Why Do So Many On INGO Hate HOA's?

[Ingomike]

I thought we were, most of us, men of our word, our handshake is our bond. If one does not like the terms of a particular HOA or any HOA they are free to buy a home where they do like the covenants or a property without any covenants. There are certainly documented cases where an HOA overstepped its covenants but so have most human ran entities, and is not that common.

For those that hate HOA's do you like junkyard neighbors? Cars on blocks? Yards not mowed? Houses in visible disrepair? I saw a INGO classified promoting how if you bought his off road vehicle you could tick off the the HOA. LOL! Same guy would likely trash someone that said they would like to look at it but no showed, going back on their word, but going back on your word with your neighbors is soo funny.

It is not a dictator telling you what to do with your property, like many believe it is. It is a contract as to how neighbors will live together. If you want to park an RV or boat in your drive, buy a home that either has no covenants (the contract of how neighbors will live together legally recorded with the deeds) or an agreement that allows for what you want to do. If you buy with no covenants your neighbors can literally do anything the local government does not enforce.

A friend had a nice house near 25th and post, once an upper middle class neighborhood, guy behind him paved the entire backyard and began running a small 4 wrecker towing service from there. Diesel trucks running all night in the winter 20-50 feet from neighbors trying to sleep. Neighbors tried to stop it but city didn't care and they had no covenants to enforce.

The smaller the lots the greater the need for an HOA to stop the human idiocy at close range. A very important function is many HOA's are updating their covenants to limit or stop home rentals in the neighborhood. This is due to the literally trillions of dollars turning entire neighborhoods into rental complexes.

Complaining about an HOA, in most cases, is just showing ones self to have not understood what they agreed to live by when they bought or that their needs have changed and they think the agreement should be changed to accommodate them.

An HOA and covenants are an agreement the owner agreed to when they bought the land, no more no less. Please understand the agreement you are making before buying the house and everyone will be happier.

 

[AtTheMurph]

I think that the dislike for HOAs in in direct proportion to the amount of contract documents a person actually reads before signing on the dotted line.

I've been to closings (was in the mortgage business years ago) and was always appalled by the amount of people who would just sign off on every document without reading what they were actually signing.

I think every closing should be video recorded and every buyer asked, "did you read this document" and then let them sign. So when hey go to court or get sued by their HOAs the evidence of their own stupidity is on trial.

 

[KLB]

You seem to miss the point that many of us, at least, that are so against them, DO choose to not live under one. I for one do not care if you wish to, I will not. Then again I just choose to live where I have very few neighbors, so it isn't much of an issue.

As for what others do with their property, that is their business, not mine.

 

[Ingomike]

I think that the dislike for HOAs in in direct proportion to the amount of contract documents a person actually reads before signing on the dotted line.

I've been to closings (was in the mortgage business years ago) and was always appalled by the amount of people who would just sign off on every document without reading what they were actually signing.

I think every closing should be video recorded and every buyer asked, "did you read this document" and then let them sign. So when hey go to court or get sued by their HOAs the evidence of their own stupidity is on trial.

All Indiana Realtor purchase agreements specify the days a seller has to deliver HOA docs and the days a buyer has to review them, and respond if they do not want to agree with them. Covenants are not a part of closing.

 

[Ingomike]

You seem to miss the point that many of us, at least, that are so against them, DO choose to not live under one. I for one do not care if you wish to, I will not. Then again I just choose to live where I have very few neighbors, so it isn't much of an issue.

As for what others do with their property, that is their business, not mine.

I fully understand those that do not want covenants and an HOA on their property. My issue is with those that agree to the covenants then, at a minimum whine, if not outright violate the agreement the agreed to.

Your last statement works well in the country with houses a mile apart, but does not work very we'll when one house is 10 feet from the neighbors house.

 

[AtTheMurph]

All Indiana Realtor purchase agreements specify the days a seller has to deliver HOA docs and the days a buyer has to review them, and respond if they do not want to agree with them. Covenants are not a part of closing.

The agreement says that there is an HOA and the terms. most times I have seen HOA documents delivered at closing. Even if not, why would someone close without reviewing the HOA documents?

 

[armalitesheepdog]

I agree. A deal is a deal is a deal. Real men honor there word. Or at least used to. I choose not to live under a HOA. I do not like being told what ICan and can not do. I also understand that means my neighbor might have 4 junk cars he is going to fix up never. That said if I did ever buy a home in a HOA neighborhood I would respect the contract I agreed to

 

[BugI02]

I thought we were, most of us, men of our word, our handshake is our bond. If one does not like the terms of a particular HOA or any HOA they are free to buy a home where they do like the covenants or a property without any covenants. There are certainly documented cases where an HOA overstepped its covenants but so have most human ran entities, and is not that common.

For those that hate HOA's do you like junkyard neighbors? Cars on blocks? Yards not mowed? Houses in visible disrepair? I saw a INGO classified promoting how if you bought his off road vehicle you could tick off the the HOA. LOL! Same guy would likely trash someone that said they would like to look at it but no showed, going back on their word, but going back on your word with your neighbors is soo funny.

It is not a dictator telling you what to do with your property, like many believe it is. It is a contract as to how neighbors will live together. If you want to park an RV or boat in your drive, buy a home that either has no covenants (the contract of how neighbors will live together legally recorded with the deeds) or an agreement that allows for what you want to do. If you buy with no covenants your neighbors can literally do anything the local government does not enforce.

A friend had a nice house near 25th and post, once an upper middle class neighborhood, guy behind him paved the entire backyard and began running a small 4 wrecker towing service from there. Diesel trucks running all night in the winter 20-50 feet from neighbors trying to sleep. Neighbors tried to stop it but city didn't care and they had no covenants to enforce.

The smaller the lots the greater the need for an HOA to stop the human idiocy at close range. A very important function is many HOA's are updating their covenants to limit or stop home rentals in the neighborhood. This is due to the literally trillions of dollars turning entire neighborhoods into rental complexes.

Complaining about an HOA, in most cases, is just showing ones self to have not understood what they agreed to live by when they bought or that their needs have changed and they think the agreement should be changed to accommodate them.

An HOA and covenants are an agreement the owner agreed to when they bought the land, no more no less. Please understand the agreement you are making before buying the house and everyone will be happier.

We're Americans. We don't like to be told what to do - by anybody

 

[HoughMade]

I prefer to live among people who are responsible and do not need a legal document to make them be reasonable. My neighbors decide when to mow their own yards. They don't park junk cars around, etc., etc., etc.....there is a way besides contracting rights away to have a reasonable level of surety that your neighbors won't be total a-holes with their property.

...so I choose to live somewhere without contractual nanny-ism. That's my choice. Feel free to make another. I won't criticize you for it...unless, of course, complaints about the HOA start rolling in.

 

[KLB]

I fully understand those that do not want covenants and an HOA on their property. My issue is with those that agree to the covenants then, at a minimum whine, if not outright violate the agreement the agreed to.

Your last statement works well in the country with houses a mile apart, but does not work very we'll when one house is 10 feet from the neighbors house.

I loved in a neighborhood with Garden lots and no HOA, never had an issue in the 9 years I was there.

I live in the country now though, but there are a few houses on my side of the mile of road I live on.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

We were one of the first houses in our neighborhood when Dad built the house in 1952. There are very few, if any rentals in the neighborhood, at least that I'm aware of. Everyone seems to take pride in their properties, and there is no HOA. We did have one exception (crazy guy that moved in next door and trashed what had once been one of the showcase properties in the neighborhood). He was foreclosed on after about 2 years and the family that bought the place has restored it to its former glory and then some.

I would never willingly move into a neighborhood with a HOA, but that's my choice. I don't like the idea of someone telling me what kind of mailbox I must have, or which color palette I must choose from for the trim on my house, whether or not I can have a fenced in yard, etc.. Some people may value that, and that's fine for them. Just not for me.

 

[rooster]

hard to find a home around Indianapolis that doesn’t have an HOA anymore.

that said I’ve seen the last two I’ve lived under sign questionable lawn care contracts that made me think someone was getting a kickback.

one of the ones I’ve lived under had a president that would drive around the neighborhood all the time( like a every day multiply times per day taking notes like he was a detective) and if your boat was out for more than the allotted time by an hour he sent out a letter. Guy was power tripping hard. Also had a garage full of crap and kept a Porsche outside in the elements..........

oh ya other problems I have with them. If you read the docs many of these HOA’s can only have rules changed if a ridiculous % of homeowners come to a meeting. One of the neighborhoods I lived in had a fair number of corporate rentals and the HOA board had to have 70% of homeowners in attendance to put forth any changes to covenants. Since the rentals were corporate owned that was never going to happen.

also had a friend who had to get an new mailbox and it had to be from the approved vendor, which turned out to be some random guy who didn’t seem to actually own a business. Shady stuff...

 

[Ingomike]

The agreement says that there is an HOA and the terms. most times I have seen HOA documents delivered at closing. Even if not, why would someone close without reviewing the HOA documents?

Then the seller is not fulfilling their obligation to provide per the timeframes of the PA and the buyers agent is failing the buyer by not ensuring that they are delivered in a timely fashion. Most folks probably cannot understand them.

 

[Ingomike]

We were one of the first houses in our neighborhood when Dad built the house in 1952. There are very few, if any rentals in the neighborhood, at least that I'm aware of. Everyone seems to take pride in their properties, and there is no HOA. We did have one exception (crazy guy that moved in next door and trashed what had once been one of the showcase properties in the neighborhood). He was foreclosed on after about 2 years and the family that bought the place has restored it to its former glory and then some.

I would never willingly move into a neighborhood with a HOA, but that's my choice. I don't like the idea of someone telling me what kind of mailbox I must have, or which color palette I must choose from for the trim on my house, whether or not I can have a fenced in yard, etc.. Some people may value that, and that's fine for them. Just not for me.

The rental issue is a fairly new one, and has not been the problem, YET, that other areas have had. The issue is the investment funds have found an investment that yields better than, "buddy I got a hot stock tip" that cannot go down to zero. This will be another facet of "you will own nothing" as the price of homes will skyrocket, oops, they already are, as this big money comes into town and will compete with you and your families for property.

The housing market as we once new it is over. Big money found it.

You guys hate HOA's, wait till you see the corporate rental contracts...

 

[Route 45]

If you buy with no covenants your neighbors can literally do anything the local government does not enforce.

Might depend on where you're at, but most cities have municipal codes that address quality of life issues in neighborhoods. My particular area of the city has had pretty good enforcement, from personal experience regarding a former neighbor. To be fair, the city doesn't care what color his mailbox is.

A friend had a nice house near 25th and post, once an upper middle class neighborhood, guy behind him paved the entire backyard and began running a small 4 wrecker towing service from there. Diesel trucks running all night in the winter 20-50 feet from neighbors trying to sleep. Neighbors tried to stop it but city didn't care and they had no covenants to enforce.

I find it hard to believe that this isn't a zoning violation.

Surprising to me that someone who values freedom would subject themselves to an HOA. I've lived in one neighborhood with an HOA, and don't see myself doing it again. If the neighbor's boat in his driveway is bothering me because it's 15 feet away from my driveway, I bought in the wrong neighborhood anyway.

 

[Ingomike]

I prefer to live among people who are responsible and do not need a legal document to make them be reasonable. My neighbors decide when to mow their own yards. They don't park junk cars around, etc., etc., etc.....there is a way besides contracting rights away to have a reasonable level of surety that your neighbors won't be total a-holes with their property.

...so I choose to live somewhere without contractual nanny-ism. That's my choice. Feel free to make another. I won't criticize you for it...unless, of course, complaints about the HOA start rolling in.

How does one insure that their neighbors are responsible? That you do not have to live with the wrecker service in your backyard or wait for DD's neighbor to be foreclosed?

 

[DoggyDaddy]

The rental issue is a fairly new one, and has not been the problem, YET, that other areas have had. The issue is the investment funds have found an investment that yields better than, "buddy I got a hot stock tip" that cannot go down to zero. This will be another facet of "you will own nothing" as the price of homes will skyrocket, oops, they already are, as this big money comes into town and will compete with you and your families for property.

The housing market as we once new it is over. Big money found it.

You guys hate HOA's, wait till you see the corporate rental contracts...

Eh, housing markets go up and down like anything else. I don't think what we're seeing now is a permanent situation. It's not "big money" that is paying over asking prices for houses on the market now. It's people (families) just trying to buy a home for the most part in a market with high demand (because of low interest rates) and limited supply (for materials cost for new construction).

 

[bobzilla]

HOA means being near people. I don't want to live close enough to people for that to be an issue.

Also, most HOA's are or end up populated by Nepolianites that are using their newfound "power" to boss people around. I want nothing to do with that either. If you want a junk yard, go for it. You want a perfectly manicured lawn suitable for a golf course green do it. I just want to be left alone to live my life in peace. Some people are just bound and determined that no one shall be happy. **** those people.

 

[HoughMade]

How does one insure that their neighbors are responsible? That you do not have to live with the wrecker service in your backyard or wait for DD's neighbor to be foreclosed?

I would be specific, but I would be accused of elitism.

Suffice to say, I look around.

...and HOAs do not prevent foreclosure...not by a long shot.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

How does one insure that their neighbors are responsible? That you do not have to live with the wrecker service in your backyard or wait for DD's neighbor to be foreclosed?

Like Route 45 said, most cities and towns have some kind of zoning regulations that can come into play. For example, all vehicles (even if parked on your property) must have current tags, which caused my crazy neighbor to get rid of some of the ones he had.