License plate scanners now deployed

[Denny347]

So why don't you go ahead and take a picture of your license plate and post it on here?

What would that prove?
"Warrant information is public knowledge and anyone can see who has one". I believe he meant to say that anyone in law enforcement...not just the general public.
I already posted the numerous USSC cases that all come to the same conclusion, that it is 100% legal for us to run your plate. All the cameras do is run the plates for wanted cars or warrants that are attached to cars. The information attached to the plates is the property of the BMV and we use it with their permission.

 

[Lucas156]

Well here is a quote from a poster under the article that I thought sounded logical.

"Identifying a license that has been entered into a data base is a plus for this system. Logging the license plates of the vehicles encountered by this system while traveling to a crime scene is an invasion of privacy."

 

[Denny347]

Well here is a quote from a poster under the article that I thought sounded logical.

"Identifying a license that has been entered into a data base is a plus for this system. Logging the license plates of the vehicles encountered by this system while traveling to a crime scene is an invasion of privacy."

Logging them would be pointless. You would be logging a plate into a database who's information is already in a database...the BMV.

 

[Lucas156]

I disagree Denny. It sounds like it is not only logging the plate but where the plate was and at what time and what location

 

[22lr]

I have mixed feelings. and . License plates can be switched so they system might not be to effective against a crook who knows what he is doing. It just costs more money, something that is in short supply right now.

 

[Denny347]

I disagree Denny. It sounds like it is not only logging the plate but where the plate was and at what time and what location

That would require GPS that is integrated into the computer system and most depts don't have the millions those systems cost. Anytime I run a plate, a driver lic, a warrant check...it is logged by the State for 6 mo and available for audit, Smaller depts get audited often to ensure compliancy but larger dept such as mine is very difficult to audit. 100,000 IDACS inquires a year makes it difficult for the state to keep track of.

 

[ocsdor]

This will just be one step closer to everyone being chipped (RFID) and tracked.

"The highway to hell is paved with good intentions."

 

[jeremy]

That would require GPS that is integrated into the computer system and most depts don't have the millions those systems cost.

That is not necessarily true. Depending how the system is configured you may not need to use an add on GPS system...

 

[Lucas156]

Didn't it state in the article that it would be able to take license plate numbers down in the area of a crime scene? Doesn't sound like that would warrant gps.

 

[Denny347]

Didn't it state in the article that it would be able to take license plate numbers down in the area of a crime scene? Doesn't sound like that would warrant gps.

You would turn it on at the crime scene and turn it off when you leave the scene so all the plates ran are from the known area. I'll just stick to running all my plates by hand while I drive. Nothing like typing on the laptop as I'm driving down the street.

 

[matthock]

That would require GPS that is integrated into the computer system and most depts don't have the millions those systems cost.

An embedded system GPS module - just the antenna and receiver, for integrating into a logging computer - costs $50. If they're already investing in the camera scanners, they can afford GPS.

 

[Denny347]

An embedded system GPS module - just the antenna and receiver, for integrating into a logging computer - costs $50. If they're already investing in the camera scanners, they can afford GPS.

If they want GPS they will want one that they can use via dispatch so they can tell who is closer to a call. Kind of a moot point since we only have 1 car with they camera and it has no form of GPS. We have no plans for more either. It is used to find stolen cars. What would we do with a GPS location to a license plate that is not wanted nor have a warrant attached to it? A location that changes by the second since most are moving. If it is a car that doesn't move much then it is one that I likely already know about since I patrol that area and make not of cars that seem to never move. Our laptops are connected to the BMV and our dispatch via a Motorola modem known as a VRM that is located in the trunk. It uses our 800 MHz radio system and the VRM acts like a radio. The problem is that it can only handle so much information through that kind of trunking system. If I ran a licnese plate, I cannot get driver iniformation at the same time. I get the registered owner's info that is on the registration but it does not run the owner's info at the same time to see the driver's license info. Our system cannot support the extra information. We get a big incident (tornado, SWAT callout, etc) and I try using my computer, the system gets so bogged that a plate return may take 20 minutes to come back. There is little to worry about.

 

[jeremy]

You would be amazed at the amount of trivial data that the Fed keeps on hand about each and every person with a SSN...

I can see where this would be a very nice tool. However after having spent some time working with various alphabets I can see how this could be twisted and abused also...

 

[jeremy]

If they want GPS they will want one that they can use via dispatch so they can tell who is closer to a call. Kind of a moot point since we only have 1 car with they camera and it has no form of GPS. We have no plans for more either. It is used to find stolen cars. What would we do with a GPS location to a license plate that is not wanted nor have a warrant attached to it? A location that changes by the second since most are moving. If it is a car that doesn't move much then it is one that I likely already know about since I patrol that area and make not of cars that seem to never move. Our laptops are connected to the BMV and our dispatch via a Motorola modem known as a VRM that is located in the trunk. It uses our 800 MHz radio system and the VRM acts like a radio. The problem is that it can only handle so much information through that kind of trunking system. If I ran a licnese plate, I cannot get driver iniformation at the same time. I get the registered owner's info that is on the registration but it does not run the owner's info at the same time to see the driver's license info. Our system cannot support the extra information. We get a big incident (tornado, SWAT callout, etc) and I try using my computer, the system gets so bogged that a plate return may take 20 minutes to come back. There is little to worry about.

Actually your radio could very well handle that kind of information across it. I work with the system yours was developed from.

 

[pftraining_in]

Warrant information is available to the general public. Warrants are public knowledge and several counties have links on their websites to check for warrants.

Posting my plate here would do what for you? Anytime I am driving around or parked in a parking lot it is on the back of my vehicle and anyone can see it.

If a warrant hit is found on a plate, or even during a personal encounter, a series of messages and confirmations must be completed for the warrant to be verified. This is a checks and balance system to stop the wrong people from being arrested, and yes there are mistakes but they are typically found before anyone is transported to jail. While I am sure that someone will come up with a relative or a friend that had this happen, they are few and far between. Every person you arrest on a warrant claims that it is a mix-up and you have the wrong person.

The typical system logs a date and time, so you would be able to search a time frame not a location. Their is no violation of your rights as again, the plate is in plain view.

 

[dburkhead]

I've seen videos and articles about this system. It's a great use of technology and unless you have something to hide, there's nothing to worry about. Now what if a system was developed to scan firearm serial numbers at ranges, shops, and gun shows, to check them against a stolen firearms database?

"If a man neglects to enforce his rights, he has only himself to blame if, after a while, the law follows his example" Oliver Wendall Holmes

It doesn't matter if I "have something to hide" or not. If one concedes to Big Brother in one area, then it becomes that much easier to allow it in another.

First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me--
and there was no one left to speak out for me.

It's the same process. Target one thing that no one thinks to defend, then another, then another. By the time people really get up in arms it's too late.

Or the "how to boil a live frog" thing. Same principle.

 

[dburkhead]

Logging them would be pointless. You would be logging a plate into a database who's information is already in a database...the BMV.

Not quite. You don't just have license plate and owner. As you say, that's already in the system. But what you also have is a location, date, and time.

So if this scanning cars license plates and putting them into the system becomes routine, you soon start building a "map" of people's movement patterns--where they go and when they go there.

And that's none of the State's business.

 

[dburkhead]

If they want GPS they will want one that they can use via dispatch so they can tell who is closer to a call. Kind of a moot point since we only have 1 car with they camera and it has no form of GPS. We have no plans for more either. It is used to find stolen cars. What would we do with a GPS location to a license plate that is not wanted nor have a warrant attached to it? A location that changes by the second since most are moving. If it is a car that doesn't move much then it is one that I likely already know about since I patrol that area and make not of cars that seem to never move. Our laptops are connected to the BMV and our dispatch via a Motorola modem known as a VRM that is located in the trunk. It uses our 800 MHz radio system and the VRM acts like a radio. The problem is that it can only handle so much information through that kind of trunking system. If I ran a licnese plate, I cannot get driver iniformation at the same time. I get the registered owner's info that is on the registration but it does not run the owner's info at the same time to see the driver's license info. Our system cannot support the extra information. We get a big incident (tornado, SWAT callout, etc) and I try using my computer, the system gets so bogged that a plate return may take 20 minutes to come back. There is little to worry about.

You've described version 1.0. Are you so sure what version 2.0, or even 1.1, will contain?

 

[CulpeperMM]

Hitler would have loved to have this technology. The current administration in the US of A must be pretty psyched about it as well. This with the traffic cameras makes for easy tracking of dissenters.

 

[Denny347]

Not quite. You don't just have license plate and owner. As you say, that's already in the system. But what you also have is a location, date, and time.

So if this scanning cars license plates and putting them into the system becomes routine, you soon start building a "map" of people's movement patterns--where they go and when they go there.

And that's none of the State's business.

That is WAY beyond our capabilities. WAY WAY WAY beyond it. We have a hard time updating our time off database and who's supposed to be working what beat on what day. Maybe NSA is doing super secret squirrel stuff but not us local guys. I would worry about what the the Feds can already do via the Patriot Act rather than worry about the "what-ifs" in technology.