Flight 370

[PaulF]

So, either the vehicle is at sea...or it is somewhere else.

If it went into the sea, what are the chances she went in whole? I mean, stayed intact following impact with the water? Barring some "Captain Sullivan vs the Hudson River" - type miracle...I have to think the plane didn't go to the bottom whole.

Many of the component materials (and the fluids) used in modern airliners are less dense than seawater. Given enough time something will make its way to the surface...if the vehicle is actually at sea.

If it isn't at sea...I find it a little disturbing that it is this easy to lose a commercial jetliner over land in the 21st Century.

I dunno. I want to lean toward catastrophic mechanical failure, but...the stolen passport bit sets me wondering. If it is terrorism, what was gained? By Whom? I don't get it.

 

[ratfortman]

Happy reading:

Boeing 777 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This was a 777-200 ER as I understand. The 200 series ER holds a record for the longest ETOPS-related flight diversion under one engine of 177 minutes. Nearly 3 hours.

Maybe "certified" was an incorrect use of terms. A former pilot who I know personally said that the 777-200 ER can operate for 3 hours to get to a field that can safely land it. I am not positive if that is part of the plane's FAA certification.

Big difference between something a "former pilot" told you and FAA certification. The best source for accurate info would be an FAA approved operations manual, not hearsay and Wikipedia

 

[abigbadzebra]

From what I understand, there are systems that automatically send out signals during certain catastrophic failure, and nothing was received. Based on that, I'm guessing it was something pretty instantaneous. Odd to me at first they can't find any debris, but the ocean is quite large. If it was an explosion at 35,000 ft, I'd imagine that would still be like looking for thousands of needles in one hell of a big haystack. It will take time.

 

[Lectric102002]

Big difference between something a "former pilot" told you and FAA certification. The best source for accurate info would be an FAA approved operations manual, not hearsay and Wikipedia

OK, I consider myself properly admonished.

 

[atvdave]

I don't know much about what pilots can do or can not do in a case of a catastrophic mechanical failure, but I would think that their is some kind of emergency switch, or button to hit to activate a mayday type of signal. This is why I'm leaning towards terrorism, and the pilots where not able to activate the signal in time.

 

[Lebowski]

Wormholes, man. Wormholes.


Well, passenger's cellphones are still ringing. There is no debris field. Every feature that'd indicate location or failure and report back seemingly failed to work despite multiple failovers. Seems odd. Thirty employees from a tech company were on board who were working on UWB/pulse radio type products... and that's only what we know (I'm sure more stuff is hidden behind NDAs)


My guess as to what happened? Hell if I know. I don't think it crashed though.

 

[hoosierdoc]

I thought they are reporting finding a tail fragment and a part of a door? Can you imagine the size of the debris field when something moving 500mph explodes 7 miles up?

also possible they are fighting the Langoliers now

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Langoliers

 

[Lebowski]

I thought they are reporting finding a tail fragment and a part of a door? Can you imagine the size of the debris field when something moving 500mph explodes 7 miles up?

also possible they are fighting the Langoliers now

The Langoliers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It'd only span a few miles I believe. Still pretty vast considering the size of the ocean, but luckily most parts should be buoyant. If it crashed over the ocean though, I don't think passenger's cellphones would be ringing, though. They'd have to be able to communicate with a tower to ring, and if they were submerged... now for days, in water, it's not likely that would happen.

The fact that passenger's cellphones are ringing is very, very interesting.

 

[vvet762]

Sounds to me like a new episode for LOST.

 

[atvdave]

I don't know, but I would think that if you call someone's cellphone it would still ring on your end, just not theirs.

 

[Lebowski]

Sounds to me like a new episode for LOST.

Never seen the show, but would make a good film.

One airplane.
30 tech company employees. (Which is why large companies utilize the 'bus factor' when sending important staffers on trips... they don't fly/travel together to eliminate risk)
Two passengers... were not on the plane, instead had their passports stolen years before. Who was occupying their seats?

All communication lost.
No one knows what happened.

Fade in shot of a wife and child, tears streaming down their face. Notion to use cellphone crosses mind, calls missing husband. <gasp> "It's ringing! It's ringing!" she shouts. No answer.

*dun dun dun*

*queue action shots of people running, shot of someone crying, air traffic control looking confused and frantic reporters pointing at charts and graphs*



Maybe this is all viral marketing of a hit new movie to come out this summer? <shrugs>

 

[88GT]

OK, I consider myself properly admonished.

You were good in my eyes, assuming the pilot friend wasn't blowing smoke. If I have to take the word of a pilot who's got lots of hours with a plane/engine or a manual written by some desk jockey, my money's on the pilot. Just sayin'.

 

[atvdave]

It'd only span a few miles I believe. Still pretty vast considering the size of the ocean, but luckily most parts should be buoyant. If it crashed over the ocean though, I don't think passenger's cellphones would be ringing, though. They'd have to be able to communicate with a tower to ring, and if they were submerged... now for days, in water, it's not likely that would happen.

The fact that passenger's cellphones are ringing is very, very interesting.

Maybe someone here can test this.. If you have 2 cellphones, take out the battery of one of them. Then call the number and see it that cell phone with ring on your end. My wife and I both have iPhones, so I can not take the battery's out. I would like to know if it works.

 

[Lectric102002]

Looking at the logs, the last ADS-B transmission received was at 12:02 and the rate was not indicated. Either the data did not get transmitted or they had just leveled at FL 350. For the transmissions to suddenly cease, would indicate to me a catastrophic failure such as an explosive event. Even if the pilots were troubleshooting a problem, the ADS-B transmissions would continue.

Again, I'm not sure how the ADS on a Triple 7 is configured. If it is tied into the transponder and a hijacker turned it off, ..... who knows ?

 

[Lectric102002]

You were good in my eyes, assuming the pilot friend wasn't blowing smoke. If I have to take the word of a pilot who's got lots of hours with a plane/engine or a manual written by some desk jockey, my money's on the pilot. Just sayin'.

Thanks. FWIW, he's a Triple 7 driver for a major carrier with 1000's of hours in the left seat. I trust his judgement.

 

[Lebowski]

Maybe someone here can test this.. If you have 2 cellphones, take out the battery of one of them. Then call the number and see it that cell phone with ring on your end. My wife and I both have iPhones, so I can not take the battery's out. I would like to know if it works.

Good suggestion.

In reality I have no idea if there is much significance to the new reports of passenger's cellphones ringing. The way it was presented was to make it seem as if it was an odd thing. In the movies they always destroy the phones so they can't be tracked. Remove the battery, smash the phone... that type of stuff. With the way the articles were written and the way it's presented in movies it'd lead you to believe that the phones (or some phones) are still intact and within range of a tower to pickup a signal.

Of course none of that makes any of it true. But it's still worth noting.


BRB, gonna smash my phone and put it in the garbage disposal... call me in 5 minutes


EDIT: Unsure how many exact miles they were from the coast when contact was lost, but I know a couple years ago I went on a cruise and I had no service on my phone until I was about 15-20 miles from the Florida coast, give or take. Maybe more, maybe less. I forget.

 

[atvdave]

personally I would think the phone will ring on our end. I know I have ran my battery dead before on a job, and when I got back to the hotel to charge it I had like 10 missed calls, and 5 messages. But I would still like someone to test it out.

 

[hoosierdoc]

It'd only span a few miles I believe.

Hhndreds of square miles is more likely. 7 miles up, 500mph, some pieces will accelerate foreword, others will be blasted backwards. Add wind, ocean currents, and time to begin the search and the square is easily a hundred square miles IMHO.

regarding the cellphone, if it isn't powered down properly, will the tower know it isn't there? I'm not up on cellphone tech. I assume powering down sends a "I'm going away now" signal, but maybe not.

 

[88GT]

Thanks. FWIW, he's a Triple 7 driver for a major carrier with 1000's of hours in the left seat. I trust his judgement.

And my husband designs engines for planes. He'll be the first to tell you that the pilot is a better source for what the engine/plane can really do than anybody else. He designs 'em to perform within X parameters. That certainly doesn't mean they can't perform outside of those parameters.

 

[Lectric102002]

EDIT: Unsure how many exact miles they were from the coast when contact was lost, but I know a couple years ago I went on a cruise and I had no service on my phone until I was about 15-20 miles from the Florida coast, give or take. Maybe more, maybe less. I forget.

I spend a good deal of my life airborne, usually on a private jet, so I don't have to turn my phone off. I usually lose service between 7,000 and 10,000 feet AGL. So, reports of people receiving calls from loved ones at 20k plus feet are a little hard for me to understand. Not saying it doesn't happen.