12 Gauge vs. 20 Gauge

[Dirc]

Go with the 12 gauge buy a cheap Lee load all and you will never run out of ammo.The good thing about shot guns is they can stoot anything you can fit in the shell from bird shot to rocks from the driveway.

As a bonus, if you get the Lee slug mold you can cast and load slugs using the same equipment you use to load shot.

 

[Sailor]

Ray D, please make a video showing us how to do that with random materials please!!!!!!

When you are loading the shell, instead of dropping in the lead shot you drop in the salt, gravel, or whatever. Video is not really needed.

 

[RealTree]

Been thinking about the same debate. However with a wife around 90 lbs. I think a 20 gauge makes the most sense. On top of that, shot placement is the key to it all...and not as much caliber. 12 would knock down anything as long as you shoot in the right direction. 20 will knock down anything as long as you place the shot in the kill zone just my two cents

 

[goinggreyfast]

We have a 20 and a 410 here. As I have gotten older, I have become less of a fan of recoil. The 20 is equipped with a short, rifled barrel and pistol grip, but I have a long barrel (turkey choke--interchangeable) and a standard stock should I want to use it for hunting foul, rabbit, etc. The rifled barrel would work fine for larger game where a slug would be needed.

The 410 is basically my wife's gun. For HD, it's loaded with Winchester Elites (the "judge round") Our home is small enough where it will be extremely effective should the need arise.

IMHO, it's what you are comfortable with and stocking up on ammo is what is most important. If I REALLY need to reach out and "touch someone" we have rifles for that. (God forbid it would ever come to that.)

Up close and personal--I feel we are fine with what we have.

 

[Kmcinnes]

I've been doing alot of thinking and a lot of research....... A shotgun was some pretty weight to it. As well as the ammo.

Now imagine a shotgun with a full barrel of shotgun ammo= more weight.

For a SHTF, a simple 5.56/223 rifle and a few mags would be lighter than a shotgun.

If you're using slug rounds, depending on your rifle, you can get some good distance.


Given it some thought, i will add a shotgun to my SHTF stock. Just because it has tremendous stopping power at close range, giving it a for close range.

With some practice, you can use it to hunt deer using 00 buck or slugs.

Would i use it for home protection? Probably- but the range is limited for bird shot. For 00 buck or slug shells, practice might help. But i'd rather have a simple rifle for long distance protection.

Also, you have the challenge of
Pump or Semi?

If you're wounded, a pump might be tricky to operate (if you get shot in the arm). Semi.....from what i've read, it needs more cleaning (Specially after shooting) because it's gas operated.

My shotgun is no heavier than my AR15, the difference is the weight distribution with the longer barrel of the 12 gauge. They both have their purpose but I do consider my 12 gauge shotgun as one of my most important SHTF home defense guns! As for range, you can easily hit something 75 to 100 ft away and do some damage and you should have no problem hitting someone crowding your personal space with it. It might not kill em but it will slow them down and make them re-think. I used to think along the same lines as you until my wife got me the 12 gauge for Christmas, once I shot it I realized how awesome it is. Reading and research is great, but its someone else's opinion until you actually get something in the field and try it for yourself and decide how it works for you.

My preference is 12 gauge because ammo is relatively cheap and plentiful! I am pretty sure I will be able to find more 12g ammo than .223 in a SHTF situation.

Here is a video my son took of me breaking in my Shotgun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gl8Y7ipQ2jg&feature=youtu.be

 

[longbow]

coach gun?

 

[Kmcinnes]

Coach Guns are cool, my dad has one and it is Bad A$$!

 

[Zoub]

Been thinking about the same debate. However with a wife around 90 lbs. I think a 20 gauge makes the most sense. On top of that, shot placement is the key to it all...and not as much caliber. 12 would knock down anything as long as you shoot in the right direction. 20 will knock down anything as long as you place the shot in the kill zone just my two cents

Get a semi auto 20 or build a pump 20 on a Knoxx stock (Blackhawk).

No one will argue with her that she just just shot them in the nuts with a 20 gauge instead of the more lethal 12 gauge. Dead is dead regardless of the gauge.

 

[draftsman]

20g, so the rest of the family can shoot it

 

[gunbunnies]

I would say generally speaking the 12 guage is going to be more prevalent when scavenging ammo... and the 12 can be loaded or purchased to be more shoulder friendly, plus the knoxx stock works on that guage also...

 

[LtScott14]

Coach guns rock. Mines a 20ga w/ hammers. Also have all 12ga models: Semi, pump, single shot. Like both, and seem to favor the pump 12ga for Deer and target. The single shot is a H&R Survivor model, so thinking of looking for a .223, or 44mag bbl to swap calibers. Have shells on belts ready to deploy if needed.

 

[ATOMonkey]

Also remember that the first shot guns were muzzle loaders. Just something to think about.

If things get truly truly desperate, you can always fall back on your trust .50 cal smoothe bore muzzle loader to take whatever game you like.

Load it with a foster slug and go deer hunting. Load it with shot and go bird hunting. All with black powder you made in your back yard.

Easy peasy lemon squeezy. If you want to get real fancy, you can even have a black powder rifle for shooting .50 cal bullets (just make sure you get the proper twist rate for your bullet weight and not the sabot twist rate).

As far as the OPs question is concerned. Go with the 12 gauge. More shot per round means more of a chance of killing whatever you're shooting at.

Don't think of a shotgun as a primary solid projectile gun. The shotgun slug is just a compromise for states with idiotic laws. Ballistics for slugs are AWFUL, even sabot rounds aren't great for 3 reasons. 1) Shotgun pressures are LOW especially compared to most cased rifle ammunition. 2) The twist rate is too low for the weight fo the "slug". This is done to maintain contact between the bullet and the sabot. You spin it too fast and all you'll do is spin the sabot around the bullet. 3) You always run the risk that the sabot won't fall away properly. This results in fliers, that contact no where near your point of aim.

The foster type slug is no better since velocity falls off dramatically after about 50 yards.

First and foremost, a shotgun is a SHOT gun. If you want to shoot solids, the best thing to do is get a rifle designed to shoot your intended round. Now, if it's all you got, it'll do, but it's not ideal by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[ATOMonkey]

As far as recoil goes, tell whoever is shooting the thing to "man up" and hold the gun properly. There is no round you can fire out of a 12 ga that is "unmanagable."

Hold it tight in your shoulder and get a solid stance. Even my 10 year old nephew was able to fire solid coppers out of a 12 ga after a little coaching.

 

[Bill B]

Comparison of 20v12 slugs:
http://www.winchester.com/Products/shotshell-ammunition/supreme/winchester-slugs/Pages/default.aspx

 

[gunbunnies]

With a pump.... if he can make black powder and has hulls and some 209 primers he can safely use black powder cartridges in his pump...

I know they do make a black powder bbl replacement for the Mossy 500 pump 12 G.

Slugs might be inaccurate as far as true rifle rounds are but theres nothing like a 12 G 1 ounce steel, copper, or lead slug hitting your target at close range.... Most doors and automobiles don't fare well to that type of brute power...

 

[ATOMonkey]

For close range, you're better off with using 1.5 - 2.0 oz of shot. Multiple wound channels cause more damage and are MUCH harder to treat. They also increase bleeding.

 

[indiucky]

My vote is for the 20 gauge. Most of us have families and I want every member of the family to be comfortable with the weapon. We have a 20 gauge rossi coach gun for our house shotgun. My wife does not like 12 gauges and does not like pumps but she can load up that little rossi and have it ready to roll quick. Any ballistic or foraging advantage to the 12 gauge is lost if just one member of your "team" i.e. family is not comfortable with it. With that being said my SHTF shotgun is an 12 gauge 870 mariner (or whatever the nickel 870 is called) but I can assure you I would feel just as comfortable with the little 20 gauge. My favorite SHTF dhotgun is a flintlock Brown Bess musket. It will be running long after all of the shot shells are depleted.

Just my

 

[Walkersdlx]

I seen somewhere on here. This guy fitted his stock on his 12g. The stock held adapters for the single shot that made it a 22lr, 9mm, 20g, and some other's i think. It was a cool project.

 

[fatduk1963]

12 for me .my daughter was the only GIRL in Huntington Co. 4H shooting last year she was 14. I got her a youth 20, and she Hated it. but she loves my mossy12 pump. and my buddys 870 12. she says that 20 is NOT hers its a loaner. so we keep 4 or 5 boxes of #6 shot around .

 

[Zoub]

For close range, you're better off with using 1.5 - 2.0 oz of shot. Multiple wound channels cause more damage and are MUCH harder to treat. They also increase bleeding.

Not really, by adding more and more lead, the ft/lbs per projectile are less so the lethality of the load can come into question very quickly. An example is the use of #4 buck, it shreds the hell out of stuff, but it will have limitations when it comes to penetration, especially on heavy coats, leather or winter clothing. Anything smaller is a true waste.

I have seen two people have their heads blown off with shotguns. One due to violence, one due to a hunting accident. I also know two people who survied close range blasts with a shotgun, both from violent attacks.

The key to killing with a shotgun is the proper application of physics at both ends of the gun. Your shoulder and the target.