Police Priorities: War on Drugs, or Violent Crime?

[jbombelli]

Yea, but my point was that violent crime which is related to illegal drugs is not necessarily always a result of the criminalization of those drugs. Whether a drug (heroin for example) is illegal or legal, has nothing to do with the fact that there are countless individuals who are completely consumed by it. So much so that they admittedly commit burglary, larceny, armed robbery, etc in order to fuel their addiction. Would making heroin legal suddenly eliminate this problem?

Hard to say.


When we had Prohibition, one of the things they noticed and one of the reasons it was repealed was the skyrocketing alcoholism. As soon as prohibition kicked in, people started binge drinking in private, and the rate of alcoholism began increasing, and continued increasing significantly over several years. After Prohibition was repealed, these problems decreased back down to a "normal" level.

Would that happen if all those drugs were legalized? Again, hard to say. But the historic precedent seems to suggest that it might to some extent alleviate the problem.

 

[Zoub]

I agree. Would you agree that since it is the criminalization that creates the issue, and that since LE does not create the law, the problem is that of politicians who create the laws and devise the enforcement plans and not the police officers tasked with enforcing the laws?

I think we are close to a time in history, again, where it is easy to hate the uniform and the man who wears it. Cop or Soldier.

When I was a kid I spent a lot of time kicking the asses of those who wanted to kick mine, and all just because my Dad was a "Baby Burner."

One classic fight I will never forget, kids whose parents did drugs and those who didn't. I had no interest in the fight but my best friend was at the center of it and I was the only Mil spec kid on the block, on any given day most of them wanted a piece of me. We lived in a civillian neighborhood in Los Angeles. The kids were just a reflection of the adults around them.

FYI children of peace loving non-aggressive pot smokers talk big SH** but can't fight for sh** even when the odds are stacked in their favor.

 

[rambone]

"Thou shalt not enforce a bad law."

Yup!! How can anyone argue differently? Are police supposed to be robots? I support police discretion, and full use of their conscience.

 

[4x4]

Going after violent crime wont pay for their brand new Dodge Chargers and other toys. Duhhhh.

Law enforcement agencies are a scam.

 

[TMU317]

Going after violent crime wont pay for their brand new Dodge Chargers and other toys. Duhhhh.

Law enforcement agencies are a scam.

So, Dodge Chargers are paid for by seized assets? What do you suppose should be done with law enforcement agencies, since they are a "scam"? Should we not have law enforcement agencies?

 

[4x4]

So, Dodge Chargers are paid for by seized assets? What do you suppose should be done with law enforcement agencies, since they are a "scam"? Should we not have law enforcement agencies?

We would be better off without the police. They are the biggest threat to our rights.

 

[TMU317]

We would be better off without the police. They are the biggest threat to our rights.

Who would then enforce our laws? Do the police create laws which infringe on our rights? I am not convinced that our society could function as it does without individuals dedicated to the enforcement of our laws. Also, what would one do when someone breaks into his/her house and steals all of their things while they are at work? If this were to happen to me, I certainly do not have time to track down the stolen items and search for the person who has taken them, which an IMPD detective would have time to do (and do on a daily basis) as they are paid to do such a thing. I think we would be better off without individual police officers who abuse their authority, but I am not so sure we would be better off without the police in general as they perform many functions which are beneficial to society.

 

[4x4]

Who would then enforce our laws? Do the police create laws which infringe on our rights? I am not convinced that our society could function as it does without individuals dedicated to the enforcement of our laws. Also, what would one do when someone breaks into his/her house and steals all of their things while they are at work? If this were to happen to me, I certainly do not have time to track down the stolen items and search for the person who has taken them, which an IMPD detective would have time to do (and do on a daily basis) as they are paid to do such a thing. I think we would be better off without individual police officers who abuse their authority, but I am not so sure we would be better off without the police in general as they perform many functions which are beneficial to society.

The same thing the police do, nothing.

 

[lrahm]

the effects of legalization aside... uhhhh drugs and violent crime go hand in hand. Is anyone going to dispute that?

No argument there. I could point out dozens of cases over the last 4 - 5 months to support that.

 

[lrahm]

Going after violent crime wont pay for their brand new Dodge Chargers and other toys. Duhhhh.

Law enforcement agencies are a scam.

We are a non-discriminating department. Violent crimes or drugs we take either. Someone please tell me where I can pick up my new Charger to replace my 1999 Crown Vic. My toys, I paid for.

 

[4x4]

the effects of legalization aside... uhhhh drugs and violent crime go hand in hand. Is anyone going to dispute that?

If it were legal, and you could buy it in a convenience store, nobody would be shooting each other over it.

Do people get shot over cigarettes, or Red Bull?

 

[UncleMike]

the effects of legalization aside... uhhhh drugs and violent crime go hand in hand. Is anyone going to dispute that?

No argument there. I could point out dozens of cases over the last 4 - 5 months to support that.

I worked cases back in 1972 that support that.
Some things never change.

 

[cobber]

Well... what about them? They do that now. And they get arrested and prosecuted for it. If drugs were legalized, there would I'm sure still be some that would commit crimes for their stash. And I may be going out on a limb here, but I would bet that robbery and murder would still be illegal.

The fact that some people can't hold their liquor and end up fighting and killing someone else is no reason to ban liquor.

I suspect you're right about the robbery and murder thing.

 

[radonc73]

It is a money maker and spending justifier to keep it illegal.
If you think that Lilley or Phizer couldn't make heroin cheaper and safer without the drive-bys killing innocent people you are lying to yourself., They already make heroin in 20 different pill forms under different names. Is there really that much af a difference between heroin and the oxycontin that your Dr. can prescribe for you? If there wasn't people wouldn't be stealing script pads from the Drs offices or mugging cancer patients outside of Walgreens.

 

[Bummer]

I agree. Would you agree that since it is the criminalization that creates the issue, and that since LE does not create the law, the problem is that of politicians who create the laws and devise the enforcement plans and not the police officers tasked with enforcing the laws?

I absolutely agree. Politicians created this mess, as they have so many others.

 

[Bummer]

Is the "war on drugs" referenced here only referring to marijuana? I believe the article only mentions marijuana, but what about heroin, cocaine, meth, etc? What about those who commit violent crimes such as armed robbery to fuel their addiction to heroin? Like a guy who has no income but needs cash to purchase more heroin/cocaine/meth and robs a gas station and ends up murdering the cashier? Or one who robs a guy walking to his car? Or is breaking into cars and is interrupted and murders the person who interrupts him? There are countless violent acts committed everyday by individuals searching for a means to fuel their addiction.

Why in the world should I care why someone steals Granny's social security check? That's just the excuse. I'm not interested in excuses. No drug forces anybody to murder, steal, or engage in any other violent act. Those are choices.

 

[TMU317]

Why in the world should I care why someone steals Granny's social security check? That's just the excuse. I'm not interested in excuses. No drug forces anybody to murder, steal, or engage in any other violent act. Those are choices.

Never said you should care. Actually, I don't care if you care or not. I also never said any drug forces anyone to do anything. Choices can, however, be influenced by a number of factors. People generally choose to rob and murder others for a reason. You can label that reason however you like and choose to not be interested in it but that does not mean it does not exist.

 

[rw496]

Anyone on here advocating the legalization of hard drugs like heroin, or meth has never been around people hooked on these drugs or their families. The fact that it is illegal does stop some people from trying it. Yeah, you wouldn't try heroin today if it were legal, but you are a mature adult not some 15 year-old kid under peer pressure who doesn't understand anything standing outside a gas station saying, "Hey Mr. can you buy me a hit." Once you hit heroin it's over.

 

[Bummer]

Never said you should care. Actually, I don't care if you care or not. I also never said any drug forces anyone to do anything. Choices can, however, be influenced by a number of factors. People generally choose to rob and murder others for a reason. You can label that reason however you like and choose to not be interested in it but that does not mean it does not exist.

That still doesn't make it any less an excuse.

Is not the real reason that the individual chose not to obtain the money honestly?

Ultimately, my point was that we should punish the actual crime of violence not the excuse. I never said I didn't want the miscreant punished.

 

[XMil]

Anyone on here advocating the legalization of hard drugs like heroin, or meth has never been around people hooked on these drugs or their families. The fact that it is illegal does stop some people from trying it. Yeah, you wouldn't try heroin today if it were legal, but you are a mature adult not some 15 year-old kid under peer pressure who doesn't understand anything standing outside a gas station saying, "Hey Mr. can you buy me a hit." Once you hit heroin it's over.

You realize of course, that it is easier for a kid to buy heroine than alcohol right? It is easier because it is illegal. Alcohol is sold in well-lit stores in public places with a defined set of rules about who can buy it. Illegal drugs are sold by scum-bags in dark alleys and they don't check ID's.

For the record, I have been around people addicted to hard drugs. I am just tired of it being my problem that some people are too damn stupid to control themselves.