Man Locked Up for Crime of TB

[You'll shoot your eye out]

There's a law in most states that says you can't intentionally spread it. What's the difference?

State Criminal Statutes on HIV Transmission - TheBody.com

I was just pointing out that some deadly infectious diseases have a politically privileged status. Isn't that great?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I was just pointing out that some deadly infectious diseases have a politically privileged status. Isn't that great?

What politically privileged status does an HIV carrier have in the US?

 

[steveh_131]

MRSA? How can that be a problem?

Should people with MRSA be permanently quarantined in their homes?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Should people with MRSA be permanently quarantined in their homes?

Of course not, they should be quarantined in the homes of anarchists.

 

[Jack Burton]

Should people with MRSA be permanently quarantined in their homes?

from the early 1900s to the mid 60s tens of thousands of otherwise law abiding citizens with TB were legally confined to sanatoriums. The only reason it stopped on a large scale after then was because the disease had pretty much been eradicated by such treatment.

It is still perfectly legal to do so...

CDC - ...Provisions for State TB Prevention & Control Laws - Confinement in a Facility - TB

If MRSA, or any other disease, reaches the point where TB used to be in society then you can bet that something will be done. As a poster noted earlier, the Constitution is not a suicide pact.

 

[88GT]

What politically privileged status does an HIV carrier have in the US?

You can't deny housing to him. You can't disclose that an occupant of the home for sale or for rent had/has HIV/AIDS. And that's just what affects me and my business.

 

[steveh_131]

Of course not, they should be quarantined in the homes of anarchists.

It was a sincere question.

Trying to figure out why you draw your lines.

MRSA is becoming pretty common. Some people have recurrences for many many years. Why wouldn't you want them forcefully confined to their homes, too?

ETA: Please disregard this question. I already know what your answer will be.

 

[steveh_131]

If MRSA, or any other disease, reaches the point where TB used to be in society then you can bet that something will be done. As a poster noted earlier, the Constitution is not a suicide pact.

How many people have to be infected with MRSA before we forcefully confine all of them to their homes or 'sanitoriums'?

Or do you go by percentage of the population?

 

[Jack Burton]

How many people have to be infected with MRSA before we forcefully confine all of them to their homes or 'sanitoriums'?

Or do you go by percentage of the population?

Now, that is a good question left to the people as expressed through their representatives, wouldn't you say?

 

[rambone]

from the early 1900s to the mid 60s tens of thousands of otherwise law abiding citizens with TB were legally confined to sanatoriums. The only reason it stopped on a large scale after then was because the disease had pretty much been eradicated by such treatment.

It is still perfectly legal to do so...

Appeal to tradition is a logical fallacy. It doesn't make it the thing moral or righteous.

"We've always done it that way" is a dangerous phrase.

The USA also has a tradition of rounding up "feebleminded" and sickly people and forcibly sterilizing them. It was a way to protect the herd and cull disease -- the social engineer's highest virtue. Why not? Its legal and scientific and rooted in tradition.

Whatever helps the herd must be good.

Now, that is a good question left to the people as expressed through their representatives, wouldn't you say?

More like, "left to the judges as expressed through public health bureaucrats."

 

[steveh_131]

More like, "left to the judges as expressed through public health bureaucrats."

Exactly. Let's not fool ourselves into thinking that the idiots who are locking people up will have any accountability to 'the people'.

 

[rambone]

Let's talk about AIDS. Should we let people with AIDS walk around free? All sorts of even minor accidents could cause blood to be mixed. It's especially an issue for emergency workers.

Why do we let these sick people walk around free to infect people?

Strap them with government tracking collars! Indefinite detention! Forced medication!

Also, I support small government and rugged individualism!

 

[Jack Burton]

The USA also has a tradition of rounding up "feebleminded" and sickly people and forcibly sterilizing them. It was a way to protect the herd and cull disease -- the social engineer's highest virtue. Why not? Its legal and scientific and rooted in tradition.





More like, "left to the judges as expressed through public health bureaucrats."

Yes, because the "feeble minded" and those with infectious diseases that kill people are exactly the same thing.

The country somehow survived the experience with tuberculosis without sliding into tyranny and the average person being hustled out of his bed at midnight and disappearing. I think I have history and fact on my side. You have paranoia and emotion.

 

[Jack Burton]

Appeal to tradition is a logical fallacy. It doesn't make it the thing moral or righteous.

"We've always done it that way" is a dangerous phrase.

"

You're confusing quoting historical fact with an appeal.

If you have a solution for solving a problem such as allowing highly infectious people out int he public so that hundreds of thousands of others will die other than doing it how it was proven successful through the thousands of years past 'd like to read it. Should be entertaining at least.

 

[Jack Burton]

Exactly. Let's not fool ourselves into thinking that the idiots who are locking people up will have any accountability to 'the people'.

Did the responsible doctors and others from the 1900s to the 1960s "have any accountability to 'the people' "? If you don't know the answer then you might want to consider thinking it thru a little better before posting.

And remember... some of us here have had family members die while "locked up." If you want to claim that they were only there because of an "idiot" you might.... again.... want to reconsider before posting.

 

[Disposable Heart]

The problem I see is that some folks like to depend upon the intellect, restraint and logic of people they don't know (pure anarchy or libertarianism). Problem is, folks do not know what kind of damage they can inflict with disease or, in the example I posted, don't care. Machineguns can be stopped by their users when activated. Diseases rarely can. This is one of VERY few cases where the ideal of liberty does have pyrrhic lining.

I've NEVER depended upon the kindness of strangers... and Blanche Dubois can kiss my...

 

[rambone]

Yes, because the "feeble minded" and those with infectious diseases that kill people are exactly the same thing.

The logic is the same. The rights of the individual are removed for the good of others. Its a quintessential collectivist argument.

The country somehow survived the experience with tuberculosis without sliding into tyranny and the average person being hustled out of his bed at midnight and disappearing. I think I have history and fact on my side. You have paranoia and emotion.

Tyranny is rarely about oppressing the "average person." It is most often about picking out some unpopular minority group and stealing their rights. So the average person mostly sleeps just fine, while a small percentage of others are terrorized.

U.S. History, if you want to go there, is replete with examples. Innocent people have been oppressed over superficial reasons like race, and scientific reasons like genetics.

Always because the majority sees it as beneficial.

If you have a solution for solving a problem such as allowing highly infectious people out int he public so that hundreds of thousands of others will die other than doing it how it was proven successful through the thousands of years past 'd like to read it. Should be entertaining at least.

Listen to your logic: "allowing" people to be in public? Who are you to come up with these allowances? This is a question to ask someone who is raising livestock or playing Sim City. In a free society there is no omnipotent human-farmer; shaping society in some desirable image; who giveth and taketh away so that his herd may grow strong and prosperous.

 

[Jack Burton]

The logic is the same. The rights of the individual are removed for the good of others. Its a quintessential collectivist argument.


So the logic of locking up a mass murderer is exactly the same as locking up the "feeble minded." It's only for the "good of others." Try selling that argument to the feeble minded, cause that is all that is going to buy it.

Tyranny is rarely about oppressing the "average person." It is most often about picking out some unpopular minority group and stealing their rights. So the average person mostly sleeps just fine, while a small percentage of others are terrorized.

Are you claiming for the record that unpopular minority groups were singled out specifically for being put into TB wards? Do you have any cites that show, specifically, that TB wards were improbably fully of minorities that didn't actually have TB.

U.S. History, if you want to go there, is replete with examples. Innocent people have been oppressed over superficial reasons like race, and scientific reasons like genetics.

If you are going to use the argument that because the government did wrong in one area they cannot ever take action in any other area then we are back to selling that concept to the feeble minded.

Always because the majority sees it as beneficial.

Yeah... I think it is beneficial that me and my family are kept from having a deadly, life taking disease that another person gave us when there are alternatives.

Listen to your logic: "allowing" people to be in public?

Errr... we disallow all kinds of people to be in public. I can almost see the country jail from my yard.

Who are you to come up with these allowances?

Me? I am just a member of society. And society has the right to protect itself from dangerous people. It's called "self defense." Never thought I would have to explain that concept on INGO.

This is a question to ask someone who is raising livestock or playing Sim City. In a free society there is no omnipotent human-farmer; shaping society in some desirable image; who giveth and taketh away so that his herd may grow strong and prosperous.

You must have missed out on the past 100,000 years of history while in school. Soiciety has always, in some fashion or another, organizaed to protect itself. There have even been attempts to have your omnipotent human farmer. We now have laws and lawmakers to make them, and judges and courts to rule for and against them. And citizens who watch over the process.

..

 

[rambone]

So the logic of locking up a mass murderer is exactly the same as locking up the "feeble minded." It's only for the "good of others." Try selling that argument to the feeble minded, cause that is all that is going to buy it.

Errr... we disallow all kinds of people to be in public. I can almost see the country jail from my yard.

You are relating innocent, nonviolent, never-convicted medical patients to convicted murderers.

There are more than a few reasons this is not "exactly the same."

Tyranny is rarely about oppressing the "average person." It is most often about picking out some unpopular minority group and stealing their rights. So the average person mostly sleeps just fine, while a small percentage of others are terrorized.

Are you claiming for the record that unpopular minority groups were singled out specifically for being put into TB wards? Do you have any cites that show, specifically, that TB wards were improbably fully of minorities that didn't actually have TB.

You're arguing against claims that nobody made. I'm not going to argue against logical fallacies.

Yeah... I think it is beneficial that me and my family are kept from having a deadly, life taking disease that another person gave us when there are alternatives.

You are free to stay on private property that you feel safe on, and you are free to wear masks in public. What is not OK is turning the outside world into a prison so that you can feel risk-free and comfortable.

 

[poptab]

If by 'the process' you mean American idol sure they do.