Buy cheap, buy twice. The "Sweet Deal" mentality.

[E5RANGER375]

Its obvious to me your border line socialist.
Are there crooked dealers absolutely but your generalizing is getting rather old. What do you think it takes to keep a shop open? what kind of costs does a dealer incur weekly, monthly or yearly?
What kind of a percentage do you think is fair for a dealer to charge?
What Kind of a living do you think a dealer is entitled to?

i never said 100% of dealers are a rip off. but saying im border line socialist ?? come on. obviously you dont read my postings.

im not saying it doesnt take money to run a shop. but frankly your customers dont give 2 sh*ts about your overhead, nor should they. Nor do they wanna listen to people who they have the perception of making it (by having their own shop) B*tch about how high the cost to run a business are. they want the best for the lowest price, and if they can get it on the internet now days, or at another store, they will. im just stating the obvious. im not telling you what price point to keep. its your business not mine. and i dont care what you charge. if its too much then i just dont buy it from you, ill go to Bradis or Beech Grove. not that that would be the order i would normaly go in anyways. thats the American way. the right to choose. its not socialism

 

[Cwood]

You can find Surefires, Streamlights, and Inisght lights(current production LEDs) for about 25-35% cheaper from various online retailers and on eBay that you will from a gun shop.
Example, I can get a NIB current generation Strealight TLR-2 for about $200 shipped online compared to about $300-350 at the gun store.

Or a Surefire X300 shipped for $190 online compared to $250 at the gun store.

I would say that those are pretty good markups.

In both of those instances the prices are below MAP. A new Streamlight TLR-2 at $200 is below any price I can even get one for.

 

[t413]

they want the best for the lowest price, and if they can get it on the internet now days, or at another store, they will. im just stating the obvious.

That right there is the definition of a free market system, not socialism.

I would have to agree with E5RANGER375.
If your buisness plan doesn't work in a free market system, it doesn't work.
Most people are not going to subsidize your income buy paying high prices when they can get it cheaper elsewhere.

I know a couple of gun shop owners personally and they are nice guys, but I'm not going to be stupid and pay some of their over priced items.
I don't care how nice they are, I'm not going to let them sucker me.

 

[T-rav]

When did E5 say anything socialist? He stated that he looks for the best price possible, thats how a free market works. Who ever is selling their product can price it anyway they like, he will just choose to not buy from them if he didnt like their price.

 

[grunt soldier]

hey snayperskaya,

Hours Ago #30 (permalink)
Snayperskaya
Plinker



Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Indy Northwest
Posts: 104

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuting
Guns and Gear Related

Gemtech (Idaho)
Advance Armament Corp (Georgia)
Troy Industries (Massachusetts)
MagPul (Colorado)
Surefire (California)
Badger Ordinance (Missouri)
BCM (Wisconsin)
LMT (Illinois)
LaRue (Texas)
KAC (Florida)
Eagle Industries (Missouri)
Viking Tactics (North Carolina)
Vickers Tactical (North Carolina)

Uniforms, Foorwear, and Non-Firearms Related

Crye Precision (New York)
The North Face (California)
Bates Footwear (Michigan)
New Balance (Massachusetts)
Kifaru (Colorado)
Mystery Ranch (Montana)

Who would have thought that a good majority of the BEST gear out there is made in the USA??? If you'd rather buy some cheap crap made in a sweatshop overseas go ahead, but every time I buy American I know I'm supporting someone's job in my country. Bring up the cars all you want, because that's everyone's cookie cutter defense for not buying American.
Best gear for what there Mr. Commando? I don't need a bunch of plastic crap on my rifles to make them good. I don't need a flashlight on my carry pistol, or a suppressor on it either. But what I do need is good optics. Are there good american optics? Sure. Are there better ones from Germany? You bet your @$$.



i am not trying to knock you but there is a few companies out there now getting with the optics from germany. premier heritage, us optics, and nightforce makes it's lower mag scopes and also the F1's here. i mean if you wanna just put crazy money out there, from what i have seen and looked through and shot with your right nothing can beat a Zeiss Hensoldt but they are also 4k and i have shot with one its great but by no means better than my premier just more forgiving eye relief and a little clearer glass. Schimdt & Bender Scopes also great but i would put my us optics and premier glass with them any day of the week, i mean hell s&b usmc sniper scopes got premier reticles in them. just pointing this out as you wanted to see some american optics that could compare and easily do

 

[Gungho_1989]

i never said 100% of dealers are a rip off. but saying im border line socialist ?? come on. obviously you dont read my postings.

im not saying it doesnt take money to run a shop. but frankly your customers dont give 2 sh*ts about your overhead, nor should they. Nor do they wanna listen to people who they have the perception of making it (by having their own shop) B*tch about how high the cost to run a business are. they want the best for the lowest price, and if they can get it on the internet now days, or at another store, they will. im just stating the obvious. im not telling you what price point to keep. its your business not mine. and i dont care what you charge. if its too much then i just dont buy it from you, ill go to Bradis or Beech Grove. not that that would be the order i would normaly go in anyways. thats the American way. the right to choose. its not socialism

The socialist comment was as uncalled for as generalizing about dealers I admit.
I wasn't *****ing about having to run a shop, We actually enjoy that. I was trying to add a bit of perspective to the discussion, most people don't take the time to consider anything but that which directly affects them. The Margins in this industry have a tendency to be smaller than in others as well, just a bit of perspective.

There have been alot of good points as the thread has moved along, but like Cwood stated you cannot compete with big money. The huge online retailers have buying power we cannot even dream of, and a company that buys Million or two of product from a manufacturer is likely to get a bit of a pass a little guy cannot.

As for us we play the game, the rules are set by our customers as well as from our experiences from years of being on the other side, I think we give a good effort and just don't like being lumped in with the ****birds. So I retract the socialist part, at least.

 

[Snayperskaya]

I'm just sayin', buying American doesn't always mean you are getting the best.

 

[Nizidramaniiyt]

Like a buddy of mine always says: the most expensive way is the cheapest way.

 

[Colt556]

On a different note...
I always liked the guys that bought a $500-600 rifle and put $12 rings and a $29 scope and wonder why the rifle "Caint shoot!"
Orrrrr the guys that buy a nice pistol and wonder why it won't work with the $9 reloads they bought.
I am definitely a bargain hunter but some things you need to buy the best you can afford.

 

[Duce]

Pogo once said "We have met the enemy and he are us".
I've worked both sides of the counter. It runs the gambit from being expected to back gun show purchases, to being charged close to double for parts that I needed badly.
My theory is that many treat this as a competitive activity. I've known dealers that simple hose their customers at times. Those same customers are right back at their door hoping to break even or get the better part of the "deal" next time.
Customer that will badger a dealer until he gives in just to get rid of them. Then to add insult to injury will pay with a credit card that charges the dealers 4% to use their card.
Then to top it all off we're like a bunch of kids in a candy store. How much stuff can be hung on an AR. Flashlight, laser, halo sight, EOTEC, bi-pod , mono-pod, variable power tatci-cool scope, and of coarse a bayonet, soon they'll need wheels to move them.
Guess I'm just to old school, shooting will always be to me, putting rounds on target.
I agree whole completely with buying quality. But only with a lot of research. Matching the tool for the job at hand, the scope you need on your favorite squirrel rifle is a little different from the one you put on a rifle
intended for that once in a lifetime hunt. Remember too that just because they spend millions advertizing doesn't mean anything. Swift optics has built rifle scope equal to or surpassing Leoupold for about a 1/3 less.
Dealer carry/sell junk because it sells, profit margins are probably equal.
Just like Chevy and GMC trucks many parts come off the same assembly line, thus the need for research.
The best anyone can do is be an informed consumer and being able to separate the s--t from the shine-ola. I've failed miserably at times.
Duce<><

 

[christman]

idk. I have an NcStar scope that has outlasted many other supposedly better brand scopes I have owned. Guess it all depends on what you have it on.

 

[grunt soldier]

well christman, you got lucky most ncstar scopes break with in a couple hours. i don't honestly think i would put one on my 22. i mean honestly you get what you pay for there is no if and or buts about it. i agree you don't need a 2k scope on a 22 but me i want something that is reliable, will hold a zero, doesn't look like i am looking through a cloud at 100 yards, and tracks like a swiss time piece. and you can't get that out of the cheap scopes.

i think we are digressing on the scopes subject but still.

here is my thoughts on dealers charging to much. this is america (well it kinda still is lol) they can charge whatever they want to that is their option. it is our job as the customer to do our research and decide what is a good, fair, or a ridiculous price. me i am one of those people who would rather buy something locally and have it now vs waiting a couple days or weeks for it to get here. that being said if i can save 100-200 bucks i will definitely wait but for 20-50 bucks i will just spend the extra cash. also if a dealer is friendly and willing to talk and bs with me even when i am not gonna buy something and who answer questions i might have. that definitely beats sending a email and waiting a couple days for a answer and will help to get me back in the store when i have money to spend. i know it sucks to deal with tire kickers but someday those people will have money and need something...just my thoughts

 

[DCR]

Like a buddy of mine always says: the most expensive way is the cheapest way.

This is so true for so many things -- traditional (vs stylish) clothing, especially shoes and boots; cars, especially slightly used expensive models; tools; furniture! etc etc etc.

My dad used to buy expensive traditional dress shoes, several pairs, and they lasted him a lifetime. My last car I bought with 3k miles on it so I paid a lot less for what was essentially a new car, it still smelled new, and I kept it for 17 years. Maintenance was high priced on it, but I almost didn't need any as nothing broke on it. I have a $4000 sofa in my den and it's over 20 years old.

Quality is always worth it.

 

[Cwood]

Buy once... cry once

 

[Gungho_1989]

Buy once... cry once

Can we avoid the crying, We don't do that whole support structure thing around here real well such as hugs n such,

 

[U.S. Patriot]

This is so true for so many things -- traditional (vs stylish) clothing, especially shoes and boots; cars, especially slightly used expensive models; tools; furniture! etc etc etc.

My dad used to buy expensive traditional dress shoes, several pairs, and they lasted him a lifetime. My last car I bought with 3k miles on it so I paid a lot less for what was essentially a new car, it still smelled new, and I kept it for 17 years. Maintenance was high priced on it, but I almost didn't need any as nothing broke on it. I have a $4000 sofa in my den and it's over 20 years old.

Quality is always worth it.

Not always for example. I bought some more expensive Lee jeans for work. I worked in a mold shop, and as a maintenance man. They did not last worth a damn. Started buying cheaper Wrangler jeans, and they lasted forever. Bought a $154 pair of Wolverine work boots. Got about a year out of them. Bought a $70 pair of hicking boots. Wore them for over a year, in the same job and they still are like new. So more $ does not always = better product. I have seen cheap Honda Civics, outlast more expensive cars. So yeah!