Is there a DNR officer in the house..........

[samot]

Is your HK registered as a handgun? I was wondering the same thing about using an AK pistol with 8 inch barrel and this is what I found.
If it was a rifle and you put a short barrel on it it is now a short barrel rifle, if it is originally a pistol then you are ok.
By definition to be a pistol it is made to shoot with one hand. There is a lot of fine print and I have never gotten a clear answer, but IMO I would say yes, ask a CO and I'm sure you would prob get a ticket just for asking!

It IS a "Pistol" no ifs &s or buts. It is not registered to anything. But it was logged on a 4473 as a handgun. Technically its not an HK, it has just been coined HK51 by caliber and size,( &because some of the first were made from factory HK91s i think) its how the HK 9x series guns get there designation.
It IS a Factory Vector 51, made from the factory as a Pistol.

Being designed to shoot one handed ?.... It is designed to shoot one handed, However, it is much more controlable to use 2 hands just like any other pistol. 99% of people shoot pistols with 2 hands, you may train with one hand, but to be target proficient, your using 2 hands...
I agree there is alot of fine print, & getting a clear answer shouldnt be so difficult..
Im not sure you can use your 7.62x39 because it doesnt meet the case legnth specs, hell im really not sure i can use the .308

 

[kludge]

If the Indiana Supreme Court says that a pistol-grip Mossberg is a handgun (designed or adapted to be fired with one hand - whatever!) then I don't see how they can argue that the Draco or HK isn't a handgun.

Most people shoot their T/C pistol two-handed too.

7.62x39mm is a legal deer cartridge when fired in a handgun.

Bullet 0.243" or greater - Check!
Case 1.16" or longer - Check!
Barrel 4" or longer - Check!

 

[samot]

If the Indiana Supreme Court says that a pistol-grip Mossberg is a handgun (designed or adapted to fired with one hand - whatever!) then I don't see how thay can argure that the Draco or HK isn't a handgun.

Most people shoot their T/C pistol two-handed too.

7.62x39mm is a legal deer cartridge when fired in a handgun.

Bullet 0.243" or greater - Check!
Case 1.16" or longer - Check!
Barrel 4" or longer - Check!

I agree with you, however I in no way shape or form agree with the pistol grip mossberg is a handgun thing Does anyone know if Indiana is the only state that views adding a pistol grip to a 18" brl shotgun makes it a handgun?
So, is there such a thing as once a shotgun always a shotgun ?
Or can you change it from a shotgun to a pistol back to shotgun whenever you please??
I guess that would be kinda convieniant, you could take your pistol grip shotgun with you everywhere, just custom make a drop leg holster, & then when you got to the skeet range you can just switch out the pistol grip for your stock.......

 

[kludge]

link to decision --> Converted WP file rhs

The State did not present evidence on the length of the firearm. However, a firearm is considered a handgun under the statute regardless of length if such firearm is designed or adapted to be fired from one hand. Estep argues that the gun he possessed is not designed or adapted to be fired from one hand. We disagree. Although a shotgun with a normal stock is meant to be fired from the shoulder and is not a handgun, the absence of a stock and the addition of the pistol grip is an adaptation of the gun that allows it to be fired from one hand. See Ind. Code § 35-47-1-11 (1998)(“shotgun” defined as a weapon intended to be fired from the shoulder). Accordingly, a license is required to carry a pistol-gripped shotgun. The evidence is sufficient to support Estep's conviction.

IC 35-47-1-11
"Shotgun"
Sec. 11. "Shotgun" means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of ball shot or a single projectile for each single pull of the trigger.

(emphasis added)

By the Indiana Supreme Court logic ANY gun with a pistol grip (AR's anyone?) is "adapted" to be fired with one hand. (Especially is you use Brady Inc's logic of "shooting from the hip"). On that note I can conceivable fire any rifle I own with one hand. IMO, he needed a better lawyer.

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

I agree with you, however I in no way shape or form agree with the pistol grip mossberg is a handgun thing Does anyone know if Indiana is the only state that views adding a pistol grip to a 18" brl shotgun makes it a handgun?
So, is there such a thing as once a shotgun always a shotgun ?
Or can you change it from a shotgun to a pistol back to shotgun whenever you please??
I guess that would be kinda convieniant, you could take your pistol grip shotgun with you everywhere, just custom make a drop leg holster, & then when you got to the skeet range you can just switch out the pistol grip for your stock.......

As long as the over-all length of the thing stays at 26" or longer...then you can switch 'em as much as you want.

 

[minuteman32]

ya that would make too much since!!
I was under the impression you could hunt with a 458 rifle

You can use a 458 SOCOM rifle to hunt deer. That was my point, it's a "pistol caliber rifle", but I couldn't find a pistol that it is chambered in. Seems like any decent "man stopper" rounds would work for most deer.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

minuteman, as you know by now, there's is common use language, and then there is statutory language.

Of course the General Assembly can define a horse as an orange, but that does not make it so.

 

[kludge]

As long as the over-all length of the thing stays at 26" or longer...then you can switch 'em as much as you want.

Mossberg even sells them with both (certain stock numbers include the pistol grip kit).

O.F. Mossberg & Sons, Inc. - Firearms, Shotguns, Rifles, Accessories, and Precision Machining

 

[samot]

link to decision --> Converted WP file rhs





(emphasis added)

By the Indiana Supreme Court logic ANY gun with a pistol grip (AR's anyone?) is "adapted" to be fired with one hand.

So even a shotgun with a pistol grip & a stock is considered a handgun?
Or just a shotgun with pistol grip only ?
If it has a stock & a pistol grip it is still designed to be fired from the shoulder

 

[kludge]

Sorry for the confusion.

If you "carry" a pistol grip shotgun on or about your person or in your vehicle with just a pistol grip installed as far as Indiana is concerned it's a handgun, and if you are not at your dwelling or on your property, fixed place of business, moving, just bought it and are on your way back, or taking it to a place of repair you'd better have a LTCH.

If you have the shoulder stock on it while you're out and about, LTCH is not needed, it's not considered a pistol (regardless of any pistol grip).

Re: AR-15, etc., I was not stating legal precedent only my displeasure with the supreme Court ruling; sorry about the confusion.

 

[samot]

No problem, thaks for the clarification.
Tried to give you rep, but it wouldnt let me

 

[minuteman32]

minuteman, as you know by now, there's is common use language, and then there is statutory language.

Of course the General Assembly can define a horse as an orange, but that does not make it so.

I know what you mean. I long ago discovered that there is what the law says & then there is what it means. Frequently, the average person would not be able to imagine how different they are. (But most legislators are NOT your average person)

 

[hntrdav]

I think it states it clear in the regs. 4in min barrel and .243 or larger with min a case 1.16 in. So a .243 or .270 or .308 or 30-06 and so on Encore handgun with a 15 in barrel is legal. Also the usual .357 .44 revolvers as long as they has a 4 in min barrel.

 

[Clay]

Ok, here is what you need!

I was checking out “The Original Tube Gun” and at the bottom of one page was this picture w/ caption:

"Here’s a view of Kevin's Indiana deer legal pistol in 243"

For more info go here: Prototypes