Is Toyota more American than GM or Ford???

[trnsplntfrmohio]

I still don't think you can give the japs credit for having the best full size truck. Have you seen the new ford f150 torture tests? 150,000 torture test dyno miles and then drove it cross country doing missions during the trip? It's fords new ecoboost v6 in the f150.

It was amazing to watch that little turbo 6 pull a fully loaded trailer 15 seconds faster over a 0-60 mph acceleration against the dodge ram.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

I still don't think you can give the japs credit for having the best full size truck. Have you seen the new ford f150 torture tests? 150,000 torture test dyno miles and then drove it cross country doing missions during the trip? It's fords new ecoboost v6 in the f150.

It was amazing to watch that little turbo 6 pull a fully loaded trailer 15 seconds faster over a 0-60 mph acceleration against the dodge ram.

Yeah, I just wish I could afford to buy one - and then buy gas for it.

 

[dross]

Made in the USA is a myth:

I, Pencil - Leonard Read - Mises Daily

 

[$mooth]

I've had this debate with a friend who is a huge GM fan for a long time.
1st round: GM is American, Honda sucks cause they're foreign.
-His GM car was made in Australlia. Both my Honda's were made in OH.
2nd Round: well all the GM money comes back to America. Honda's money goes to Japan.
-GM reinvests money in Mexico and elsewhere. Honda keeps reinvesting in America.
3rd Round: The Engineering for GM is done in the US. That's the skills we need, not the manufacturing.
-The GM he has is Aussie. The new GM SUVs are mostly Korean designs (Daewoo). All the new Buicks are Euro designs. Yes Honda's are mostly Japanese with Acura doing a good bit in OH and Cali.
4th Round: Well All cars are global, anyway. GM's are better cause they just are.
-I think I won. =)

 

[johncarbaugh]

what cars do you build for Toyota on contract ?

We build Camey on contract.

 

[HICKMAN]

Made in the USA is a myth:

I, Pencil - Leonard Read - Mises Daily

Good read.

I quit worrying about "buying American", there is no such thing anymore.

If I had my choice, I'd buy non-Union...

 

[Arthur Dent]

Ah, a discussion near and dear to me.

My employer is a tier one supplier in the land of full size pick-up axles, front and rear. The original goal of the company was to show other American companies that it is indeed possible to build a quality product in America with union labor and make a profit. Which is exactly what they did. The co-founder and his family have become immensely wealthy since taking over a floundering GM subsidiary in the mid '90s. They turned that business around. Cleaned up the plants, updated equipment, invested in r&d, etc.

About four years ago they, senior management, led by the co-founder decided being immensely wealthy wasn't enough. We can turn a bigger profit by eliminating the US plants and sending work to Brazil and Mexico. Later to China, Poland, Thailand, India and Germany. Not just production work, engineering, too. So a big middle finger to those with "educations" who think they won't/can't be outsourced.

The company is headquartered here in the US, with a technical center (where I work) and about four remaining US plants. The Detroit forge is shut down, all but one and a half plants in Detroit are shuttered. Down from seven, I believe.

With most of the workforce being outside the US management actually decided it would be better to just use the company initials and eliminate the American part of the company name.

Here's where it all gets pretty shady, IMHO. When production was entirely US based we turned collossal profits. Admitedly that was when ever other vehicle on the road was a full size truck or suv. At that point they decided to send production outside the US. The goal was to turn an even more insane profit, while claiming that the US facilities were losing money. So we're making a profit but we're losing money? What sort of accounting magic is that?

The last couple years, with most of the production outside the US, it has been the US plants that are profitable. Profitable enough to more than make up for the international losses, so overall we're making a profit. Also international quality is sucking canal water. The international production is keeping my end of the business rocking. We're working overtime and increasing my department by 20% because we quite simply can not keep up.

Also we are switching one of our major suppliers because the co-founder had an argument with the current supplier. Now we're putting in parts that have quite literally 1/8 the life of the old supplier. Think about that the next time you see a truck or suv made by GM or Chrysler flying down the road with their "Buy American" bumper sticker. You know why they are going so fast? It's so when the drive train gives out they'll have enough momentum to coast off the freeway. Provided nothing siezes.

But at least you have Mexican/Brazillian/Chinese/Thai/German/Polish parts you can point to and be proud of in your Mexican't made truck.

 

[LEaSH]

Tried to rep you Art but i need to spread it around.

It's a good indication that many variables can contribute to the success and quality of an automotive supplier. One plant in Brazil may not match the efficiency and quality of another - and Detroit or Anderson the same.

Quality personnel are sometimes viewed as numbers on a spread sheet and dismissed as such. Some companies feel stuck with workforce they have and don't seem to have any hope to change it or improve it.

Sometimes I think that executives on the board of a GM or Ford or Chrysler don't really have the talent to be there in the first place. They're still building their resumes into their 50's.

 

[trnsplntfrmohio]

I've had this debate with a friend who is a huge GM fan for a long time.
1st round: GM is American, Honda sucks cause they're foreign.
-His GM car was made in Australlia. Both my Honda's were made in OH.
2nd Round: well all the GM money comes back to America. Honda's money goes to Japan.
-GM reinvests money in Mexico and elsewhere. Honda keeps reinvesting in America.
3rd Round: The Engineering for GM is done in the US. That's the skills we need, not the manufacturing.
-The GM he has is Aussie. The new GM SUVs are mostly Korean designs (Daewoo). All the new Buicks are Euro designs. Yes Honda's are mostly Japanese with Acura doing a good bit in OH and Cali.
4th Round: Well All cars are global, anyway. GM's are better cause they just are.
-I think I won. =)

Also remember Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mitsu and Subaru all have design studios and enginering firms here as well.

I use to work for BMW. They make the X3, X5 and X6 in Spartenburg, SC. They make them for all over the world there. BMW NA LLC employees just as many engineers, financial people and the like as GM and Chrysler do.

You gotta remember too, elsewhere in the world the Civic is a considered a family sedan and they consider the Accord a boat.

 

[HICKMAN]

About four years ago they, senior management, led by the co-founder decided being immensely wealthy wasn't enough. We can turn a bigger profit by eliminating the US plants and sending work to Brazil and Mexico. Later to China, Poland, Thailand, India and Germany. Not just production work, engineering, too. So a big middle finger to those with "educations" who think they won't/can't be outsourced.

Happened to me, 24 years IT experience, 12 years at LLY with a Bachelor's degree and they let me train my Chinese and Indian replacements.

Now I'm a contractor for the Navy, if I get outsourced from here... we're in BIG TROUBLE!

 

[$mooth]

Also remember Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mitsu and Subaru all have design studios and enginering firms here as well.

I use to work for BMW. They make the X3, X5 and X6 in Spartenburg, SC. They make them for all over the world there. BMW NA LLC employees just as many engineers, financial people and the like as GM and Chrysler do.

You gotta remember too, elsewhere in the world the Civic is a considered a family sedan and they consider the Accord a boat.

Good Call.

I consider the current Accord a boat too. I've got an '00 and '01, weighing in around 400# less and 6" shorter. Doesn't seem like much, but they drive quite differently. The Euro Accord/Acura TSX is a great size though.
Of course that doesn't stop me from having an MDX at the top of my shopping list.

 

[Armed Citizen]

I'm old school, I have a single quote I use when discussing foreign cars.
"I'm sure the men and women on the USS Arizona appreciate your Japanese car purchase" "Brought to you from the same country that brought us "Pearl Harbor". I just wish "Made In America" meant something again. Not "Assembled In America"
I could rant for hours on this subject, but I will hold off. I'm thankful for the jobs these companies created for American workers, but it just sucks that our Automotive companies cant do the same. Can you eben find an American made electronic anymore, anything???

 

[CorvetteTom]

I tried to rep you Armed Citizen but I gotta spread it around.

I evidently don't forget so easily as others. I don't reason away principles for my own benefit. It's also a laugh to see some on here throwing around build/parts percentages like they were fact. I bet many of you don't even know there was a manufacturing city in china that was renamed USA so they could use the "Made in USA" label. I will NEVER by an asian car... PERIOD!

 

[$mooth]

I bet many of you don't even know there was a manufacturing city in china that was renamed USA so they could use the "Made in USA" label. I will NEVER by an asian car... PERIOD!

Source? I see a couple in Japan and one in Russia: USA (disambiguation) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm confused, though. Do you hate all Japanese cars, Asian Cars or Foreign parent company Cars?

 

[topash]

I don't care where a product is assembled or where its parts come from, a company can only be an United States of America company if the net profits from that product are held by the company's headquarters in the United States of America and not sent elsewhere; usually to be converted to the foreign company's home monetary units.

Since that opinion will not be popular, how about another:

American is a bastardized term now used in this country for the U.S. Globally we are the United States of America; citizens of Canada and Mexico are also Americans due to being part of the North American Continent.

.

 

[Andre46996]

All I know is my Grandfathers were shot at by airplanes made by Mitsubishi not Chevrolet.

I agree with most that there is not a 100% American car company it is unfortunately a Global economy, all I know is I can not and will not drive an Import. At least Mexico and Canada never tried to kill both of my grandfathers.

 

[bman1962]

I don't care where a product is assembled or where its parts come from, a company can only be an United States of America company if the net profits from that product are held by the company's headquarters in the United States of America and not sent elsewhere; usually to be converted to the foreign company's home monetary units.

Since that opinion will not be popular, how about another:

American is a bastardized term now used in this country for the U.S. Globally we are the United States of America; citizens of Canada and Mexico are also Americans due to being part of the North American Continent.

.

Brilliant, I forgot the stock market was for American investors only.

 

[trnsplntfrmohio]

I'm old school, I have a single quote I use when discussing foreign cars.
"I'm sure the men and women on the USS Arizona appreciate your Japanese car purchase" "Brought to you from the same country that brought us "Pearl Harbor". I just wish "Made In America" meant something again. Not "Assembled In America"
I could rant for hours on this subject, but I will hold off. I'm thankful for the jobs these companies created for American workers, but it just sucks that our Automotive companies cant do the same. Can you eben find an American made electronic anymore, anything???

But aren't the boys and girls who put the "foreign" cars together here on US soil more important than the white collar good old boys club who ran GM and Chrysler into the ground by shipping labor over seas/across borders and compromising quality in the name of trying to compete with cost?

 

[trnsplntfrmohio]

I don't care where a product is assembled or where its parts come from, a company can only be an United States of America company if the net profits from that product are held by the company's headquarters in the United States of America and not sent elsewhere; usually to be converted to the foreign company's home monetary units.

Since that opinion will not be popular, how about another:

American is a bastardized term now used in this country for the U.S. Globally we are the United States of America; citizens of Canada and Mexico are also Americans due to being part of the North American Continent.

.

yeah, but the people up top, they don't care about us, money is not an object for them. The blue collar boys are the ones who need the jobs and Honda, Toyota, Subaru, Nissan and Hell even Hyaundai now are building cars on our soil, employing men and women who actually work all day, instead of sitting in a board room running your precious american company into the ground.

 

[topash]

There is no THE STOCK MARKET, but rather stock markets in the United States, Japan, United Kingdom, Hong Kong, China, Canada, India, Brazil, Germany, Australia, Switzerland, Spain, etc. with individual stock exchanges within each market, so what's your point?