Brace Ban

[Trigger Time]

Uh..... no, they didn't, and no they don't. Prove this with actual factual examples.

Yeah I agree. The ATF has always been led by liberal puppet masters.

 

[jamil]

I was curious about the cost of a fully auto M16 so I googled it.

https://otbfirearms.com/colt-m-16-model-639-5-56mm-with-registered-moderator/

$44K is probably really high for a M16, I didn’t google the M4 but I’m betting it’s pretty expensive. I have four suppressors two of them were $200 each but the other two were $850 each. I wasn’t happy about buying the stamp but I’m not sure I agree it any more of a burden that the high price of the items. If you can’t afford the stamp I don’t see how you could afford the item unless a great uncle gifted it to you.

NFA has made “machine guns” prohibitively expensive. Only privileged people can afford to own them. You can’t be just an average joe and own a spanky new “machine gun”.

 

[Aszerigan]

I'm kind of shocked to read what all you've said in this thread. I never figured you'd stand up for more infringing of the 2nd amendment. Especially the way the government treated you in the not so distant past.

Let me be clear - I F'n HATE the way the BATFE treated me. That's not the issue here.

I will defend the law because it is the law. I abide by the law and I follow it. Just because you disagree with the law doesn't mean it's legal to break it.

And thanks, Trigger, been a while and I'm glad we worked all that out.

 

[Trigger Time]

I haven't bought a machinegun because I don't want my investment to become worthless overnight by the stroke of a pen.
Afew years ago m16's were 15 to $18k, now 40k. I could buy one today and in a year maybe it's worth 60k. But if a Democrat gets into office with a Democrat house and Senate, they WILL ban even NFA forearms and overnight your 60k is ZERO and either you can pick it up and fight with it or you can turn it in and watch it be melted down along with your republic.
I refuse to invest in machineguns.

 

[rvb]

NFA has made “machine guns” prohibitively expensive. Only privileged people can afford to own them. You can’t be just an average joe and own a spanky new “machine gun”.

Technically the Hughes amendment to FOPA did that to MG prices, not the NFA.

 

[Trigger Time]

Let me be clear - I F'n HATE the way the BATFE treated me. I bent over and they destroyed me. But that's not the issue here.

I will defend the law because it is the law. I abide by the law and I follow it. Just because you disagree with the law doesn't mean it's legal to break it.

And thanks, Trigger, been a while and I'm glad we worked all that out.

Oh don't get me wrong, I follow the law. A gun isn't worth making big rocks into small ones. But as of now braces are legal. If they become illegal I'll have a decision to make at that time.

And yes, it was disgusting the way they treated you

 

[Gluemanz28]

NFA has made “machine guns” prohibitively expensive. Only privileged people can afford to own them. You can’t be just an average joe and own a spanky new “machine gun”.

I agree that they are over priced, but I disagree with the “privileged” profiling. I have met some really nice guys at INGO meet and shoot outings that were nice enough to bring their firearms with happy switches to share.

 

[jamil]

Uh..... no, they didn't, and no they don't. Prove this with actual factual examples.

The ATF redefined the definition of “machine gun” which was codified in the NFA, to classify a mostly plastic accessory that’s capable of increasing the rate of fire of a semiautomatic firearm close to fully automatic. So it’s not just that they declared them illegal because they simulate the rate of fire of a “machine gun”, but declared them a machine gun itself. No firing pin. No unique components that would make them a stand alone firearm. No. It’s a literal machine gun because some idiot used one to “spray” bullets down from a hotel room. The political winds blew. Trump ordered the DoJ to do something. So the ATF pulled that one out of their asses.

 

[Aszerigan]

Oh don't get me wrong, I follow the law. A gun isn't worth making big rocks into small ones. But as of now braces are legal. If they become illegal I'll have a decision to make at that time.

And yes, it was disgusting the way they treated you

Of anyone on this board, I believe you follow the letter of the law. And yeah, it was. But tomorrow, back to the original point of the thread, braces may be outlawed. Then what? So many people will be IMMEDIATELY in non-compliance of the law and it's going to be a ****-show.

 

[Trigger Time]

They've even now classified imported AK barrels as machinegun parts like a receiver and require them to be cut into pieces.
Atf Can't have you slaying innocent people with that full auto barrel
Of coarse a barrel is a barrel. It's just one more way they stick it to gun owners and intentionally cause prices to go up. Same with their ammo import bans.
The ATF should be abolished period. Are there good patriotic Americans that work for the ATF? Of coarse. It would be ignorant of me to say there wasnt and I'm sure many many of them are good people.
My beef is with the beurocrats at the top. The organization itself. Kindof like the FBI and how it has become a disgrace.

 

[jamil]

I agree that they are over priced, but I disagree with the “privileged” profiling. I have met some really nice guys at INGO meet and shoot outings that were nice enough to bring their firearms with happy switches to share.

What on earth could you think “privileged” means? It doesn’t mean they’re meanies. It means they have the means to own something that is beyond the means of ordinary people. That is the point. The NFA creates a new class of privilege. Those who have the resources to own NFA items and those who don’t. The insistence that the the NFA puts no burden on ownership denies the this reality. It most certainly does.

 

[Aszerigan]

It’s a literal machine gun because some idiot used one to “spray” bullets down from a hotel room. The political winds blew. Trump ordered the DoJ to do something. So the ATF pulled that one out of their asses.

Back to the literal definition on the issue. How do you regulate a part most people can build in their garage?

 

[Trigger Time]

Of anyone on this board, I believe you follow the letter of the law. And yeah, it was. But tomorrow, back to the original point of the thread, braces may be outlawed. Then what? So many people will be IMMEDIATELY in non-compliance of the law and it's going to be a ****-show.

Possibly. But there are so many of them out there now and we have top lawmakers on our side to help defend them. I think we can win this issue and possibly effect a permanent change in how the atf uses rulemaking to in effect make backdoor laws. Only Congress can make a law. And I think its past time that Congress spanks the ATF and bans this practice. After November I believe we will have the momentum and votes to do it.

 

[Leadeye]

This was not the case bump stocks...the law was changed by bureaucrats with a simple rewording of a definition...a constant problem with our system.

Happens all the time in a lot of areas in the government, and it doesn't make it right, just legal. Interpretations of RCRA/CERCLA by bureaucrats tried companies ex post facto in the 80s and beyond. Nobody in media complained and lawsuits hit a stone wall as it was considered for the benefit of the country. I know from personal experience just how quickly your constitutional rights can vanish when you are deemed "unmutual".

 

[jamil]

Back to the literal definition on the issue. How do you regulate a part most people can build in their garage?

Because it’s difficult you redefine a term specifically defined in the law? Regulatory agencies don’t have the power to do that unless the law expressly allows it. It doesn’t allow that. Find a legal way if it needs regulating.

 

[Aszerigan]

It means they have the means to own something that is beyond the means of ordinary people. That is the point. The NFA creates a new class of privilege. Those who have the resources to own NFA items and those who don’t. The insistence that the the NFA puts no burden on ownership denies the this reality. It most certainly does.

This is absolute crap. There is nothing beyond the means of "ordinary people" just because you don't want to save enough to buy one. It's a decision, not a privilege. I know for a fact they don't check your credit score on NFA application.

 

[Trigger Time]

And we need to only support firearm manufacturers that are on our side. Companies like colt suck the government pole every chance they get. Companies like that need to be boycotted

 

[Leadeye]

I guess I'm "grandfather" privileged, but nothing I own could be considered "spanky new".

 

[jamil]

Technically the Hughes amendment to FOPA did that to MG prices, not the NFA.

Of course, but all that effectively falls within the discussion of the NFA because it is an extension of the provisions. When we discuss what we can’t do now, we’re discussing the NFA along with it’s extensions.

 

[Route 45]

I will defend the law because it is the law. I abide by the law and I follow it. Just because you disagree with the law doesn't mean it's legal to break it.