Florida stand your ground. Dont play stupid games

[maxmayhem]

even if thats legal then its unjustified/wrong. the guy did push an old man which is very wrong. what kind of man shoves an old man over an argument that wasnt physical?

it just shows the state of society
- entitled lawbreakers(parking in handicapped)
- unbridled violence (pushing an old man)
- hot tempered hateful people- taking a life over a shove seems harsh especially when the body language shows he was walking away.

on the other hand, it was a violent unjustified act that preceded a violent unjustified act. this kind of shooting,however, leads to a calmer society because people learn that illegal violence can be met with legal violence.

edit- i dont mean justified in a legal sense but in a moral sense

 

[GREEN607]

Looked to me like he was placing his weapon on the ground, as is taught in many Florida CCW classes. Then, he thought better of it and eventually put it on the hood of the vehicle.

The video isn't all that clear, but that is what I surmise from what I saw.

Nope. He sets the pistol down on the ground, in front of his right knee. Then he reaches for the 1st casing, and puts it in his left hand. The lady runs in the store. Then he sees the second one, and reaches for it, too.

As he is getting up, he picks up the pistol with his right hand, from in front of his knee.


** ETA- My bad. Correcting myself here. He puts the gun down in front of his LEFT knee. And picks it up w/ his LEFT HAND as he's getting up.

 

[Route 45]

even if thats legal then its unjustified/wrong. the guy did push an old man which is very wrong. what kind of man shoves an old man over an argument that wasnt physical?

it just shows the state of society
- entitled lawbreakers(parking in handicapped)
- unbridled violence (pushing an old man)
- hot tempered hateful people- taking a life over a shove seems harsh especially when the body language shows he was walking away.

on the other hand, it was a violent unjustified act that preceded a violent unjustified act. this kind of shooting,however, leads to a calmer society because people learn that illegal violence can be met with legal violence.

There is at least one witness that says that our hero threatened to shoot someone over the parking spot before, and another says he was involved in a road rage incident in which he pulled his gun. I wish we had audio for the video. Maybe he threatened to shoot the woman and child? What then?

 

[maxmayhem]

i think u have to consider the incidences independently- they arent related(even if true what has been said). my humble opinion is only based on what i observed in the video. if there were threats we would have heard of it by now (from the lying witness who said there were no parking spots when there were parking spots)

There is at least one witness that says that our hero threatened to shoot someone over the parking spot before, and another says he was involved in a road rage incident in which he pulled his gun. I wish we had audio for the video. Maybe he threatened to shoot the woman and child? What then?

 

[Hatin Since 87]

There is at least one witness that says that our hero threatened to shoot someone over the parking spot before, and another says he was involved in a road rage incident in which he pulled his gun. I wish we had audio for the video. Maybe he threatened to shoot the woman and child? What then?

Totally justified, gotta teach these entitled punks to not park in those spots some way or another.

 

[maxmayhem]

i hope u are joking since parking is not the issue but a violent physical attack- the attack is prosecuted could result in a felony where as the other illegal activity just results in a ticket

Totally justified, gotta teach these entitled punks to not park in those spots some way or another.

 

[maxmayhem]

no, no, dont know and doesnt matter in the moment, its apparent there were injuries and it was a violent act that would be felony or a misdimeanor

Did old guy know the attack was over? What was being said? Is there ever an excuse for an apparently healthy young guy to pound down an old man? Does deceased have a history of being a hot head bully? Did the old guy sustain injuries?

The old saying about don't mess with old guys sure fits here.

 

[maxmayhem]

easily, his attorney could say he was disoriented and frightened by being shove onto the concrete. also, i would like to know if he lost his glasses if he was wearing them.it wasnt murder in the first degree in most states-manslaughter or something else. he reaponded to a illegal and violent act with a violent act (that has been detemined to be legal)

I will give the shooter the benefit of poor training. That caused his slow draw and delay in deactivating the safety. He needs a glock

 

[maxmayhem]

Girl parks in handicap spot. Apparently not handicapped.

ILLEGAL action which results in a fine.


Self-appointed Justice League Handicap Spot Monitor confronts Girl.

LEGAL and protected by first ammendment.


Someone goes inside convenience store to alert the clerk. LEGAL and doesnt matter.


Boyfriend of Girl comes out and pushes Justice League member.

ILLEGAL and is likely a felony attack in most states.


Justice League member falls to the ground and draws pistol, points it at Boyfriend.

Evidenly LEGAL in florida.
Boyfriend stops attack and actually looks like he's about to back up. Justice League shoots anyway.
Doesnt matter



Boyfriend goes inside store and collapses.
doesnt matter legally
Boyfriend later dies at hospital.

doesnt matter legally (not saying it doesnt matter to me or his family.
Prosecutor says it is self-defense. (Stand your ground law)

Evidently LEGAL in florida.

Clerk says that Justice League has harassed people in the lot before.
doesnt matter and if true- doesnt really matter because "harassing" is not complaining about ablebodied people parking in handicapped spots (though both are annoying)

Argument ensues on INGOo.
Doesnt matter and LEGAL and protected by the firat ammendment

Yup.

Girl parks in handicap spot. Apparently not handicapped.
Self-appointed Justice League Handicap Spot Monitor confronts Girl.
Someone goes inside convenience store to alert the clerk.
Boyfriend of Girl comes out and pushes Justice League member.
Justice League member falls to the ground and draws pistol, points it at Boyfriend.
Boyfriend stops attack and actually looks like he's about to back up. Justice League shoots anyway.
Boyfriend goes inside store and collapses.
Boyfriend later dies at hospital.
Prosecutor says it is self-defense. (Stand your ground law)
Clerk says that Justice League has harassed people in the lot before.
Argument ensues on INGO.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

i hope u are joking since parking is not the issue but a violent physical attack- the attack is prosecuted could result in a felony where as the other illegal activity just results in a ticket

If you get in my wife’s face yelling with my kids present, I might deem in necessary to push you away depending on your body language and actual language during the verbal attack. Looking at the video, he isn’t proceeding with an attack, and the man should have expected a reaction from his actions. I think he was looking for confrontation and an excuse to use his gun.

 

[Route 45]

i hope u are joking since parking is not the issue but a violent physical attack- the attack is prosecuted could result in a felony where as the other illegal activity just results in a ticket

Did a little research on Florida assault & battery law.

An open hand push is not a felony under Florida law, unless serious bodily injury occurs. So no, the attack was not a felony in this case. It was simple battery, a misdemeanor.

In fact, if the shooter did utter threats to harm or kill, the shove would be considered a reasonable defense in certain circumstances. Florida has an "assault" charge that is separate from battery. It requires no physical contact, only threats and the ability or apparent intent to carry them out.

In summary, reasonable non-deadly physical force is justified against verbal assault, if threats to injure/kill are made and there is apparent intent or ability to carry them out.

Seems like Stand Your Ground doesn't only apply to wannabe meter maids with anger control issues.

 

[maxmayhem]

yelling at your wife for parking in handicapped space is not a crime. touching someone who has NOT threatened harm to you is a crime. you better walk away or yell back. leaving is your best option.there is no such thing as a verbal attack unless you are threatening someone with bodily harm. if someone is yelling at your wife, your best action is to walk away.

If you get in my wife’s face yelling with my kids present, I might deem in necessary to push you away depending on your body language and actual language during the verbal attack. Looking at the video, he isn’t proceeding with an attack, and the man should have expected a reaction from his actions. I think he was looking for confrontation and an excuse to use his gun.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

yelling at your wife for parking in handicapped space is not a crime. touching someone who has NOT threatened harm to you is a crime. you better walk away or yell back. leaving is your best option.there is no such thing as a verbal attack unless you are threatening someone with bodily harm. if someone is yelling at your wife, your best action is to walk away.

Might wanna re read my comment. “I might seem it necessary to push you away depending on your body language and actual language”. Now highlighting what you said, I’d say that’d be a pretty good reason to push someone away from your wife. This guy had a gun, yelling at his girlfriend with his kids present. If you don’t see that as a threatening situation, I don’t know what to tell ya.

And how do you know he didn’t threaten harm to her? You used capital letters, surely you have pretty substantial evidence.

 

[maxmayhem]

i am surprised at how ignorant and illogical some of the comments on this thread. everything is irrelevant in the video until the assault. This is true assuming bodily harm was not verbally threatened and heard/known about before the initial ASSAULT happened. Being an entitled idiot will get you yelled at. Yelling at someone is not a crime unless you are yelling threats of violence. You cant push someone like this for yelling at you. You can,evidently in Florida, shoot someone for shoving you to the pavement violently for simply (albeit foolishly) exercising your right if free speech.

 

[maxmayhem]

i hear you- pushing someone back from personal space may be one thing but dishing out a football hit because someone is yelling is a crime in all 50 states. Being yelled at is not a threatening situation or I could have rightfully attacked my idiot boss many times

Might wanna re read my comment. “I might seem it necessary to push you away depending on your body language and actual language”. Now highlighting what you said, I’d say that’d be a pretty good reason to push someone away from your wife. This guy had a gun, yelling at his girlfriend with his kids present. If you don’t see that as a threatening situation, I don’t know what to tell ya.

And how do you know he didn’t threaten harm to her? You used capital letters, surely you have pretty substantial evidence.

 

[maxmayhem]

i think what i take away from this is the following:

i am going to be also carrying a can of powerful mace (or similar) with me for this type of situation. If he maced the guy then that would have served the natural human response to want to counter attack. This would allow me to keep distance from this big dude as well. I hope I would not be in this situation but i will have the choice whether to kill or temporarily incapacitate.

 

[maxmayhem]

hope you didnt feel threatened by capital letters or you might push me-but who cares? im in Florida. anyway, since we are armchair lawyers tonight i know he didnt threaten her because the woman did not say he threatened harm in the article. how do you know he did? we know the first attacker was capable of egregious violence so how do you know he wasnt going to pull his own gun once he retreated?


incidentally, we already know from the article that the woman is a liar(since she lied about the spaces). she didnt say he threatened her and her credibility is gone so we cant believe what says anyway.

Might wanna re read my comment. “I might seem it necessary to push you away depending on your body language and actual language”. Now highlighting what you said, I’d say that’d be a pretty good reason to push someone away from your wife. This guy had a gun, yelling at his girlfriend with his kids present. If you don’t see that as a threatening situation, I don’t know what to tell ya.

And how do you know he didn’t threaten harm to her? You used capital letters, surely you have pretty substantial evidence.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

Guess ill go yell at everyone I’ve ever disagreed with and antagonize them til they push me, then I’m completely justified in using deadly force.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

Hope you don’t attend any political rallies with opposition present. Lot of shootings will happen.

 

[maxmayhem]

this comments from another member below sums it all up with the best possible action and mindset. These situations happen when two unreasonable idiots meet and confront each other.

Other actions that let you go home alive are:
- turn the other cheek admit you are wrong
- say "i apologize"
- tell him you cant read
- act like you are deaf
- do nothing
- walk away
-pretend you are Jamaican or Swedish and cant read English
- maybe even yell back
- move your car
- call the police
- get out of the car and limp badly to the door
- tell him you dont care
- tell him to write you a ticket
- roll up your windows and ignore him
- leave your car parked there till its towed
- lie and say your handicapped and forgot your placard
- tell the truth and say you forgot your placard
- pull out and double park in another handicap spot- finish your cigarette knowing that ,even if the police are called , you will be home smoking another cigarette watching COPS before they respond to this trivial matter
- turn up your bass really loud so you cant hear him
- call your friend down the road and have him park in handicapped too

the list is endless that lets you leave alive to park in handicapped and engage in other entitled selfish behaviour

Things that do not you leave alive:
- physically attacking a tempermental and unforgiving guy who happens to be concealing a firearm

Most certainly.

By being legally able to carry a firearm concealed it puts an extra burden on me to stay away from altercations. Been a couple of situations where I believe I was in the right, but was it worth me dying or killing someone to be right? The shooter should have walked on by the illegally parked car. If he felt he needed to do something report it to the local PD.