Best AK on the market today?

[Cerberus]

Call me odd, but I would still prefer a $500 AK over the $1000 version. At $1000, I could have a lower make, 10 steel mags and 1k of ammo, and still get the same function and accuracy from it.

 

[IncendiaryGunner]

Call me odd, but I would still prefer a $500 AK over the $1000 version. At $1000, I could have a lower make, 10 steel mags and 1k of ammo, and still get the same function and accuracy from it.

Or, you might end up with a wobbly magazine well with constant magazine feed issues. I have seen a few so tight that we had to tinker with them to smoothly insert magazines.

Your gas block and sights may be significantly canted. Canted sights sure impacts realistic accuracy.

The barrel may keyhole, sending rounds tumbling end over end through the air.

This is before we even get into features like chrome lined barrels, and superior strength parts production.

I have seen AKs that shoot 1.5" groupings at 100 yards. I have also seen a few that shoot 6" keyholed groupings at 100 yards.

Don't get me wrong - if you get a "good" cheap ak, you are right. However, the fact remains - many of the cheaper AK variants are plagued with a much higher rate of lemons. You could even run into these problems with an Arsenal - it would just be very rare, and much much less likely when compared to say a CAI WASR.

 

[Cerberus]

Or, you might end up with a wobbly magazine well with constant magazine feed issues. I have seen a few so tight that we had to tinker with them to smoothly insert magazines.

Your gas block and sights may be significantly canted. Canted sights sure impacts realistic accuracy.

The barrel may keyhole, sending rounds tumbling end over end through the air.

This is before we even get into features like chrome lined barrels, and superior strength parts production.

I have seen AKs that shoot 1.5" groupings at 100 yards. I have also seen a few that shoot 6" keyholed groupings at 100 yards.

Don't get me wrong - if you get a "good" cheap ak, you are right. However, the fact remains - many of the cheaper AK variants are plagued with a much higher rate of lemons. You could even run into these problems with an Arsenal - it would just be very rare, and much much less likely when compared to say a CAI WASR.

I've been shooting AKs since I got the oportunity in 1988 to fire some Grenada bring backs at Quantico. I've owned a total of 7 and 1 Vz, I still own 5. One has mag wobble and in 4 years has yet to have a single feed issue. Between myself and a few of my close friends we have in excess of a dozen, with 2-3 of them being WASRs and none have failed yet, and the Arsenals and Saigas do not shoot 2x straighter. My Norinco milled has the nicest trigger, yet is no more accurate than the rest. My Maadi has the absolute worst trigger of them all. It will be getting a G2 soon. And besides the old issue of occational canted sights, most WASR owners will admit they reliably function mag wobble and all.

 

[IncendiaryGunner]

I've been shooting AKs since I got the oportunity in 1988 to fire some Grenada bring backs at Quantico. I've owned a total of 7 and 1 Vz, I still own 5. One has mag wobble and in 4 years has yet to have a single feed issue. Between myself and a few of my close friends we have in excess of a dozen, with 2-3 of them being WASRs and none have failed yet, and the Arsenals and Saigas do not shoot 2x straighter. My Norinco milled has the nicest trigger, yet is no more accurate than the rest. My Maadi has the absolute worst trigger of them all. It will be getting a G2 soon. And besides the old issue of occational canted sights, most WASR owners will admit they reliably function mag wobble and all.

You are lucky to have not had any problems.

My mileage has varied.

The first WASR I owned would not reliably feed because of the mag wobble. I ended up giving it away to a friend (not even selling, because it was garbage) - who for some time ran with strips on his mags to keep them in place and the rifle feeding. I learned quickly what to look for when inspecting an AK before purchase - and many of the WASR's I have inspected since have been classified as "I would not buy that one".

The WASR my cousin bought keyholed like mad. It seemed like half the hits on paper were the silhouette of the bullet. Until I saw the results of actually firing the weapon, his would have passed my simple gun store inspection.

My brother owns a WASR that runs fine, has straight sights, and shoots great. I know that he has put at least 3,000 rounds through his, without issue.

The fact remains, some variants like the WASR 10 have a much higher rate of producing rifles with significant issues that effect reliability and accuracy. Every rifle is unique, and not every cheap AK runs like a good specimen. Also, keep in mind I did not make a blanket statement like "the Arsenal will shoot straighter". I said:

I have seen AKs that shoot 1.5" groupings at 100 yards. I have also seen a few that shoot 6" keyholed groupings at 100 yards.

Many of the AK74 variants do not even have a true 5.45 barrel - they utilize a .223 barrel. Guess what this leads to when firing 5.45x39?

Keep in mind too, the company you buy from can make a difference if you find yourself in the unlucky category. Arsenal will generally bend over backwards to take care of serious issues - I cannot say the same about my experiences with CAI. If AK variants were selling at 1980's prices, it would not be as big of an issue for me. When even the cheaper variants run around $500+ at local gun stores, it is a bigger deal.

 

[Cerberus]

You are lucky to have not had any problems.

It ain't luck. I actually have a very calibrated eyeball.

Many of the AK74 variants do not even have a true 5.45 barrel - they utilize a .223 barrel. Guess what this leads to when firing 5.45x39?

Ah yes, the infamous Century Tantals.

Keep in mind too, the company you buy from can make a difference if you find yourself in the unlucky category. Arsenal will generally bend over backwards to take care of serious issues - I cannot say the same about my experiences with CAI. If AK variants were selling at 1980's prices, it would not be as big of an issue for me. When even the cheaper variants run around $500+ at local gun stores, it is a bigger deal.

Century does offer some lemons. Have heard some not so glowing reports of their recently offered GP75, or whatever they were calling the thing. Mag wobble in real AKs is not uncommon either. Other than that I ain't scared of a WASR, especially now that they seem to be paying more attention to the old sight issue.

.

 

[iauffenberg]

i like my yugo m70 b1 then my norinco is second then my sar 1

 

[tradertator]

I really try hard to stay away from anything CAI touches. It's a real crapshoot if you'll get a lemon or not, and their customer service is non existant.

 

[Tombs]

As far as a fighting rifle?

Saiga or Vepr.
Of course we all know (or I hope people would know by now) that arsenals are just saigas imported/converted.

Best quality? Polytech.

It's not like money is much of an issue when talking about saigas/arsenals. You can get a saiga cheap and eventually build it up to spec, or you can get an arsenal with everything already done for less than it'd cost you to do the work yourself.
Considering a wasr vs a saiga is even an argument, I have to laugh on price alone. Usually a saiga will still cost less, and it will actually work.

 

[Shootin'IN]

This is true, but it is always a tradeoff.

7.62x39 penetrates barriers better. The 5.45x39 is much closer to the 5.56.

It depends on what ammo you are using.
If you use wolf or bear 5.45x39 you won't get much penetration but if you shoot the surplus 7N6 or better you will get much better penetration on hard objects.
Here is a little info I found.
"The 7N6 bullet has a 1.43 g (22.1 gr) steel rod penetrator. Since 1987 this penetrator is hardened to 60 HRC. The latter 7N6 cartridge can penetrate a 6 mm thick St3 steel plate at 300 m and 6Zh85T body armour at 80 m. 7N6 bullets have a red identification ring above the cartridge neck."
5.45×39mm - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I have shot through 3/8" thick steel at 100yds with it.

 

[Shootin'IN]

Call me odd, but I would still prefer a $500 AK over the $1000 version. At $1000, I could have a lower make, 10 steel mags and 1k of ammo, and still get the same function and accuracy from it.

$1000 for an AK it is cheaper to buy the tools & build your own!

 

[iwearcowboyboots]

Come on it's the AK you are talking about. just about any of them are going to run like they should, and have about the same accuracy give or take a 1/2". Go find the one that fits your budget and shoot the dog urine out of it.

This... just make sure you give it a good cleaning at least once a year and it should run fine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAUEYhqRGQI

 

[Clay]

2 things:

1) most if not all of the 7N6 in the US does not have the hardened penetrator. in fact some will argue that was is in the US is not really even 7N6, but actually 7N5 made in the early 80s. Most dont knwo the difference since the hard penetrator is the difference.

2) the red ring means nothing. that is just sealant put on both the case neck, and primer to help with long term storage. Most if not all military 5.45x39 will have this, and its not an indicator for anything.

It depends on what ammo you are using.
If you use wolf or bear 5.45x39 you won't get much penetration but if you shoot the surplus 7N6 or better you will get much better penetration on hard objects.
Here is a little info I found.
"The 7N6 bullet has a 1.43 g (22.1 gr) steel rod penetrator. Since 1987 this penetrator is hardened to 60 HRC. The latter 7N6 cartridge can penetrate a 6 mm thick St3 steel plate at 300 m and 6Zh85T body armour at 80 m. 7N6 bullets have a red identification ring above the cartridge neck."
5.45×39mm - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I have shot through 3/8" thick steel at 100yds with it.

 

[Reuben Cogburn]

Come on it's the AK you are talking about. just about any of them are going to run like they should, and have about the same accuracy give or take a 1/2". Go find the one that fits your budget and shoot the dog urine out of it.

This has been my experience.

The AK is for when SHTF.

I don't worry much about a 1/2" give or take.

 

[Cerberus]

$1000 for an AK it is cheaper to buy the tools & build your own!

Huh? Did I mention anything about building? Building is a whole different aspect.

 

[Atlas]

Here's a thought: I like to buy military-style firearms MADE by the nation that initiated the platform. Do, while a real Soviet AK is quite pricy, it is the basolute BEST option. Forget WASR copies, Arsenal junk build or Norinco "made of recycled car rims" thumb-hole sporting toys. Buy the ORIGINAL.

And if you don't have an unlimited budget, like most of us, here's your 2nd best option. You want an AK made by people who invented them, perfected them and produced them for YEARS, right? Buy a Saiga. With a few tools, a few hours and some parts you can convert it (legally 100%) to the AK configuration. AND you will have a real AK rifle, rather then a copy.

 

[tradertator]

Here's a thought: I like to buy military-style firearms MADE by the nation that initiated the platform. Do, while a real Soviet AK is quite pricy, it is the basolute BEST option. Forget WASR copies, Arsenal junk build or Norinco "made of recycled car rims" thumb-hole sporting toys. Buy the ORIGINAL.

And if you don't have an unlimited budget, like most of us, here's your 2nd best option. You want an AK made by people who invented them, perfected them and produced them for YEARS, right? Buy a Saiga. With a few tools, a few hours and some parts you can convert it (legally 100%) to the AK configuration. AND you will have a real AK rifle, rather then a copy.

Great advice on converting a Saiga instead of one of those Arsenal junk build copies . Much more authentic with bolt on parts than rivets.

 

[Clay]

Here's a thought: I like to buy military-style firearms MADE by the nation that initiated the platform. Do, while a real Soviet AK is quite pricy, it is the basolute BEST option. Forget WASR copies, Arsenal junk build or Norinco "made of recycled car rims" thumb-hole sporting toys. Buy the ORIGINAL.

Hmmmm Im guessing you don't really know that Arsenal, the *real* Arsenal (not Arsenal USA) is in Bulgaria, and makes some of THE best milled and stamped AK variants out there, right? Think SLR models.

All Arsenal USA does is take Russian built Saiga type AK variants and make then US legal. They are STILL made in the motherland.

 

[indyk]

Here's a thought: I like to buy military-style firearms MADE by the nation that initiated the platform. Do, while a real Soviet AK is quite pricy, it is the basolute BEST option. Forget WASR copies, Arsenal junk build or Norinco "made of recycled car rims" thumb-hole sporting toys. Buy the ORIGINAL.

And if you don't have an unlimited budget, like most of us, here's your 2nd best option. You want an AK made by people who invented them, perfected them and produced them for YEARS, right? Buy a Saiga. With a few tools, a few hours and some parts you can convert it (legally 100%) to the AK configuration. AND you will have a real AK rifle, rather then a copy.

Great advice on converting a Saiga instead of one of those Arsenal junk build copies . Much more authentic with bolt on parts than rivets.

Hmmmm Im guessing you don't really know that Arsenal, the *real* Arsenal (not Arsenal USA) is in Bulgaria, and makes some of THE best milled and stamped AK variants out there, right? Think SLR models.

All Arsenal USA does is take Russian built Saiga type AK variants and make then US legal. They are STILL made in the motherland.

LOL thanks for the educated responses Clay, Trade,

I bout lost my coffee when i read this.

Atlas
Ya think Arsenal is some new, rink-a-tink shop that sat up there in Nevada, Just by chance struck a multi million dollar agreement to pump out the best Russian Ak 100 series style rifle with none other than Izhmash???

Arsenal has been into AK's since AK's were AK's. since the 1950's
lemme help

Arsenal AD - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Arsenal Company Profile


SGL all the way
I couldn't get an AK anymore Russian than this with my resources or $$$
so Arsenal and Izhmash's SGL was the right ticket for me.
Quality and History!! with an affordable price.
And it can be made even more Russian

 

[Hellion_1]

Hmmmm Im guessing you don't really know that Arsenal, the *real* Arsenal (not Arsenal USA) is in Bulgaria, and makes some of THE best milled and stamped AK variants out there, right? Think SLR models.

All Arsenal USA does is take Russian built Saiga type AK variants and make then US legal. They are STILL made in the motherland.

^^^ What Clay Said!!^^^

Arsenal (of Bulgaria) is by far probably putting out the best NEW AK's on the market today. With that said, you can still get great AK's, but you are going to pay more than a WASR or Yugo PAP. Look for AK's that are completely built in the country of origin, not a parts kit that is imported and built on an American receiver. Also beware of rifles that have been originally designed for low-capacity mags and then opened up here in the USA to take hi-cap magazines. The following models are examples of great AK's you can still find on the used market.

Yugo M70AB1 or M70AB2 (Imported by Mitchell Arms)
Maadi ARM, RPM (Built on Russian tooling) (Intrac or Pars imports)
Norinco NHM series (90 or 91)
FEG SA (Original full import)
Romanian SAR-1

Hope this helps the OP out....

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Thanks for all the input, guys. I've got an SAR-1 with a bit of work done to it and it shoots fine. I was just wanting to add a nicer one to the safe as well, you know, to keep it company. It must get lonely in there with no one else who speaks your language.

Stuck in there basically alone, surrounded by American and Germans, makes you sad, no?