldog]

There is nothing wrong with capitalism.However there is a problem with GREED! Whatever happened to loving your neighbor as you love yourself.I own more firearms than I can carry because I am an enthusiast. However I have friends and family with similar interests but less resources. Most ,like myself with past military experience. In times of trouble they know they can receive help from me in whatever form necessary.

 

[hornadylnl]

Selling a $10 C Products mag for $30 today is doing more to alleviate the market shortage than sitting on your stockpile and complaining about what everyone else is charging.

 

[hornadylnl]

There is nothing wrong with capitalism.However there is a problem with GREED! Whatever happened to loving your neighbor as you love yourself.I own more firearms than I can carry because I am an enthusiast. However I have friends and family with similar interests but less resources. Most ,like myself with past military experience. In times of trouble they know they can receive help from me in whatever form necessary.

Is that true with your last can of beans and your kids are hungry? You going to give it to someone else?

Seriously, those being upset about others being taken advantage of, how many of you are selling your stuff for old prices?

 

[Lucas156]

Is that true with your last can of beans and your kids are hungry? You going to give it to someone else?

Seriously, those being upset about others being taken advantage of, how many of you are selling your stuff for old prices?

None of them. Its only unfair to make a profit unless you're talking about their money.