Glock...sig....h&k

[ZX-14R]

So you're saying that shooting instructors have no sense of style?

Nope, I am saying shooting instructors like guns that work

 

[blamecharles]

Steyr are my favorite pistol brands. Also note witness and tanfoglio clones like the armalite pistol are great also.

Those are CZ clones.

 

[SubUrbanCamo317]

Nope, I am saying shooting instructors like guns that work

Function > Form........

 

[ZX-14R]

Function > Form........

 

[ncthorn]

I still have yet to find a reason to pick a USP over a glock, at least that justifies the price difference.
The USP has:
-bigger grip I wouldn't say so much bigger, as different shaped. If you are talking about length of the grip, this is fairly negligible and really depends on the models you are referencing.
-lower mag capacity The G19 and USPf both come with 15 round magazines and both have higher capacity options available.
-higher bore axis This is true, but from shooting both didn't seem to make a difference. HK recoil spring factoring in here perhaps?
-old (out of date??) DA /SA trigger system unless you search for/upgrade to the LEM trigger kit, This tends to be a matter of preference. I've primarily used the DA/SA setup myself and find it to be okay for me. Also, the USP can be carried "cocked and locked" which negates some of the negatives of a DA/SA.
-different mag release set up than virtually every other semi-auto made True, but many who use it tend to prefer it. It comes down to individual opinion here.
-more expensive everything (mags, service, the gun itself) Fact
-non-standard rail system for lights/etc. (although they appear to have gotten the point with the new models P30/HK45) Truth

BUT...they are still nice guns. Wouldn't mind getting my hands on one or more again. Yet, I do and will carry a Glock.

I am staunchly of the opinion that everyone needs to find the gun that suits him/her best, so please don't take this as me disagreeing with you, at least not in principle. Really I think we are essentially coming from the same place here. If the Glock works great for you, that's awesome. I was able to justify the HK price because of the guns I tried, it fit me best and I shoot it better than my other considerations (though I did like the M&P and would like to get one someday ).

 

[balzack2]

My personal choice is glock, had 3 currently own 2 and love them. Not that anything is wrong with the others, all fine guns.

 

[88E30M50]

The whole argument about who makes the best gun is misguided. Just about every manufacturer has the ability to produce a great gun just as every one of them can produce a lemon. When shopping for a gun, find one that feels good and fits you well, that meets the parameters you are shopping for. Do some research to see if people that own them like them and also check the ratings for their warranty service. Every manufacturer can build a bad gun and part of the quality of a gun is the quality of the people that will service the warranty.

When shopping for a gun, beware of fanboys. They exist for every manufacturer and are simply the folks that do not have an open mind about their guns. Fortunately, they are easy to identify in that they speak in absolutes. The words 'only', 'never' or 'always' are their favorites. They cannot be trusted to provide quality feedback. They will rationalize failure and over sell their guns good points. There is nothing really wrong with them and it's great to see someone into a product to that degree, but just don't trust them for objective feedback.

As HnK said, find a gun that works for you and do whatever you need to do to make it work well. For most guns, that simply means running a couple of hundred rounds through it to break it in and learn how it shoots. Then, practice, practice practice. These are tools that if learned well, can save your life of that of someone you care about. If not taken seriously, they can cost you your life or cause you to take an innocent life.

Once you have found the tool that works for you and once you have mastered it, carry it everywhere, every day. At that point, you've become part of the answer to fixing what ails this country.

 

[Aggar]

Thank you , now i need to start looking harder at a h&k... What are some of the more popular models in a 9mm or 40?

I love my hks. Getting ready to trade off a sw mp9c for a p30. I've got a uspc40 that I carry and it has never failed. Also just picked up a 9 and 40 full size usp. Also have a p2000sk 9 that's a sweet little gun. I'm a but of an hk guy. Didn't care for the sw.

 

[HnK]

The whole argument about who makes the best gun is misguided. Just about every manufacturer has the ability to produce a great gun just as every one of them can produce a lemon. When shopping for a gun, find one that feels good and fits you well, that meets the parameters you are shopping for. Do some research to see if people that own them like them and also check the ratings for their warranty service. Every manufacturer can build a bad gun and part of the quality of a gun is the quality of the people that will service the warranty.

When shopping for a gun, beware of fanboys. They exist for every manufacturer and are simply the folks that do not have an open mind about their guns. Fortunately, they are easy to identify in that they speak in absolutes. The words 'only', 'never' or 'always' are their favorites. They cannot be trusted to provide quality feedback. They will rationalize failure and over sell their guns good points. There is nothing really wrong with them and it's great to see someone into a product to that degree, but just don't trust them for objective feedback.

As HnK said, find a gun that works for you and do whatever you need to do to make it work well. For most guns, that simply means running a couple of hundred rounds through it to break it in and learn how it shoots. Then, practice, practice practice. These are tools that if learned well, can save your life of that of someone you care about. If not taken seriously, they can cost you your life or cause you to take an innocent life.

Once you have found the tool that works for you and once you have mastered it, carry it everywhere, every day. At that point, you've become part of the answer to fixing what ails this country.

This could not be more true. Not everyone can make a gun that runs 100% 100% of the time. I probably do come off as a fanboy of HK. A lot of what I say is what fits me best. But i started with the 1911 and owned several including Kimber Wilson and Nighthawk. After having nothing but trouble with them I moved to various other compact 45's. I had Glock, S&W, EAA and a few others. I either had failures or in the case of the Glock it just didn't feel good. TBH I always thought HK was overpriced until I shot one. After that I was sold on the HK compact and full size 45s. I have smaller hands and have come to love the mag release system on the HK. Aging not trying to sound like a fanboy but over the course of 3 years I owned quite a few 45 compacts before I found the one that was best for me.

 

[devil07]

I am staunchly of the opinion that everyone needs to find the gun that suits him/her best, so please don't take this as me disagreeing with you, at least not in principle.

I don't.

I see your red and raise you Blue
-The G19 and USPf both come with 15 round magazines and both have higher capacity options available.
I was comparing full size to full size. i.e. USP 9mm (full size) has 15rds vs. G17 having 17 rnds. USP .40 having 13rd vs G22 15rds. And yes, there are options for higher caps in both. I had a USP 9mm for a bit that had the "jet funnel"(??i think??) with waited 18rd mags, tho it was more a competition setup (no i didn't compete with it)
-old (out of date??) DA /SA trigger system unless you search for/upgrade to the LEM trigger kit, This tends to be a matter of preference. I've primarily used the DA/SA setup myself and find it to be okay for me. Also, the USP can be carried "cocked and locked" which negates some of the negatives of a DA/SA.
Yes, preference is a factor here, some do like the DA/SA for various reasons. Although, at least one of the options for Hk (how many trigger/action options do they have again?) is the DA/SA with a thumb safety/decocker, which if swept too aggressively (as could easily happen doing it 'for real') will decock and now you're starting with DA. Not necessarily a big deal, but slightly annoying.
-different mag release set up than virtually every other semi-auto made True, but many who use it tend to prefer it. It comes down to individual opinion here.
Yes, I also liked it for a few reasons, but it means a training issue if a person wants to be proficient with more than one format.

 

[devil07]

This could not be more true. Not everyone can make a gun that runs 100% 100% of the time. I probably do come off as a fanboy of HK....

NOoo...what could possibly give someone that impression...

 

[HnK]

NOoo...what could possibly give someone that impression...

Like I said I don't mean to come off that way at all. And I do make some comments that would be better in purple. It's just the gun for me. I know many people don't like the price on an HK and don't give them a chance because of it. But to me the price doesn't matter if the gun fits you and if you ever need it it goes bang. Any firearm that saves your life or the life of another is cheap at twice the price.

 

[LANShark42]

Fan Boy

This could not be more true. Not everyone can make a gun that runs 100% 100% of the time. I probably do come off as a fanboy of HK. A lot of what I say is what fits me best. But i started with the 1911 and owned several including Kimber Wilson and Nighthawk. After having nothing but trouble with them I moved to various other compact 45's. I had Glock, S&W, EAA and a few others. I either had failures or in the case of the Glock it just didn't feel good. TBH I always thought HK was overpriced until I shot one. After that I was sold on the HK compact and full size 45s. I have smaller hands and have come to love the mag release system on the HK. Aging not trying to sound like a fanboy but over the course of 3 years I owned quite a few 45 compacts before I found the one that was best for me.

What makes you come across as a fan-boy is your screen name, tag line, avatar and the fact that you rave about them. Pretty sure those things are the definition of fan-boy.

 

[HnK]

What makes you come across as a fan-boy is your screen name, tag line, avatar and the fact that you rave about them. Pretty sure those things are the definition of fan-boy.

I guess when the shoe fits.

 

[LD36]

Never had a USP or my HK45c fail. I have watched the Glock and the M&P fail. HK is the only gun I trust to carry.

Don't get me wrong, my USP has never failed yet either. But i also haven't put it through the gauntlet yet like i have my G21 or my Sig. With that said, I really do like my USP. No plans to ever sell it

 

[LD36]

So you're saying that shooting instructors have no sense of style?

That cracked me up! Lol

 

[Birds Away]

That is hilarious why? Oh, you assume I am just some fanboy right? Well I am a firearms dealer and I've probably test fired more guns in a year than you have in your life, although I don't know you so I could be wrong. I've owned or own Sigs, Kimbers, Brownings, H&K, Glocks, Rugers, S&W's, CZ's, Springfields, FNH, Beretta, Colts, Kahr's, Magnum Research, Para's, Night hawk customs, and many other less quality brands that aren't worth mentioning. I can say that every single one of those companies I mentioned makes a quality firearm or firearms. I can also honestly say that the ONLY ones I carry and trust my life with on a daily basis is Glock and M&P.

Why? Because I like striker-fired guns. I have had less issues with those two brands than any of the others. They have proven to me to be the most reliable time and time again, consistent trigger pull, long life, & they are inexpensive and I don't have to cry like a little girl when one gets a scratch or holster wear. I think Sig comes in right behind them. I also LOVE 1911's, prettiest gun ever made....but I don't trust my life to them. Not saying you can't, but I don't.

So once again, Smith and Wesson M&P and Glock are the only two that I trust my life to. Not that they are the only ones YOU can trust your life to.

I appreciate you taking the time to explain. I withdraw my comment. You have to agree there are many, many people making such statements who have significantly less experience than yourself. I agree that Glocks and M&Ps are two of the finest guns available today. I do not think they are the only guns available today that are reliable enough or of enough quality to be used to defend oneself. But I respect each individual's ability to choose for themselves. What I hate to see is a new gun owner, looking for recommendations, rule out some very fine firearms because of such statements.

 

[ZX-14R]

I appreciate you taking the time to explain. I withdraw my comment. You have to agree there are many, many people making such statements who have significantly less experience than yourself. I agree that Glocks and M&Ps are two of the finest guns available today. I do not think they are the only guns available today that are reliable enough or of enough quality to be used to defend oneself. But I respect each individual's ability to choose for themselves. What I hate to see is a new gun owner, looking for recommendations, rule out some very fine firearms because of such statements.

I always recommend Glock and M&P to customers, but if they don't like em, I am happy to sell them something else of quality. I am very opinionated on firearms that I do not believe to be quality (*cough* Kel-Tec *cough*), but I don't have a problem selling them any of the brands listed in my previous post. I am also NOT that guy that runs around telling customers that their Sig or H&K, etc....is garbage and they shouldn't carry it. I hated that before I was an FFL holder. Thank you for your response.

 

[88E30M50]

What makes you come across as a fan-boy is your screen name, tag line, avatar and the fact that you rave about them. Pretty sure those things are the definition of fan-boy.

To me, a fanboy is someone that has closed their minds to any info that casts their choice in an unfavorable light. It's not about the avatar or screen name since there is nothing wrong with bring into a companies product. I've dipped my toe in the CZ and 1911 fanboy waters from time to time and someone on INGO has always thrown a bucket of reality my way to wake me up. My only concern with fanboys is that they cannot be relied upon for objective advice. Sometimes they are right, but when they come across as a fanboy with a mind that's locked shut to any other info, their advice loses value. Nobody makes 100% perfect guns and no one gun fits everybody. That's the beauty of the time we live in today. There are so many choices, everybody can find what works for them.

 

[xM3RC1L3SS1x]

One man's Chevy is another man's Ford. It's all on how you want to look at "big" dogs.