Guidance required I'm about to install a new furnace and A/C unit

[A_Brit_In_Indy]

OK folks I have a question, this year I am going to replace my spluttering, wheezy, barely any heat or cold Furnace & A/C system.
My question is this, heat pump or no heat pump? My house is a tri-level 1800 sq ft with the living room being in the basement, the kitchen is ground level and the bedrooms are up one.
Has anyone recently had a new unit installed, what make and what kind of $$$ roughly.
I'm thinking about buying the best system I can, and having someone install that for me, does anyone know someone who does this in the Greenwood area??

Thank you for any assistance you can give, it'll be most appreciated.

 

[Harleyrider_50]

AIN't a HVAC dude.......but gonna need 1,.........


If ya got access to natural gas.......at'd be my avenue.......heatpumps......SUK........

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

If I had natural gas service available, I'd definitely go natural gas heat with central A/C. If you're all electric or LP is your only other fuel choice, if you can afford it, I'd go geothermal. The latter was my choice. I had to replace my main on a couple of seasons ago and at that time, LP just wasn't enough cheaper to justify an LP or hybrid LP/Heat Pump system. The geothermal cost is a pretty big pill to swallow but the 30% tax credit brought the installed price down to the equivalent of a hybrid system.

Go natural gas, if you can.

 

[BuckCreek]

We replaced our old gas forced air furnace and central air with a Geothermal furnace. It has been phenomenal! We absolutely love it. It was more upfront than a standard gas furnace or heat pump, but well worth it and the savings will pay for it over it's life. We went with a WaterFurnace brand ( WaterFurnace - Smarter from the Ground Up? ) and had it installed by Precision Comfort Systems ( Precision Comfort Systems : Precision Comfort Systems ). They did an excellent job and were very professional.

Our old furnace was probably 60-70ish % efficient when new, the Waterfurnace is 400-500% efficient. So you figure your most efficient gas furnace now days is in the upper 90% range the geothermal is 4 to 5 times more efficient than that even.

With gas forced air you usually notice the couple degrees it drops before the furnace kicks on, then it gets a couple degrees too warm before it shuts off. My wife always hated that. I was raised with a gas furnace so I didn't notice it until after we had the geothermal. The geothermal we have keeps the house a constant temp, you don't notice the kick on and off differences because there are none to speak of unless it is recovering to a higher or lower temp on your schedule.

I could go on, but suffice to say we love it.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I used this spreadsheet to help estimate relative heating costs.

http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/heatcalc.xls

 

[338sniper]

I do HVAC and would be happy to talk with you about it. What do you currently have?

OK folks I have a question, this year I am going to replace my spluttering, wheezy, barely any heat or cold Furnace & A/C system.
My question is this, heat pump or no heat pump? My house is a tri-level 1800 sq ft with the living room being in the basement, the kitchen is ground level and the bedrooms are up one.
Has anyone recently had a new unit installed, what make and what kind of $$$ roughly.
I'm thinking about buying the best system I can, and having someone install that for me, does anyone know someone who does this in the Greenwood area??

Thank you for any assistance you can give, it'll be most appreciated.

 

[Joe G]

We replaced our old gas forced air furnace and central air with a Geothermal furnace. It has been phenomenal! We absolutely love it. It was more upfront than a standard gas furnace or heat pump, but well worth it and the savings will pay for it over it's life. We went with a WaterFurnace brand ( WaterFurnace - Smarter from the Ground Up? )

Our old furnace was probably 60-70ish % efficient when new, the Waterfurnace is 400-500% efficient. So you figure your most efficient gas furnace now days is in the upper 90% range the geothermal is 4 to 5 times more efficient than that even.

With gas forced air you usually notice the couple degrees it drops before the furnace kicks on, then it gets a couple degrees too warm before it shuts off. My wife always hated that. I was raised with a gas furnace so I didn't notice it until after we had the geothermal. The geothermal we have keeps the house a constant temp, you don't notice the kick on and off differences because there are none to speak of unless it is recovering to a higher or lower temp on your schedule.

I could go on, but suffice to say we love it.

Agree 100%.

Built new house last year (over 3000 sqft single level with same size unfinished basement) and upgraded to the geothermal (same Waterfurnace as you) due to the overall efficiency. We knew we would be in this house for a long time, so it was an investment that is paying for itself immediately.

Wife can keep it cool in the summer and didn't have an electric bill over $100/mo. Until the extreme cold, the heat was the same way. Properly sized is the key. Haven't had to kick on the aux electric heat yet and the bills are still under $180/mo - and the wife is home all day so she keeps it warm. Neighbors, who have a new house of approx the same size, have heating and AC bills that are at least double what ours have been.

 

[hoosierdoc]

I used this spreadsheet to help estimate relative heating costs.

http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/heatcalc.xls

I avoid any .gov application to tell me what to do. Don't trust that there isn't hidden agendas in the output.

 

[Trigger Time]

There's a place up north that sells new scratch and dent furnaces and fan units Ect. Also all the wiring and line kits. Will save you thousands if you have someone who understands what your looking at and you install it yourself properly. Sorry but I can't remember the places name. They do have a website.

 

[sig-guy]

First off, ignore the people who say HP's don't work properly in IN.

Second, forget buying the equipment and having someone install it for you. This always ends badly.

Third and most important, any brand which is sized, installed and set-up to operate with-in the manufactures specifications will outlast any brand installed improperly by a Hack.

So in the end, locate the best installer/service tech you can find and have them install the equipment they sell, install and service.

With a tri-level home, I would recommend you purchase a system with a variable speed blower. They operate cheaper and you can run the blower 24/7 to help even out the temps throughout the home. I would also recommend a media filter (4-5" thick) to keep the system clean and operating at its peak efficiency. New lines for the refrigerant system...

You can e-mail me the quotes, if you would like a second opinion.

 

[338sniper]

There's a place up north that sells new scratch and dent furnaces and fan units Ect. Also all the wiring and line kits. Will save you thousands if you have someone who understands what your looking at and you install it yourself properly. Sorry but I can't remember the places name. They do have a website.

DO NOT BUY SCRATCH AND DENT EQUIPMENT!!! Most of the time it does not come with a warranty

 

[churchmouse]

OK folks I have a question, this year I am going to replace my spluttering, wheezy, barely any heat or cold Furnace & A/C system.
My question is this, heat pump or no heat pump? My house is a tri-level 1800 sq ft with the living room being in the basement, the kitchen is ground level and the bedrooms are up one.
Has anyone recently had a new unit installed, what make and what kind of $$$ roughly.
I'm thinking about buying the best system I can, and having someone install that for me, does anyone know someone who does this in the Greenwood area??

Thank you for any assistance you can give, it'll be most appreciated.

We do installs. Have done more than a few for ingo members.

PM me and we can see what you needs are.

No heat pump. You will not like it.....

 

[Leo]

No heat pump. You will not like it.....

That is a true statement. I replaced an old school standing pilot gas unit with a big, really expensive heat pump. It was very troublesome and VERY expensive to operate. In real cold weather, it really does not make much heat so the back up electric coils are on all the time. The house was always cold. It broke down alot. EXPENSIVE repairs. Every time they take the freon out and recharge the unit to change the valve, it costs about what a normal furnace can heat your house all winter for.

All in all, the heat pump system was a bad experience, and poor investment. Do you know what a used one is worth? You have to pay a man to uninstall it to throw it away. I had that money disposal removed and had a nice modern efficient gas furnace and A/C installed. Cheaper to operate, dependable. I never saw the furnace man again.

In the south it is generally a mild in the winter. Heat pumps seem to do pretty well there. In Indiana, my experience is that a quality modern conventional gas furnace and A/C unit is the way to go. Mine is set up so the blower runs all the time at a very slow speed and cranks up when there is a demand for heat (or A/C) It keeps the house even temperature and comfortable.

 

[sig-guy]

It's funny how I'm further north then both of the posters in the last two posts and HP's are working great up here.

 

[Harleyrider_50]

It's funny how I'm further north then both of the posters in the last two posts and HP's are working great up here.

.......IF.......I could tap-in ta Natgas......I'd be switch'n............UNfortunately.....it's all along the Hwy (31) this place is off of.....but cain't get it TO the house....cain' t cross,go under the RR.....

WORSE case about'em is......at's you air condition'n as well.....so when it takes a shizz (like THIS'n has.....)......ya got no air condition'n, neither.....

......Dunno whut direction i'll go yet.....H/P replacement's xpensive.....an' jus' replace'n the fail'd compressor.....ta me.....is jus' throw'n good $$ at'a piece junk at's 17 yrs old anyways......yeah.......it'a GOODman......(POS....)

Warmth of the NatGas setup, and the low-cost of the fuel......it'a no-brainer.....

 

[churchmouse]

It's funny how I'm further north then both of the posters in the last two posts and HP's are working great up here.

If you have a tight, well insulated, well designed and sized duct work home then a Heat pump might be for you. If not, you will not like it.
They run twice the operating hours as a standard A/C condenser so they will not live as long.
In the end unless you have the house I described you will save no real money and not be as comfortable.
I have been in the HVAC-R trades for longer than most ingo members have been sucking air. I cringe every time we put in a pump as it will cause us grief at some level. And yes, we put them in correctly.
If you have one and it works for you......Wonderful.

 

[Trigger Time]

DO NOT BUY SCRATCH AND DENT EQUIPMENT!!! Most of the time it does not come with a warranty

Many of them are just "last years model". We saved thousands. For the price
we have in ours I could buy and install several more of those units and I'd still be below the cost of paying a company their jacked up price an installation for just 1 unit. I don't give a crap about a warranty. To each their own.

 

[cosermann]

Can the geothermal units be run with a reasonably sized generator, say 5500 watts, in the event of mains power failure?

 

[churchmouse]

Can the geothermal units be run with a reasonably sized generator, say 5500 watts, in the event of mains power failure?

Remember you have to get a total amp draw on the equipment and size the genny to the work. 5500 may or may not run your specific unit. A Geo has a loop pump, compressor, blower motor and possibly (depending on conditions) heat stripes.
Get the rated FLF amps from the rating plate....do the watts to amps conversion and give your self 25% over the answer when you size the genny.
I have 2 5HP Honda gennys that have a rating of 3,800 watts. That is peak wattage and not continuous delivered wattage. Continuous is 2,900 or aprox. 25% less than peak.

 

[cosermann]

I know. Just wondering if any of the HVAC guys on the forum know the typical draw of these units.

No way my 5500 (continuous) would run my old heat pump. Not sure how much more "efficient" the new geos are.