1911 half cock/ full cock

[AverageMidwest]

I have not personally had one but can guarantee you that it is the easiest was of having an AD. You are doing yourself and others around you a disservice by carrying in that manner. If you are going to carry, get an H and K, a Beretta, a Glock, one of Springfield's XD pistols, hell even get a wheel gun.

Anything is better than what you are doing. Carrying like that is just asking for problems. The 1911 is designed to be carried cocked and locked. One in the chamber, hammer back, and thumb safety on. If you are not comfortable carrying like that, you are not comfortable carrying that firearm. See above suggestions for a firearm you may be comfortable carrying.

Two thumbs way up.....cocked and locked is the only way, UNLESS you want to carry it with the hammer down on an empty chamber. Which is fine except for that extra time required to work the slide if you need it in a hurry. Never have tried that "Israeli draw", but it just seems like extra effort - takes enough practice to get comfortable with a 1911 already without adding additional fooling around during a draw.

 

[12many]

OK, yet another question(s) on the 1911. I figure i owe it to myself and everyone to COMPLETELY understand everything on my 1911. What is the pourpose of having a half cock? Surely its not for safety is it? Also, when I load my 1911, I insert the mag, and pull my slide back to put one in the chamber, from the mag. At this point the 1911 is fully cocked. The only way to decock it, as far as I know, is to slowly pull the trigger as your hanging on to the hammer, allowing it to close slowly. As Im new to carrying, im not 100% comforatable carrying lock and loaded. Has anyone ever had a 1911 go off decocking one like this?
Thanks
NEWBIE

Years ago I had a Colt Lightweight Combat Commander (I still kick myself for getting rid of that gun, damn ex-wife) and did have that happen to me, unfortunately in the house (thank the Lord for shag carpet). I think it may have been more of my mistake than the gun. I did carry it from time to time and always had it on half-cock. Not sure what the purpose is but it always worked well for me (except for the brain fart in the house)

 

[reeseg45]

Yes and as a result I took a .45 to the chest because the guy who was handling my 1911 decided to lower the hammer. Do not lower the hammer on a 1911 leave it cocked and safety it as intended. 04-18-2002 - Akron Man ‘Fair’ After Accidental Gun Wound theirs my proof

 

[JetGirl]

DON'T decock the 1911 with a round in the chamber. The hammer down on a loaded round is unsafe

the purpose of the half cock is in the even that the hammer slips pass the seer it still has the halfcock to stop it before hitting the firing pin.

These ^.

I have seen SEVERAL people carrying 1911s with the hammer closed.

Unfortunately, one that I know of is a freakin' "basic pistol SAFETY instructor". There's no trying to tell him it's not safe. You'd think he'd KNOW...but holy crap

BTW, there is absolutely no such thing as a stupid question. Thank you for being responsible and finding out the correct way.

This, too ^.

 

[evanrw61]

The only stupid question is the one not asked. Lots of good advice here.

 

[JetGirl]

I was about to ask jwardrip if he was going to post pictures of his 1911, until I realized this thread was from 2/11.

 

[drillsgt]

I carry a 1911 cocked and locked, and I've never had the safety come off for me. A friend of mine told me his did, but he used a crappy holster I think.

On a side note, I can't believe no one has tagged this thread "cock" lol.

Crappy holster may be possible, I have seen this happen with some of the cheaper mass produced holsters like Galco, but only the ones with thumb snaps, the thumb snap if twisted just a little bit would push down the thumb safety, it was easy to reproduce.

 

[poolman1]

cocked and locked only way to go has two safteys u will be fine and ready.

 

[Jarhead77]

Cocked, Locked and ready to rock...the only way to carry a 1911! Holster has to be "right" and you CANNOT be an ID 10 t!!

 

[BE Mike]

Thank you everyone who helped answer some of my questions and your advice is greatly appreciated. I learned alot from all of you, exspecially some really good information on what exactly half cocked is. I received a message from someone who really explained it, in terms that i understand a little bit better and I wanted to pass this along.....

The 1911 has a hammer notch that is not its cock notch, it's true. But it's not a half-cock notch, either.
It's there to catch the hammer in mid-fall, if somehow it should become dislodged from its cock notch, so it doesn't fall on the firing pin and ignite a cartridge accidentally.

It's there because, when the 1911 was originally to be used by the horse cavalry, cavalrymen were instructed to carry the pistol in Condition Two (hammer down on a cartridge in the chamber).
As you probably know, it is safe to carry a 1911 in Condition Two because the firing pin will not contact a cartridge's primer unless it has first been given a strong blow by the pistol's hammer. The Army thought that Condition Two was safer than Condition One, on horseback.
Cavalrymen were instructed to cock the pistol while it was still in its holster, and only then to make a presentation. The "half-cock" notch was there to catch the hammer, should the trooper's thumb slip.
The "half-cock" notch is neither strong enough nor deep enough to act as a safety device of the sort seen on the hammer of a Single Action Army revolver. It should never be used as a half-cock-safety notch.

We have a winner!

 

[straid]

Here's a good video on how the 1911 safety works. The "good stuff" starts around 6 minutes in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AzGCX-HClc

 

[Double T]

It is unsafe to carry a 1911 with no firing pin block with hammer down on a loaded chamber, still wouldn't do it with a firing pin block; but at least it'd be a little safer.

Half cock notch is also there in case of other things failing, not just dropping the hammer.

 

[JetGirl]

I kinda sorta maybe disagree around the 1:48 mark, where she said the grip safety was designed for a safer cocked and locked firearm.
On one hand, yes that's true by initial design... HOWEVER, if she meant that it was designed to make it safer than just the thumb safety, that is wrong.
The grip safety came first.
The 1910 (predecessor to the 1911) did not have a thumb safety, but DID have a grip safety.
Small bone to pick, I know...
I'll shut up now and watch the rest.

 

[Harleyrider_50]

Always carry cok'd 'n lok'd, but.....kind'a like Harleys.....it ain't for everbody.....

 

[Ljungman]

I carry a full size GI model 1911. Full mag +1 in chamber, cocked and locked. Its a mere understanding that if the thumb safety is on..then you, preventing accidental discharge, must release the safety, depress the back strap/palm safety, and pull the trigger....not likely to happen unless you mean for it too. But like above..if your not comfy and fuzzy feeling about it...please dont carry it. If you get into trouble and need your fire arm, you truly need to be completely automatic with it. If your nervous or uncomfortable with it..it may cost you or someone else dearly. Find a firearm you are more comfortable with. Many types of safeties and other devices and designs out there to choose from. The ones that bother me are glocks. that trigger safety never sat well with me..hence i carry my 1911...or my CZ52. Both can be carried cocked and locked. The cz actually has a decocker on it. But if you carry your 1911 with the hammer down..you will be fumbling with it in a situation where you are going to be stressed any way..that one more step will cost you valuable time and add one more thing to do when your mind is more focused elsewhere...and for good reason. This is a K.I.S.S. situation. Keep It Simple Stupid. Less gun to manipulate in an emergency the better. your 1911 is faster to deploy cocked and locked. You drop your thumb safety and voila...ready to go.

 

[kludge]

Has anyone ever had a 1911 go off decocking one like this?
Thanks
NEWBIE

YES!!!

My buddy has a hole through his refrigerator because a 1911 newbie was "uncomfortable" carrying cocked and locked.

There are two ways to safely carry a 1911...

1. "Cocked and Locked" (chamber loaded, hammer cocked, safety on)
2. Full magazine, chamber empty. You'll need to rack the slide/load the chamber before you can use it though.

If you're uncomfortable with either of those two, get a different gun. JMHO.

 

[ghitch75]

Thank you everyone who helped answer some of my questions and your advice is greatly appreciated. I learned alot from all of you, exspecially some really good information on what exactly half cocked is. I received a message from someone who really explained it, in terms that i understand a little bit better and I wanted to pass this along.....

The 1911 has a hammer notch that is not its cock notch, it's true. But it's not a half-cock notch, either.
It's there to catch the hammer in mid-fall, if somehow it should become dislodged from its cock notch, so it doesn't fall on the firing pin and ignite a cartridge accidentally.

It's there because, when the 1911 was originally to be used by the horse cavalry, cavalrymen were instructed to carry the pistol in Condition Two (hammer down on a cartridge in the chamber).
As you probably know, it is safe to carry a 1911 in Condition Two because the firing pin will not contact a cartridge's primer unless it has first been given a strong blow by the pistol's hammer. The Army thought that Condition Two was safer than Condition One, on horseback.
Cavalrymen were instructed to cock the pistol while it was still in its holster, and only then to make a presentation. The "half-cock" notch was there to catch the hammer, should the trooper's thumb slip.
The "half-cock" notch is neither strong enough nor deep enough to act as a safety device of the sort seen on the hammer of a Single Action Army revolver. It should never be used as a half-cock-safety notch.

rack it with one in the chamber...set hammer on firin' pin and drop it on the hammer and see what happens ......i don't care what the Army says.....if there is one in the pipe hammer back and safety on is still the safest.....you can drop it kick it and throw it in the air and i shouldn't go off if the gun is set up right...

 

[Mr Evilwrench]

Holy necrothreads, Batman! (Shh! Don't let Jetgirl hear me call my P12 a 1911) But it's the same thing, really, however, I've come to realize it does not, in fact, have a half cock. Not that I miss it. I do set my safety, but it gets wiped frequently because I use the wrong hand, not because of a defective holster. I'm starting to get comfortable with just the grip safety, which I've tested to my satisfaction (plus not being entirely a moron) so it doesn't send doodads up my spine when I see it's happened. Yes, 12+1, hammer back, thumb safety or not, ready to rock.

 

[JetGirl]

(Shh! Don't let Jetgirl hear me call my P12 a 1911) But it's the same thing, really

Oh good lord!!

 

[cbseniour]

Squeezing the trigger while holding the hammer and letting it down easy is how it was done for nearly 100 years. This is where the half cock feature comes in, If you carry one in the chamber hammer down a sudden impact to the hammer could cause an accidental discharge,however, the cocked and locked set up is actually safer because the hammer and slide are mechanically and positively locked. Also after you load one into t he chamber and lock the safety then drop the mag and add on on top this gives you an 8 round capacity rather than 7. One more chance at survival.