Here Comes the Executive Order on Background Checks

[jamil]

Only gun owners are concerned about preserving the 2A.

I understand the sentiment. But honestly, some non-gun owners are concerned about preserving the 2A too, and deserve some credit for that. People I know who don't own guns believe people should have the right to own them, and they're not in favor of all the gun control that's been discussed after each shooting. I had a conversation with one friend who is generally pro 2A but said he didn't understand why I was so opposed to UBC. I explained the concept as I understand it and he said that made sense and now doesn't think UBC would be very effective at all.

But this thread has devolved into more an argument over choices and priorities. To most of it is one of the most important issues given the non-stop pressure from the left to add more gun control. To some of us, other issues like gay rights, teaching evolution in science class, and a less interventionist foreign policy is more important than the 2A.

As I said. The next president will likely nominate more than one SCOTUS justice. Some people want that nominee to be a 2A supporter. Some people think "social justice" is more important than the 2A. You can't have it both ways. HRC will appoint a strong anti-gun justice to the bench.

 

[rhino]

You guys! WHY???

You're not going to make a dent in that armor of self-righteousness with mere facts and logic.

 

[printcraft]

If I keep smacking my head against that wall it is sure to crack.

 

[Birds Away]

I keep doing this until the pain goes away.

 

[jamil]

You guys! WHY???

You're not going to make a dent in that armor of self-righteousness with mere facts and logic.

Self-righteous or not, is a judgement call. Logical consistency is fair game.

 

[Jwmeador]

The only thing worse than democracy is communism. Thank God for our Republic

We were founded as a republic, But in actually didn't we morph more into a democracy? and now socialism communism? Go through the 10 planks of the communist manifesto and please inform me how we are not communist? I think we should be a Republic, but i'm not even sure what to call the laws our leaders are enforcing , but i wouldn't call it a republic. I wish I could though

 

[dirtybird]

I just never understood how someone can claim to be a 2A supporter then vote for someone who is against it.

 

[Lowe0]

I just never understood how someone can claim to be a 2A supporter then vote for someone who is against it.

That, literally, is the question asked that started this entire discussion.

 

[jamil]

We were founded as a republic, But in actually didn't we morph more into a democracy? and now socialism communism? Go through the 10 planks of the communist manifesto and please inform me how we are not communist? I think we should be a Republic, but i'm not even sure what to call the laws our leaders are enforcing , but i wouldn't call it a republic. I wish I could though

I think eventually all forms of elected governments will eventually devolve into oligarchies. A few smart and powerful people will eventually dupe the masses into handing them their resources and freedoms.

 

[KG1]

I counted 4 "Good lords " in here. It might've been 5 depending on if you count the original "Good lord" and "Good lord x 2" as 3 "Good lords"

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

This is......entertaining.

 

[dirtybird]

That, literally, is the question asked that started this entire discussion.

So in your opinion, what's your reasoning for supporting a candidate so openly against the 2A? If she were against the 1st, would you have the same acceptance?

 

[printcraft]

I counted 4 "Good lords " in here. It might've been 5 depending on if you count the original "Good lord" and "Good lord x 2" as 3 "Good lords"

Good Lord[SUP]3[/SUP]

 

[Birds Away]

I just never understood how someone can claim to be a 2A supporter then vote for someone who is against it.

Based on what I have been able to take from his posts. The 2A is well down the list of his most important issues. He wants someone who will support gay rights and someone who will oppress Christians and deny them their rights. Oh, yes, and he seems to be very concerned about evolution being taught in school which, last I checked, is in fact still being taught.

 

[Lowe0]

So in your opinion, what's your reasoning for supporting a candidate so openly against the 2A? If she were against the 1st, would you have the same acceptance?

Already answered. The 2A is important, but not the most important thing on my mind when voting.

 

[jamil]

Based on what I have been able to take from his posts. The 2A is well down the list of his most important issues. He wants someone who will support gay rights and someone who will oppress Christians and deny them their rights. Oh, yes, and he seems to be very concerned about evolution being taught in school which, last I checked, is in fact still being taught.

You forgot foreign meddling. Not that Hillary won't drag her track marks all over the ME desert.

 

[Jwmeador]

I have more sympathy with your viewpoint than some of the other folks here. IOW, I'm no longer fond of our foreign entanglements and overall, I don't think the Republican party is any better for us than the Democratic party. I have some strong fear of Hillary Clinton, but I'll admit it's difficult to prove her deception to everyone's satisfaction, so I don't true to persuade anyone on that issue.

What I will suggest though is that you give gun rights a higher status when using your vote.

There are 2 reasons why.

First, how many other things are really influenced by which politicians get elected? Overall both parties continue to order more military action. Both parties spend more money and increase the size of government. Both parties are largely effected by lobbyists such as bank and trial lawyer lobbies. One party may have spoke more in favor of gay marriage, but it was clear it was always going to be a court and state issue. All that rhetoric on either side was wasted. The same is true for the drug war (lots of rhetoric, both sides beholden to a few beneficiaries). Gun laws are different. While a few Democrats favor our gun rights, the ones we are discussing here don't. Hillary has declared the NRA her greatest enemy.

Secondly, there is that really, really real reason for the second amendment. It's one responsibility we as citizens can still help hold up in this republic. I know that doesn't need to be said in THIS forum but you know there are plenty of citizens who think the idea that Americans need to be armed "in case" their government acts up is crazy. Those people apparently have already forgotten Stalin, Pol Pot, Hitler, and never considered our government's behavior at Waco and Ruby Ridge.

I think we are brewing a dangerous recipe if we elect the wrong people this year. We have some conservatives calling for more scrutiny of Muslims. If such a thing happens, the regulations won't be written against "muslims". They'll be written to give the government more power of surveillance, detention, etc. Add to that recipe the DHS description of the type of people who are most dangerous (gun owners, Ron Paul fans, veterans, those who stock emergency supplies) and that finally top it off with Hillary Clinton. What you may get 3 years from now is strict surveillance of an NRA meeting or your local shooting group that uses the wrong keyword on social media.

Gun rights are not my only important issue; they are however the only issue where I can politically make a difference.

Agreed. They are masters at giving you the illusion of voting for 2 sides while they ram more freedom robbing legislation down our throats by the day. People need to wake up a see what is going on or we won't be able to get our country back ever again.

 

[Birds Away]

You forgot foreign meddling. Not that Hillary won't drag her track marks all over the ME desert.

Oops, my bad. I forgot the rebirth of the America Firsters.

 

[dirtybird]

Based on what I have been able to take from his posts. The 2A is well down the list of his most important issues. He wants someone who will support gay rights and someone who will oppress Christians and deny them their rights. Oh, yes, and he seems to be very concerned about evolution being taught in school which, last I checked, is in fact still being taught.

I was in high school when George w. Was president and evolution was taught. I don't think the president will have much impact on that. I'll start worrying about climate change when the potus stops burning thousands of gallons of jet fuel to play golf, my suv burns less than that during my entire lifetime. If Christianity is such a concern you'd rationalize voting away rights to keep a Christian out of office I'd suggest a foreign land that has neither Christians or a constitution... and gay marriage is way down the list of things to focus on...we have a whole mess of liberal policies to fix before we're bored enough to attempt abolishing gay marriage.

 

[Lowe0]

I was in high school when George w. Was president and evolution was taught. I don't think the president will have much impact on that. I'll start worrying about climate change when the potus stops burning thousands of gallons of jet fuel to play golf, my suv burns less than that during my entire lifetime. If Christianity is such a concern you'd rationalize voting away rights to keep a Christian out of office I'd suggest a foreign land that has neither Christians or a constitution... and gay marriage is way down the list of things to focus on...we have a whole mess of liberal policies to fix before we're bored enough to attempt abolishing gay marriage.

I don't have a problem voting for Christians; I've been voting for them my entire adult life. As long as they keep church and state separate, I'm fine with it.