Militia Takes Over Wildlife Refuge In Oregon

[ArcadiaGP]

"The 2nd Amendment only protects the militia's right to bear arms."
"Hey look, a militia bearing arms."
"TERRORISTS!!!!"

 

[dusty88]

"The 2nd Amendment only protects the militia's right to bear arms."
"Hey look, a militia bearing arms."
"TERRORISTS!!!!"

good point

.... but they'll say "that's not a real militia" because government..... and we don't need anyone to protect ourselves against OUR government

 

[IndyDave1776]

good point

.... but they'll say "that's not a real militia" because government..... and we don't need anyone to protect ourselves against OUR government

I could point out that the USC defines the militia as every able-bodied adult male. Indiana's definition is similar aside from not being gender-specific.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Reports: No law enforcement on site of militia takeover in Oregon; Protesters help reporter change tire

 

[Kutnupe14]

"The 2nd Amendment only protects the militia's right to bear arms."
"Hey look, a militia bearing arms."
"TERRORISTS!!!!"

And the many have sworn to defend against foreign and domestic enemies. Where are the Oathkeepers? Where are the other militias? I'd rather have the militias in Oregon show up, tell the nutcases in the federal building "hey, you guys have stepped over the line," and ask them to leave. I think that would be the best way to remedy this tense situation, without bloodshed.

 

[dusty88]

And the many have sworn to defend against foreign and domestic enemies. Where are the Oathkeepers? Where are the other militias? I'd rather have the militias in Oregon show up, tell the nutcases in the federal building "hey, you guys have stepped over the line," and ask them to leave. I think that would be the best way to remedy this tense situation, without bloodshed.

That's a most excellent idea. That would require a lack of egotism both on the part of the protesters and the federal agents. Actually the "others" are there somewhat; they were the peaceful protesters. On the Oathkeepers website, the Oathkeepers leader and the Bundy-in-the-giftshop-leader both have videos posted about each other. They know.

And yes as I said earlier I agree that this particular group doesn't have the national or local support and made a mistake. But I don't yet consider them terrorists.

 

[tyrajam]

Starting a backfire to end an out of control wildfire on your OWN property should not be an offense under the Federal Anti Terrorism Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996. Which is why in 1996 "The Harney County District Attorney reviewed the accusation, evidence and charges, and determined that the accusations against Dwight & Steven Hammond did not warrant prosecution and dropped all the charges." Five years later, the federal government filed terrorism charges.

I lived in Oregon in the 80's and 90's. This "takover" (the building was vacant) is probably ill advised and counter productive, but if you understood the century of abuse the BLM has used in this area, you'd be pretty pissed off too. Did you knew they built fences around private water rights, ruined the land, then bought it for pennies on the dollar and removed the fences? They used these irrigation systems to flood Malheur lakes to twice their size, putting 31 ranches underwater and buying them for next to nothing, then draining the lakes. The BLM has taken almost all of the ranches bordering the refuge over except the Hammond's ranch, and they are not stopping until they get it.

These allegations are ridiculous. Arson? Did you know Hammond called the fire department before starting the fire, informing them that he was going to be performing a routine prescribed burn? If the feds are going to allege they were slaughtering deer, why were they not charged with poaching? Some of the slander against them was traced back to an IP address from a Colorado BLM office. This whole thing has been part of a federal land grab pure and simple.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Starting a backfire to end an out of control wildfire on your OWN property should not be an offense under the Federal Anti Terrorism Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996. Which is why in 1996 "The Harney County District Attorney reviewed the accusation, evidence and charges, and determined that the accusations against Dwight & Steven Hammond did not warrant prosecution and dropped all the charges." Five years later, the federal government filed terrorism charges.

I lived in Oregon in the 80's and 90's. This "takover" (the building was vacant) is probably ill advised and counter productive, but if you understood the century of abuse the BLM has used in this area, you'd be pretty pissed off too. Did you knew they built fences around private water rights, ruined the land, then bought it for pennies on the dollar and removed the fences? They used these irrigation systems to flood Malheur lakes to twice their size, putting 31 ranches underwater and buying them for next to nothing, then draining the lakes. The BLM has taken almost all of the ranches bordering the refuge over except the Hammond's ranch, and they are not stopping until they get it.

These allegations are ridiculous. Arson? Did you know Hammond called the fire department before starting the fire, informing them that he was going to be performing a routine prescribed burn? If the feds are going to allege they were slaughtering deer, why were they not charged with poaching? Some of the slander against them was traced back to an IP address from a Colorado BLM office. This whole thing has been part of a federal land grab pure and simple.

Were there firefighters in-between the two fires? If so, that's a problem.

 

[jamil]

I talked to one of the locals here who owns a ranch near Portland. I think there is a lot more to the story that we're not hearing. The feds aren't blameless.

 

[tyrajam]

Were there firefighters in-between the two fires? If so, that's a problem.

I never saw where it was shown that there were. The District Attorney who did review all of the evidence and dropped all charges must not have thought it was much to be concerned about.

 

[Black Cloud]

Full Story on What?s Going on In Oregon ? Militia Take Over Malheur National Wildlife Refuge In Protest to Hammond Family Persecution? | The Last Refuge

 

[Kutnupe14]

Full Story on What?s Going on In Oregon ? Militia Take Over Malheur National Wildlife Refuge In Protest to Hammond Family Persecution? | The Last Refuge

Anybody fact checked any of that information?

 

[Route 45]

Here's a "goodbye" video from one of the militia members:

[video=youtube;qECwsg3NUNQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qECwsg3NUNQ[/video]

I don't see how the feds can ignore the takeover of a federal facility by an armed group, even if it is a wildlife refuge out in the middle of nowhere. This may get violent.

 

[Trigger Time]

Here's a "goodbye" video from one of the militia members:

[video=youtube;qECwsg3NUNQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qECwsg3NUNQ[/video]

I don't see how the feds can ignore the takeover of a federal facility by an armed group, even if it is a wildlife refuge out in the middle of nowhere. This may get violent.

thats what I thought as well. "Might get violent".
i firmly believe the folks there will not go without a fight. They are willing to die for what they believe. The only question is how many federal lives is this place worth losing to get back? Because they aren't leaving unless they want to seeing videos like this one.
im sure they have undercovers and informants that have infiltrated these groups and know more than the average bear. For all we know and have seen in the past, undercovers could be spearheading efforts such as this to push an agenda.
Nothing is as it seems anymore.

 

[dusty88]

thats what I thought as well. "Might get violent".
i firmly believe the folks there will not go without a fight. They are willing to die for what they believe. The only question is how many federal lives is this place worth losing to get back? Because they aren't leaving unless they want to seeing videos like this one.
im sure they have undercovers and informants that have infiltrated these groups and know more than the average bear. For all we know and have seen in the past, undercovers could be spearheading efforts such as this to push an agenda.
Nothing is as it seems anymore.

My impression is that these few guys thought they had a lot more support. I think when they find out that the Oathkeepers, other militia, etc are not with them they will hopefully back down. This isn't the hill to die on.

That's why it would be doubly-unfortunate if the feds rush in. If they take their time, these guys can get feedback from others, they can perhaps settle for a minor charge of breaking into the building (not having done anything violent) and everyone goes home.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Here's a "goodbye" video from one of the militia members:

[video=youtube;qECwsg3NUNQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qECwsg3NUNQ[/video]

I don't see how the feds can ignore the takeover of a federal facility by an armed group, even if it is a wildlife refuge out in the middle of nowhere. This may get violent.

Jon Ritzheimer.... ive seen his other rants. What a loon.

 

[Trigger Time]

My impression is that these few guys thought they had a lot more support. I think when they find out that the Oathkeepers, other militia, etc are not with them they will hopefully back down. This isn't the hill to die on.

That's why it would be doubly-unfortunate if the feds rush in. If they take their time, these guys can get feedback from others, they can perhaps settle for a minor charge of breaking into the building (not having done anything violent) and everyone goes home.

They already know that oathkeepers don't support them as evidenced in the farewell video that guy made. I personaly think the Feds are behind this

 

[Kutnupe14]

Has anyone looked at the wildlife refuge federal building on google maps? It's in the middle of BFE. One way in, one way out. What idiot is running the tact plan for these guys? The feds, which im sure has, or will, restrict access to the place, can murder ALL those guys, and we'd be none the wiser.

 

[jamil]

I think this issue has two fronts. 1) a long history of clashes between the Hammonds and the feds. 2) the "militias'" involvement. The two really are fairly separate. I think some tin foil hatty folks are using this to spark some kind of revolution and it's the sideshow of the latter that obscures the former.

The underlying issue was explained to me this way. It's mostly didty tricks over land and water rights. The feds want more "cattle free" lands. They want trees and shrubs and wildlife to fill the areas which are now grazing land. They don't want federal lands leased for grazing, because grazing land is cleared by ranchers of the stuff the feds want growing there. The feds also want the Hammond's private land (12,000) acres to be added to the rest of its holdings and "preserved". The methods the feds used to acquire other rancher's land in the area, over the years was, let's just say, pragmatic. But the Hammonds are about the last of the holdouts. So, more dirty tricks.

 

[cobber]

They already know that oathkeepers don't support them as evidenced in the farewell video that guy made. I personaly think the Feds are behind this

The timing with Obama's grand plan announcement is very convenient. And they're not ISIS terrorists, or BLMers.


Seems made to order for the message that we've got to get these weapons of war out of the hands of domestic terrorists...


If they are totally doing this on their own, they're doing it the wrong way.