For those of you who support abortion...

[Survivalcookie]

yep... after reading this... I still don't care if people get abortions

So you agree people should be killed if they are not loved or wanted...for any reason the killer wants.

 

[Survivalcookie]

This is apples and oranges to a legit abortion. Cmon why you even put this up, but than moan when anti gun libatards use similar tactics to go after guns. This is nothing similar to a abortion by a woman who gets raped, uses protection but still gets pregnant, or someone who knows they just cant take care of a child. I know most will say there is still adoption and what not, but how do you know your kid is really going to a good home, you never know nowadays. Plus there is insurance reasons too, not everyone can afford it, and pregnancies are faaaaar from cheap trust me, and dont say the government wont turn you down for insurance if your pregnant. I will show you my bills from last child born with no insurance because I make too much on unemployment according to our great government.

In my book all your assumptions are not a reason to have an abortion...there are so many people who want to adopt in this country, but the lawyers and goverment make it impossible to afford.

 

[sepe]

You certainly seem to know a Hell of a lot about the Foster Care System..
I'd like to compare notes with you some time since you apparently have been an abused Foster child, or have been an abuser of Foster Children..
My wife and I were Foster Parents for twins and apparently we didn't do it right.
BTW
I suggest that if you have proof of your allegations that you turn the evidence over to the Prosecutors Office having venue in the case.
Otherwise.....
If, as I suspect, you're just blowing hot air out of your fetid rear end I suggest that you shut your worthless pie hole until you have first hand knowledge of the matter.
Have a nice day....

Yup, because your experience is EXACTLY how they all go. Nice to know you're dumb enough to believe that. I'm sure the kids in the foster system that have gone through continued abuse (physical and sexual) are glad to know that their experiences are just hot air...you know, since you and your wife didn't do that.

 

[92ThoStro]

I thought this was going to be a serious thread.

It's a man murdering people, not about having an abortion.

I'm not a supporter of abortions ( like I donate, or I go out with signs )

I just don't care if someone has one, or they don't.

1st trimester abortions, or Plan B, etc. Do whatever you want.

 

[UncleMike]

Yup, because your experience is EXACTLY how they all go. Nice to know you're dumb enough to believe that. I'm sure the kids in the foster system that have gone through continued abuse (physical and sexual) are glad to know that their experiences are just hot air...you know, since you and your wife didn't do that.

I never said bad things don't happen.
I wondered how YOU knew so much about those bad things.
And I repeat, that if you have evidence to that effect I suggest that you turn it over to the appropriate Prosecutors office for legal action.
If you have no first hand experience, and I do, I submit that you are repeating "tales" that you've heard, or read on the Internet.
And we all know that they can't put anything that's not true on the Internet. (Bon jour)
BTW.
I have no intention of committing suicide as you suggest that I do in your personal message to me.
Again, have a nice day.

 

[CHCRandy]

If it cant live on it's own.......is it a life? If the mother died would the child survive?

Eagle eggs are not eagles, they are eggs. If the momma eagle dies will the eggs survive, of course not.

Same with turkey....heck, 50% of turkey eggs are fakes, not even anything in them! So how you gonna call them a baby turkey when in fact it may be an empty egg.

 

[cordex]

If it cant live on it's own.......is it a life? If the mother died would the child survive?

If left in the womb? Nope. If removed? Depends in the development of the kid and the level of medical attention available.

An interesting follow-up question might be: do you apply this same reasoning to other people who require medical support to survive? I.e., is someone who needs dialysis to survive or is on a respirator, etc. "a life"?

 

[longbarrel]

I would be against them more if people had or the public had funerals. Since an overwhelming majority don't, then the argument that a living person was murdered, doesn't really hold much weight in my book. Not to mention, don't really feel right meddling in other peoples' business. Especially if it doesn't affect me. I know I know, my tax dollars go to support this, but they also go to the universities that train the doctors to do them, and the pharma/medical supply companies that provide materials for the task to be done, and for the real estate subsidies that are given by the gov't, for the business, to be on said land, and I feel this would be less than the cost of feeding and clothing and schooling a child by once again, the taxpayer.

 

[pimpskillet]

Who can say that forcing a women to carry a child a full 9 months is the right thing to do? Well, a lot of people here can say so, of course.

The government is good at force. At the barrel of a gun if necessary. And that is what many here would rather see.

No one forced her legs in the air. Not all, but most... just sayin...

 

[JetGirl]

Eagle eggs are not eagles, they are eggs.

Then why are they protected when other eggs are not?

If it cant live on it's own.......is it a life?

Time to poll hospital units and nursing homes...

 

[Bummer]

Then why are they protected when other eggs are not?

That's an easy one. Because the Federal Government has gone crazy.

 

[UncleMike]

That's an easy one. Because the Federal Government has gone crazy.

The Feds have always been crazy.

"Imagine that you're a complete idiot."
"Now imagine that you're a member of Congress"
"Oh wait.... I repeat myself"
Mark Twain.

 

[ghunter]

Dr. Gosnell makes Dr. Hannibal Lechter look like Trapper John, MD.

 

[netsecurity]

If it cant live on it's own.......is it a life? If the mother died would the child survive?

Eagle eggs are not eagles, they are eggs. If the momma eagle dies will the eggs survive, of course not.

Same with turkey....heck, 50% of turkey eggs are fakes, not even anything in them! So how you gonna call them a baby turkey when in fact it may be an empty egg.

I feel dumber for having read this.

 

[sun]

Can you support this? After reading this, do you still support abortion in anyway shape or form? I believe if the truth of abortions were public, as in this case, the public would turn completely against abortion.

WARNING! This is disturbing.

Abortionist Joked: 'This Baby Is Big Enough to Walk Around With Me or Walk Me to the Bus Stop' | CNS News

I'm not absolutely sure whether this doctor committed a crime or not. While it's possible that he did, that doesn't change my view about a women's legal right to choose.
While the story and photos are certainly emotional, many folks are legally given aid to die a dignified death by doctors in hospitals across the nation every single day. I believe that it's a form of euthanasia that's a legally accepted practice. And many of us have or will have personal experience with it at some point in our lives when a family member has a horrific accident or a severe brain injury. There's a numerical scale of brain activity that the doctors use as a reference by which they assess the degree of brain death that a patient has suffered. Even though a person may be able to breath on their own for a time, and can survive even longer with the help of a machine, and can exhibit a rudimentary level of reflex response, that kind of activity is largely controlled by the involuntary nervous system and the patient doesn't feel any pain and never will. The person may no longer even have any concept of their own existence. And I'm talking about mature adults who have a high enough degree of brain damage to be considered almost totally brain dead. And after consulting with the family and legal guardians, doctors routinely will then remove the life support and administer drugs to help the person die a dignified death. The drugs help insure that the person can't experience any pain and the vital functions may even be suppressed to some degree.
The death process can be extremely quick or it can last for many hours. And by being given drugs, it doesn't mean that the injured person is otherwise viable.
Once the emotions associated with these kinds of events is stripped away, the professionally trained doctors do what they must to preserve the dignity and wishes of the individual family who they know don't want the patient to live in a vegetative state for the rest of their lives. Quite often, the quality of life while existing in the vegetative state is bad enough to cause infection and death all on it's own. The breathing apparatus itself can cause lung infections like pneumonia, the patient usually develops bedsores and they must forever be cared for in an institutional setting unable to care for themselves at all.
When a person has such a traumatic brain injury, the doctors often refuse to take any heroic measures to try to fix the damage because quite frankly they don't want to risk helping to preserve someone who will most likely be in a vegetative state for the rest of their life. It's a shame but the fact is that many of us will need to make such decisions for a family member who undergoes a severe stroke or has a brain injury or will be mostly brain dead after complications due to an operation. Hopefully folks will understand the difference between being allowed to die with dignity or surviving in a vegetative or semi-vegetative state for what could amount to years.
I'm not a medical professional, but even a layperson should know that there will be odds against a severely premature delivered baby surviving to become a normal or semi-normal healthy adult. And an abortion facility is not properly equipped to help increase the odds for its survival even if the doctor or the nurses did immediately call for an ambulance.
Similarly, people with brain injuries are often resuscitated at the scene of their accident and brought to hospitals and placed on breathing machines, only to determine that they're essentially brain dead as measured by being at such a low end of the scale of brain activity. How long they are allowed to stay on the machine is all up to the family with the advice of the doctors who often know best how to handle such a situation. And when it's a loved family member then doctors do such acts to hasten a dignified death. They're usually quite sure that the patient wouldn't survive to live a meaningful life. It's just something that folks do for their dogs and loved ones. It's not something that folks like to talk about, but it's inevitable that most folks will eventually be touched by it in some way, shape or form.
Women also have the right to choose for themselves and not to be told what to do largely by men. For too many generations throughout history women were forced to become concubines for men who forced them to carry their child. For countless wars throughout history women had been subjugated by soldiers and invaders in that way. I'm talking about millions upon millions of offspring that have resulted by forcible rape by men that wouldn't otherwise exist today. So on the subject of legal abortion I would never yield the women's right to choose. What the doctor did and his criminal trial is another subject that's up to a jury.

 

[Bapak2ja]

As I said above, it is infanticide—not abortion. Just changing the term does not change the reality. A rose is always a rose.

 

[JetGirl]

many folks are legally given aid to die a dignified death by doctors in hospitals across the nation every single day.

Totally different scenario. If you're alluding to the assisted suicide thing, you're describing a CHOICE made by the people for THEMSELVES...

How long they are allowed to stay on the machine is all up to the family with the advice of the doctors who often know best how to handle such a situation.

Again... you're in the area of living wills, next of kin decisions for accidents/illnesses. I'm sure the "advice of a doctor" to some pregnant woman experiencing a normal pregnancy with no medical threats would not be "well, in my medical opinion, my advice is to kill it."

 

[sun]

Totally different scenario. If you're alluding to the assisted suicide thing, you're describing a CHOICE made by the people for THEMSELVES...


Again... you're in the area of living wills, next of kin decisions for accidents/illnesses. I'm sure the "advice of a doctor" to some pregnant woman experiencing a normal pregnancy with no medical threats would not be "well, in my medical opinion, my advice is to kill it."

No, quite often a living will is not involved at all. Many folks don't have a living will when they get into a severe car or motorcycle accident, or suffer a severe stroke, heart attack, aneurysm or have complications from surgery. The decision to pull the plug on life support is totally up to the closest family members with the consent and advice of the patient's medical doctors.
Similarly, a premature fetus being aborted has the mother as the closest relative right in the abortion room giving her consent to terminate it. So her desires are well known when she enters the clinic. And the aborted fetus/baby has only a very slim chance of living a normal life under the circumstances. So the doctor consents to the mother's decision to terminate it. She is the closest relative of the fetus/baby and since the doctor is there performing the abortion then he consents too.
If the doctor made a mistake and aborted against the law, then that's another matter for a jury to decide the criminality of.

Just because soldiers impregnating women by raping them was considered to be acceptable for many centuries doesn't mean that women don't have the reasonable right to decide whether they want to carry a fetus to term in today's day and age.
I think that supporting a women's right to choose is the conservative, if not libertarian perspective. Preserving freedom and family values with limited government interference. I think that married women tend not to abort quite as readily as non-married women.
Maybe if more folks got married and made a long term commitment before acting as if they were married then there wouldn't be as many abortions or need for them.
Widespread promiscuity without using birth control is a big part of the problem. Look how many men & women have kids with multiple partners now days. Somewhere family values must be an important part of the big picture and how the women has been treated by the father before she decides to abort. How many of the rapist soldiers throughout history ever worried about taking care of their offspring? It's a historical tit for tat battle of the sexes and now women rightfully have the upper hand in the decision making process about whether to carry a fetus to full term or not. That's the law of the land, the best nation in the world, which folks can love it or leave it.
What I would like to know is why didn't the nurses blow the whistle on the doctor by speaking up sooner rather than later?

 

[cordex]

No, quite often a living will is not involved at all. Many folks don't have a living will when they get into a severe car or motorcycle accident, or suffer a severe stroke, heart attack, aneurysm or have complications from surgery. The decision to pull the plug on life support is totally up to the closest family members with the consent and advice of the patient's medical doctors.

All true, except in this case you've got someone who is neither terminally ill or injured, but instead steadily improving and completely healthy in their own right. It would be more like choosing to kill someone who currently is on minimal life support but is rapidly healing will either make a complete recovery in a few months. You'd be hard pressed to find a doctor who would recommend pulling the plug someone who is stable, continually improving and expected to make a full recovery.

Just because soldiers impregnating women by raping them was considered to be acceptable for many centuries doesn't mean that women don't have the reasonable right to decide whether they want to carry a fetus to term in today's day and age.

How many of the rapist soldiers throughout history ever worried about taking care of their offspring?

I simply can't find a way to debate this point. Something must be done about those roving gangs of marauding soldiers raping our women and pillaging the American heartland, and I for one can't think of a better way to fight rape than by abortion after the fact.

Why just last week we had a maniple of Roman hastati who were raping all the comely women and girls who didn't have the sense to take to the fields and the centurion didn't even bat an eye! This is truly a huge problem that requires abortion. I now see how wrong I was.

If the doctor made a mistake and aborted against the law, then that's another matter for a jury to decide the criminality of.

Out of curiosity, what makes snipping the spine if the baby pops out alive morally different than punching a hole in the head and sucking out the brains first? The kid is eliminated either way, and the mother and doctor are still making the medical decision to terminate the life, right? What suddenly changes from a moral perspective?

 

[ArcadiaGP]

This makes me feel physically ill:

Gosnell Worker: Baby Screamed During Live-Birth "Abortion" http://bit.ly/YbpU57