NRA endorsed self defense liability insurance

[DRob]

Ball park price?

$150 annually.

This coverage is in addition to the $100K personal liability included in our homeowner's policy.

 

[wakproductions]

Thanks for the suggestions here. Good to know there are other options besides the NRA endorsed insurance - CCW Safe and Second Call Defense. I'll also check with State Farm, but I have the feeling that their umbrella policy is not intended for self-defense situations.

 

[VERT]

There are several options. Some are just pools of money and legal advice. Some are backed by an actual insurance policy. Off the top of my head there is also the armed citizens defense network and USCCA.

As with anything these businesses are competing. So if there is a difference in price there is probably a reason. Like any product you have to make the final decision about how much risk to assume. No different then your home owners or auto.

 

[Super Trucker]

This one looked like the best coverage for the money, Home - Firearms Legal Protection LLC to me when I was looking into this type of insurance. They even cover bail after you get arrested.

 

[VERT]

This one looked like the best coverage for the money, Home - Firearms Legal Protection LLC to me when I was looking into this type of insurance. They even cover bail after you get arrested.

That looks like a group that has a pool of money and list of attorneys. Not really an insurance policy and nothing wrong with that at all. So a person would still need to purchase liability if that is a concern or requirement.

 

[wakproductions]

I checked with my State Farm agent. He informed me that the umbrella policy will provide up to $1M in coverage for damages and legal costs in a civil suit prompted by an "unintentional act". So by unintentional, it would cover the costs of a lawsuit if someone is accidentally hurt in a self-defense situation. The umbrella policy will not cover anything related to criminal prosecution.

This was a pretty good thread. Thanks to everyone who presented other insurance options.

 

[VERT]

I checked with my State Farm agent. He informed me that the umbrella policy will provide up to $1M in coverage for damages and legal costs in a civil suit prompted by an "unintentional act". So by unintentional, it would cover the costs of a lawsuit if someone is accidentally hurt in a self-defense situation. The umbrella policy will not cover anything related to criminal prosecution.

This was a pretty good thread. Thanks to everyone who presented other insurance options.

So the answer is basically no you are not covered. Or at least the coverage is secondary. The sticking point is that shooting someone in self defense is an intentional act. You can't accidently defend yourself. The grey area is if a bystander is hit by a stray bullet or shoot through. Maybe if you damage someone's car in a parking lot. So I would say an umbrella policy is good but may or may not cover what we are talking about. I will have to ask my State Farm agent. He is a gun guy.

 

[silverspoon]

Correct me if I'm wrong but are you not immune from civil penalties/lawsuits if there are no charges filed/ it's a justified self defense shooting or you are found not guilty in the state of Indiana? Why would one need insurance for something like that? If it's found that you are guilty the civil penalties will be pointless because you will never, ever be able to pay the penalties on a inmate's salary. I can understand the need for insurance to cover the bail and lawyers fees but the other seems to be pointless. And like one of our other fine posters has pointed out, having insurance might actually play against you with the ones it counts most such as law enforcement officials and the prosecutor. But then what do I know, please see disclaimer below.

*Disclaimer* I'm not a lawyer, don't play one on TV and I didn't sleep at the Holiday Inn Express last night. Anything I have typed and posted is nothing more than conjecture and/or other opinions that mean nothing in the grand scheme of things.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Correct me if I'm wrong but are you not immune from civil penalties/lawsuits if there are no charges filed/ it's a justified self defense shooting or you are found not guilty in the state of Indiana? Why would one need insurance for something like that? If it's found that you are guilty the civil penalties will be pointless because you will never, ever be able to pay the penalties on a inmate's salary. I can understand the need for insurance to cover the bail and lawyers fees but the other seems to be pointless. And like one of our other fine posters has pointed out, having insurance might actually play against you with the ones it counts most such as law enforcement officials and the prosecutor. But then what do I know, please see disclaimer below.

*Disclaimer* I'm not a lawyer, don't play one on TV and I didn't sleep at the Holiday Inn Express last night. Anything I have typed and posted is nothing more than conjecture and/or other opinions that mean nothing in the grand scheme of things.

OJ Simpson would approve this post. He skated in his criminal trial and then got hammered in a civil suit.

 

[VERT]

The civil penalties scare me worse then the criminal prosecution. Plus who says it will be the criminal or their family filing the civil suit.

I don't buy into the having insurance hurting a person's criminal defense theory. Might as well make the argument that getting training from a reputable gun school is proof that a person is looking for a fight. That is just not how it plays out.

So far as whether or not a person needs "insurance" or to be part of group that has access to lawyers is a decision that each person has to make on their own.

 

[silverspoon]

OJ Simpson would approve this post. He skated in his criminal trial and then got hammered in a civil suit.

Big difference in the laws of Kalifornia and Indiana wouldn't you say? Has anyone actually consulted a lawyer about the liability aspect here in Indiana?

I dunno, not trying to give anyone a hard time. I'm really curious about this issue. I know nothing about it other than when the "castle doctrine" was passed here in the state part of it supposedly covered liability and the lack there of when it was determined to be a "good shoot" or whatever the catchy phrase they use now.

 

[ajeandy]

Here's what I don't get....Someone holds you at gunpoint, threatens your life, and you manage to somehow deter the subject. Let's say you shoot them. The situation gets diffused. No criminal charges are placed against you. Criminal charges are placed against the bad guy. Can the bad guy still sue you? If so how is this possible or right? Could a criminal sue you for shooting him while he's committing a crime?

 

[VERT]

Here's what I don't get....Someone holds you at gunpoint, threatens your life, and you manage to somehow deter the subject. Let's say you shoot them. The situation gets diffused. No criminal charges are placed against you. Criminal charges are placed against the bad guy. Can the bad guy still sue you? If so how is this possible or right? Could a criminal sue you for shooting him while he's committing a crime?

Question for a lawyer but I think that you have some protection from civil suits in Indiana. But I carry guns in other states besides Indiana.

 

[bwframe]

[video=youtube;q-vLClbYW10]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-vLClbYW10[/video]

 

[VERT]

Thanks! I checked out Ken's website. It appears as a loved one I can file a wrongful death lawsuit. Couple questions though. When my doped up baby mama tries to rob someone at gunpoint and gets burned down in the Chipolte parking lot can I sue the meth dealer for bad drugs? After all she was a good mother. What about lose of income? I will be out food stamps and maybe even child support payments on that other guys kids.

How does a person even sue for lost income from illegal drugs and stolen property?

Purple? You decide.

 

[bwframe]

Liberal judges and grand jury's, you know we got em. The best bet is to just avoid the metro areas?

 

[PMR]

Has anyone signed up for a policy? If so what company and why that company?

Has Guy covered this on one of his radio shows? If so what week?

I think it's a good idea but am somewhat in overload with all of the options available...

 

[VERT]

I signed up myself and my wife with Second Call Defense. $25 a month. Prior to that I carried a self defense rider on a liability policy with Lockton (NRA endorsed insurance). Lockton Risk is also the carrier for my instructors liability insurance and they are in charge of the insurance for Second Call Defense. The underwriter is Lloyds of London.

 

[bwframe]

I signed up myself and my wife with Second Call Defense. $25 a month. Prior to that I carried a self defense rider on a liability policy with Lockton (NRA endorsed insurance). Lockton Risk is also the carrier for my instructors liability insurance and they are in charge of the insurance for Second Call Defense. The underwriter is Lloyds of London.

I assume they must be associated with Lockton Affinity? The carrier for my Armscare Plus firearms policy.

An annoyance with Armscare Plus that eats at me is a couple of additional checkout fees added after calculating the premium. A 16% increase to the final bill.

 

[VERT]

Lockton is the insurance carrier. Second Call is the group that takes care of stuff prior to the insurance being allowed to pay. The payee for the insurance is Second Call Defense. A lot of what people are calling insurance is NOT insurance.

There are no additional fees with Second Call Defense that I have ever been charged. Only extra fee with my instructors insurance was a $15 underwriting fee and $5 if I pay with a credit card. But that is all clearly spelled out.