Looking at 9/11 with actual science

[ATOMonkey]

Dear Lord,
Please tell me you don't work in engineering for a living.
You have deflection confused with strain, buckling columns transmitting forces, and strain exceeding shear strength.
Good job on the speed of a falling object and the Kinetic energy formula though.

I won't speak for the Lord, but I'll address your questions myself.

I am a design engineer for a lowly international company. We really don't know what we're doing, but we manage to muddle through it every day. Good work if you can get it.

deflection is a part of strain. Strain being deltaL/L. Stress being a function of strain, therfore, shear strength is a function of strain, mathematically speaking.

I don't know when structural members stopped transmitting force. Must have occurred since I graduated. I'll have to look that up.

BTW, do you still stand by your earlier statement that steel doesn't break?

 

[dross]

Geeky engineer fights get me all hot.

 

[ATOMonkey]

Geeky engineer fights get me all hot.

wanna come over to my place later?

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

We already got the little bastards. They killed themselves and we killed or captured 95% of planners. There's only one way you are going to kill them all. Kill only those that ATTACK us and not go after them on their turf. For every day we're on their territory and every innocent person gets injured or killed in trying to get "the bad guy", we're creating a whole new generation that WILL come after us. They don't want our technology, our politics, our government.

You've taken the propaganda. We don't create a new generation of terrorist. They create the next generation of freedom fighter.

Saying they don't want our technology, our politics, and our government is a clear misunderstanding of what they want. You see, the-religion-that-shall-not-be-named-for-fear-of-the-wrath-of-the-holy-and-all-powerful-mods is not just a religion. It is also a government system. A legal system. It's a way of life to be lived all seven days of the week, not just to the-place-that-shall-not-be-named-for-fear-of-the-wrath-of-the-holy-and-all-powerful-mods during the two hours before NFL football.

No amount of appeasement or understanding them changes what they want. In fact capitulation eases them toward their goal. They want to roll the entire world back to the caliphate. In one sense though you are correct. They don't want our technology; they don't want us to have it either. They don't want our politics; they don't want us to have them either. And verily I say unto thee they don't want our government; they don't want us to have it either.

They see this as "Crusade 2.0". Without getting into a religious discussion, what's your plan on stopping that [STRIKE]short of nuking the entire middle east[/STRIKE]?

Why take tools out of the arsenal?

OK, maybe nuking the entire Middle East is a tad extreme. How about this. Nuke Medina. Tell them the next bomb will destroy Mecca. Bad terrorist, no hajj.

It's never going to stop.

It will stop as soon as we show we have the intestinal fortitude to end it. We haven't done that yet.

Very very true. Sad, but true. I want to know that our government either made a mistake and that they will do everything in their power to make up for it (shrink government, put the power back in the hands of The People).... Or that the government let this happen for the cause of greed and selfishness and that they were wrong and are willing to go on trial for such.

Until that happens, substantial proof given for either scenario, it's going to be "Us" against "Them". IMHO of course.

People need to wake up, study the enemy, and learn the fate that awaits if we continue to use and ostrich and a sand box as our primary defense posture against the evil that awaits.

 

[shibumiseeker]

People need to wake up, study the enemy, and learn the fate that awaits if we continue to use and ostrich and a sand box as our primary defense posture against the evil that awaits.

Good one. Kill hundreds of thousands of people, most of whom just want to live their lives peacefully, just so you can kill the few bad guys who hide among them.

Or is it you just want to kill anyone sufficiently different from you?

 

[SavageEagle]

You've taken the propaganda. We don't create a new generation of terrorist. They create the next generation of freedom fighter.

...I've not taken the propaganda. Not at all. But you can't tell me that my stated reasons aren't fueling the insurgency. Sure their propaganda does it's part. But so does, simply, our presence as an occupying force alone. That doesn't even include the searches of innocent people's homes, detaining innocent people (you know it happens), and friendlies getting killed and injured either by accident or (like the blackwater case) on purpose.

Saying they don't want our technology, our politics, and our government is a clear misunderstanding of what they want. You see, the-religion-that-shall-not-be-named-for-fear-of-the-wrath-of-the-holy-and-all-powerful-mods is not just a religion. It is also a government system. A legal system. It's a way of life to be lived all seven days of the week, not just to the-place-that-shall-not-be-named-for-fear-of-the-wrath-of-the-holy-and-all-powerful-mods during the two hours before NFL football.

...No, it's not a clear misunderstanding for the very reason you stated highlighted in bold.

No amount of appeasement or understanding them changes what they want. In fact capitulation eases them toward their goal. They want to roll the entire world back to the caliphate. In one sense though you are correct. They don't want our technology; they don't want us to have it either. They don't want our politics; they don't want us to have them either. And verily I say unto thee they don't want our government; they don't want us to have it either.

...agreed. Which is why this isn't a winnable war. It never will be. And because of pure human nature and the doctrine of the-thing-which-is-banned, peace cannot be expected or accomplished.

Why take tools out of the arsenal?

OK, maybe nuking the entire Middle East is a tad extreme. How about this. Nuke Medina. Tell them the next bomb will destroy Mecca. Bad terrorist, no hajj.

...Ok, Nuke Medina. Kill thousands of innocent people and start the beginning of the end. Pakistan nukes India and invades, Russia Nukes us. We nuke russia. WW IV is fought with sticks and stones. I'd rather my kids not get vaporized or live in a post apocalyptic world if it can be helped.

It will stop as soon as we show we have the intestinal fortitude to end it. We haven't done that yet.

People need to wake up, study the enemy, and learn the fate that awaits if we continue to use and ostrich and a sand box as our primary defense posture against the evil that awaits.

I have been studying the enemy. The enemy is generation after generation just like zombies. They will not stop. They have an insatiable desire to feed. Feed on violence and death until the whole world is theirs to rule and control.

Want to bomb the crap out of the middle east? Convince Russia, China, and the EU not to go to war with the rest of the world when we drop the bomb.

Oh, and good luck with that. We can't even agree on fair trade with each other.

 

[jeremy]

Good one. Kill hundreds of thousands of people, most of whom just want to live their lives peacefully, just so you can kill the few bad guys who hide among them.

Or is it you just want to kill anyone sufficiently different from you?

Uhhh...

Were exactly are these that are desiring to live in peace at I really what to go there!!!

The Peoples of Iraq and Afghan only know violence. They will kill their own Families if they believe it will elevate their status in the Tribe and Community...

 

[dross]

wanna come over to my place later?

It's the fights that get me hot, not the geeky engineers...though the geeky girl engineers that have their hair up, and glasses, and those white science smocks that look all nerdy but underneath you know there's a killer body, and they've got that smoldering dirty girl thing that no one has ever really tapped into...if that's you, I might be over later.

 

[jeremy]

We already got the little bastards. They killed themselves and we killed or captured 95% of planners. There's only one way you are going to kill them all. Kill only those that ATTACK us and not go after them on their turf. For every day we're on their territory and every innocent person gets injured or killed in trying to get "the bad guy", we're creating a whole new generation that WILL come after us. They don't want our technology, our politics, our government.

They see this as "Crusade 2.0". Without getting into a religious discussion, what's your plan on stopping that short of nuking the entire middle east?

It's never going to stop.



Very very true. Sad, but true. I want to know that our government either made a mistake and that they will do everything in their power to make up for it (shrink government, put the power back in the hands of The People).... Or that the government let this happen for the cause of greed and selfishness and that they were wrong and are willing to go on trial for such.

Until that happens, substantial proof given for either scenario, it's going to be "Us" against "Them". IMHO of course.

SE,
You really need to read up on Guerrilla Operations and Tactics...
Might also want to read up on Asymmetrical Warfare while your at it...

2 thoughts to start with;
Stage 1 Guerrilla Ops and Terrorism go hand in hand.
Yesterdays Terrorist is Todays Guerrilla/Freedom Fighter is Tomorrows Patriot...

 

[dross]

Good one. Kill hundreds of thousands of people, most of whom just want to live their lives peacefully, just so you can kill the few bad guys who hide among them.

When you put it that way, no. Yet I'm not so sure your premise is solid. If a small group of thugs held the country, as was the case in Iraq, I can understand protecting the population. If they generally support what's going on, not so much.

Also, when the bad guys hide amongst the population, and put weapons in schools, or build schools as weapons storage as is the case with Hamas and Hezbollah against Israel, the death and destruction that rains down is on their moral chart, not ours.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Good one. Kill hundreds of thousands of people, most of whom just want to live their lives peacefully, just so you can kill the few bad guys who hide among them.

Or is it you just want to kill anyone sufficiently different from you?

have you been to iraq or afghanistan? im not slamming you if you havent, Im just asking because if you have then you got a totaly different vibe than i have when ive been there in the military and for my job. i was trying to take a dump on the side of the road in the middle of no where one time, and i had kids throwing rocks at me because i wouldnt give them any candy. WTF??? i hope it hurt like a mother trying to get all that tape off

pretty much almost everyone over there will try and kill you if they had the chance, and the ones who dont are just feeding intell to the ones who will and drawing 2 incomes.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Uhhh...

Were exactly are these that are desiring to live in peace at I really what to go there!!!

The Peoples of Iraq and Afghan only know violence. They will kill their own Families if they believe it will elevate their status in the Tribe and Community...

When you put it that way, no. Yet I'm not so sure your premise is solid. If a small group of thugs held the country, as was the case in Iraq, I can understand protecting the population. If they generally support what's going on, not so much.

Also, when the bad guys hide amongst the population, and put weapons in schools, or build schools as weapons storage as is the case with Hamas and Hezbollah against Israel, the death and destruction that rains down is on their moral chart, not ours.

have you been to iraq or afghanistan? im not slamming you if you havent, Im just asking because if you have then you got a totaly different vibe than i have when ive been there in the military and for my job. i was trying to take a dump on the side of the road in the middle of no where one time, and i had kids throwing rocks at me because i wouldnt give them any candy. WTF??? i hope it hurt like a mother trying to get all that tape off

pretty much almost everyone over there will try and kill you if they had the chance, and the ones who dont are just feeding intell to the ones who will and drawing 2 incomes.

I quote: "Nuke Medina. Tell them the next bomb will destroy Mecca."

Last I checked those cities were in Saudi Arabia. No, I haven't been to Iran or Iraq, though I have been to Saudi Arabia where Americans were for the most part treated warmly, and I've also been to and worked in crap-hole third world countries where Americans were hated in spite of the fact we were there to help.

 

[SavageEagle]

SE,
You really need to read up on Guerrilla Operations and Tactics...
Might also want to read up on Asymmetrical Warfare while your at it...

2 thoughts to start with;
Stage 1 Guerrilla Ops and Terrorism go hand in hand.
Yesterdays Terrorist is Todays Guerrilla/Freedom Fighter is Tomorrows Patriot...

Funny you mention that. I was actually reading yesterday a pre-9/11 GOT manual someone sent me in the mail.

I realize that what they're doing is GW. However, yesterday's terrorist is NOT tomorrow's Patriot. Arab terrorists aren't fighting for freedom or patriotism. They're fighting a centuries old Holy War. There's no comparison to an American revolution.

I just think that if we concentrate more on a defensive stance rather than an offensive stance, it would be easier to recognize the enemy. I mean, I could be wrong, but I stand by my assertion that the only way to stop modern day terrorism is to carpet nuke the whole arab world. That can't happen either because of retaliation by other nations, or morally standards set not by government, but God fearing people.

 

[E5RANGER375]

I quote: "Nuke Medina. Tell them the next bomb will destroy Mecca."

Last I checked those cities were in Saudi Arabia. No, I haven't been to Iran or Iraq, though I have been to Saudi Arabia where Americans were for the most part treated warmly, and I've also been to and worked in crap-hole third world countries where Americans were hated in spite of the fact we were there to help.

oh well ok then lets talk about saudi arabia. they are a bunch of haters too. the only people that were nice in saudi was the people who wanted our protection or our countries $$ or weapons. the general population does not like Americans at all. bunch of nasty mo fo's all of them. the world needs more glass parking lots. i could care less.

 

[shibumiseeker]

oh well ok then lets talk about saudi arabia. they are a bunch of haters too. the only people that were nice in saudi was the people who wanted our protection or our countries $$ or weapons. the general population does not like Americans at all. bunch of nasty mo fo's all of them. the world needs more glass parking lots. i could care less.

I see my second premise was the most likely correct one then.

 

[SavageEagle]

oh well ok then lets talk about saudi arabia. they are a bunch of haters too. the only people that were nice in saudi was the people who wanted our protection or our countries $$ or weapons. the general population does not like Americans at all. bunch of nasty mo fo's all of them. the world needs more glass parking lots. i could care less.

Can anyone recall a famous terrorist whom came from SA?????

Saudi Arabia is no different than George Soros.

 

[USMC_0311]

I mean, I could be wrong,

Can I quote you on this.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Funny you mention that. I was actually reading yesterday a pre-9/11 GOT manual someone sent me in the mail.

I realize that what they're doing is GW. However, yesterday's terrorist is NOT tomorrow's Patriot. Arab terrorists aren't fighting for freedom or patriotism. They're fighting a centuries old Holy War. There's no comparison to an American revolution.

I just think that if we concentrate more on a defensive stance rather than an offensive stance, it would be easier to recognize the enemy. I mean, I could be wrong, but I stand by my assertion that the only way to stop modern day terrorism is to carpet nuke the whole arab world. That can't happen either because of retaliation by other nations, or morally standards set not by government, but God fearing people.

well i will try to say this without the wording to get an infraction due to a certain banned subject:

if there is a certain person that could decend to earth, i think that person would say: "why the heck havent you fools nuked the middle east yet?"

 

[jeremy]

I quote: "Nuke Medina. Tell them the next bomb will destroy Mecca."

Last I checked those cities were in Saudi Arabia. No, I haven't been to Iran or Iraq, though I have been to Saudi Arabia where Americans were for the most part treated warmly, and I've also been to and worked in crap-hole third world countries where Americans were hated in spite of the fact we were there to help.

I know that is why I pointed out the specific areas...

Personally most Muslims are fairly peaceful. The caveat to that statement is people need to educate themselves on what Wahhabi are...

 

[SavageEagle]

Can I quote you on this.

Only if i can quote you on this.

Hey, if I'm wrong, call me out and show me why. I'll freely admit when I'm wrong and take my appropriate ass whoopin.