My BBurg Police interaction 10/16/09

[JcJ]

I got pulled over last evening, 50 in a 30 I have no excuse, I assumed it was a 45 zone and boy was I wrong. I pulled over immediately because I knew his lights came on for me . Had my window down with LTCH and license in hand so the officer could see them as he approached. He asked me if my address was current, I said yes Sir. He said he would be right back. He returned to my truck about 2 minutes later and thanked me and reminded me to slow down... And that was it.. I said Thank you and have a good evening Sir..

I was a little nervous because he was behind me when I pulled into the school parking lot just down the street to pick up my wife from work..because I had basically just admitted to the LEO that I was carrying. You just never know how it could go down in that situation.. But he drove on past..

Now, keep in mind I wouldn't have the same SOP for a stop on 38th St. I've been pulled over in the ghettos of Phoenix and out in the middle of an Indian reservation, very situation has an appropriately different plan for not getting into a bigger issue. In most cases I have had great LEO interactions while carrying for the last 20 years. The not so good interactions have been learning experiences, I can only think of 2 or 3 that didn't go down similarly to this.

Sometimes, you just get lucky, in this case I believe that producing the LTCH probably got me out of a ticket even though the officer never would have known I was carrying. Bburg isn't known for leniency on traffic violations..

And as usual,, YMMV, now flame away..

 

[Indecision]

That nice, my military ID doesn't even get me out of tickets. Got one driving through SD 81 in 70 at 2am. Glad it worked out better for you than it did for me, lol.

 

[VUPDblue]

According to Ayoob, you played that perfectly.

 

[Bigum1969]

I think I would've driven past the school and then doubled back. That whole school & gun=no no thing gives me the heebee jeebees. I think you were okay as long as you stayed in your car, but still...

 

[infidel]

The way I understand it, you would have been fine on the school issue because you never exited your vehicle. I know it would still freak me out a little bit though because I bet maybe 15% of cops know that law - its just not common knowledge.

Glad everything went good!

 

[finity]

The way I understand it, you would have been fine on the school issue because you never exited your vehicle. I know it would still freak me out a little bit though because I bet maybe 15% of cops know that law - its just not common knowledge.

Glad everything went good!

In this case you're right because he was picking up his wife from the school.

Generally, though, you can't just enter onto school property armed, even if you don't exit your vehicle, UNLESS you are picking up or dropping someone off. That's the ONLY exception.

 

[Walter Zoomie]

Holster sniffer.

 

[Coach]

I know a couple of the boys in blue up there in Brownsburg. They're real good people. But the night shift is out and about. I have ridden with them.

 

[WabashMX5]

In this case you're right because he was picking up his wife from the school.

Generally, though, you can't just enter onto school property armed, even if you don't exit your vehicle, UNLESS you are picking up or dropping someone off. That's the ONLY exception.

Actually, you're overstating it. The same statute that allows in-car carry on school property if you're just picking up/dropping off also authorizes carry if the school has specifically authorized you to participate in a school function or other school-authorized activity.

Thus saith Indiana law:

Sec. 1. This chapter [prohibiting school carry] does not apply to the following:

(1) A:

(A) federal;
(B) state; or
(C) local;​

law enforcement officer.

(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:

(A) a school​

; or
(B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;​

to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

(3) A person who:

(A) may legally possess a firearm; and
(B) possesses the firearm in a motor vehicle that is being operated by the person to transport another person to or from a school or a school function.​

As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.11.

(Source link here: Indiana Code 35-47-9)

In other words, if the school has asked you to be there to take part in a school-authorized activity, carrying is legal. (As I read it, that would even arguably allow a teacher to carry — which, far as I'm concerned, ain't a bad idea.)

I doubt that provision is exactly common knowledge, but it looks clear enough to me....

 

[minuteman32]

Even if it were a illegal to have your gun on/with you when you picked up the Mrs. @ a school (it's not, as posted above), hopefully you would get one of those LEO's who takes the oath seriously (ya know, "support & defend the Constitution" & all) instead of enforcing clearly unconstitutional laws. No guarantees, though.

 

[Glock Lover]

watch out for BPD they'll get ya.

 

[finity]

Actually, you're overstating it. The same statute that allows in-car carry on school property if you're just picking up/dropping off also authorizes carry if the school has specifically authorized you to participate in a school function or other school-authorized activity.

You're right, of course. I was just talking about the common folk like me. I didn't want someone to under-read it & think it was OK.

 

[Beau]

I can't believe you got a warning when going 20 over. That was pretty cool of him. I have never been so lucky. Hopefully you slow down. Next time you may not be so lucky.

 

[Shep79]

Grew up in Avon and have lived in Bburg for the last 28 years. Bburg LEO has always seemed professional. As long as respect is shown I've always had it reciprocated.

 

[infidel]

Actually, you're overstating it. The same statute that allows in-car carry on school property if you're just picking up/dropping off also authorizes carry if the school has specifically authorized you to participate in a school function or other school-authorized activity.

Thus saith Indiana law:

Originally Posted by Indiana Code 35-47-9-1. Exemptions from chapter
Sec. 1. This chapter [prohibiting school carry] does not apply to the following:

(1) A:

(A) federal;
(B) state; or
(C) local;​

law enforcement officer.

(2) A person who has been employed or <b>authorized by:

(A) a school​

</b>

; or
(B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;​

to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

(3) A person who:

(A) may legally possess a firearm; and
(B) possesses the firearm in a motor vehicle that is being operated by the person to transport another person to or from a school or a school function.​

As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.11.


(Source link here: Indiana Code 35-47-9)

In other words, if the school has asked you to be there to take part in a school-authorized activity, carrying is legal. (As I read it, that would even arguably allow a teacher to carry — which, far as I'm concerned, ain't a bad idea.)

I doubt that provision is exactly common knowledge, but it looks clear enough to me....

Whoah whoah whoah...I never knew this. *THIS IS NOT SOMETHING I WOULD CONSIDER DOING* but, say a school sent a flyer to all kids parents inviting them to a sporting event. Does this mean they could legally carry there? Obviously if you were caught you would be AT LEAST asked to leave, but I mean legally here. I suppose its all up to interpertation.

 

[Oldcoyotedream]

Well John I know the BBurg cops and I will let them know the real you so they can get your finger prints next time - LOL

 

[WabashMX5]

Whoah whoah whoah...I never knew this. *THIS IS NOT SOMETHING I WOULD CONSIDER DOING* but, say a school sent a flyer to all kids parents inviting them to a sporting event. Does this mean they could legally carry there? Obviously if you were caught you would be AT LEAST asked to leave, but I mean legally here. I suppose its all up to interpertation.

I don't think that would be enough — that's only inviting you to spectate at, not "perform or participate in," an activity. As I interpret it, think more like being school-approved to work the concession stand at athletic events; to work backstage at a music/theater event; etc.

 

[MrsGungho]

I don't think that would be enough — that's only inviting you to spectate at, not "perform or participate in," an activity. As I interpret it, think more like being school-approved to work the concession stand at athletic events; to work backstage at a music/theater event; etc.

Not that I would test it but I have a different situation. In order for my son to attend the school he is in parental involvement is mandatory. You have to sign up to follow one of three pacts, one is to attend PTO meetings on a monthly basis. So I am in the school once a month for PTO meetings. That is participating in an activity, not invited as it is mandatory for parents to be involved. so what's the consensus on that one?

 

[WabashMX5]

Not that I would test it but I have a different situation. In order for my son to attend the school he is in parental involvement is mandatory. You have to sign up to follow one of three pacts, one is to attend PTO meetings on a monthly basis. So I am in the school once a month for PTO meetings. That is participating in an activity, not invited as it is mandatory for parents to be involved. so what's the consensus on that one?

Disclaimer: I don't give legal advice online; I claim no special expertise or knowledge about this particular law; and I'm only floating these ideas out for discussion and education. Don't anyone go treating this like legal advice, because it isn't!

Interesting situation -- I'd like to hear opinions from GunLaywer and Kirk, too. For that situation, I think the problem would be whether you were "employed or authorized" to participate in a school-authorized activity. That's a pretty vague term, but to me it connotes working/volunteering FOR the school. Your PTO example is getting pretty close to the line, IMHO -- your presence is aimed at your child's academics more than the benefit of the school as an institution.

Now, to muddy up the hypothetical further, it would be even closer to the line if your PTO, in conjunction with these monthly meetings, does some school-beautification stuff like volunteer landscaping, etc....

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Wabash, as a requirement for your child, I would initially say no as she is not an employee or agent of the school.

I need to run a Westlaw search though.

All these questions would be moot if the General Assembly would just adopt my proposed exception. Less than twenty words to the IC would eliminate all of this speculation.