URGENT! MAN WITH LONG GUN ON IUPUI CAMPUS DOWNTOWN

[Whosyer]

The linked article states the police took 3 reports. The original report states the gun was seen in the trunk of the car. Can anyone find any other information regarding the other two reports? I'd really like to know what they say before I go all "I told you so" to some idiots on facebook who think I'm extremist for demanding more information before getting worried about a guypossessing a gun.

Can't post link from my phone for some reason, but article on WIBC stated that the two additional reports, were not credible. I'm guessing that once the text alerts went out, the sheep on campus were seeing a gunman behind every tree.

 

[MolonLabe7]

Just do what Joe Biden says and shoot off 2 rounds with a double barreled shotgun. he will leave.

 

[jmiller676]

To some this up, a freaked out over emotional chick thought she saw a gun, reported it and called the cops. Shutdown the campus for the afternoon and the childrens hospital. All the sheep were bleating for help when they heard some leaves rustle. I feel an IUPUI open carry event soon.

“Paranoia is just the bastard child of fear and good sense."

 

[w_ADAM_d88]

I feel an IUPUI open carry event soon.

I'd be all in for this. Best bet would be to park offsite and just walk through the campus to another location.

 

[Captain Morgan]

Can't post link from my phone for some reason, but article on WIBC stated that the two additional reports, were not credible. I'm guessing that once the text alerts went out, the sheep on campus were seeing a gunman behind every tree.

News

While WIBC states the other two reports weren't credible, it also states the man was possibly carrying a gun. It states the woman saw the man exit a sedan, but doesn't say he exited WITH the gun. I'd love to see the actual police report, but I doubt that will happen.

 

[g00n24]

So, were the police not letting students leave until they allowed themselves to be searched, like they did out east a couple of weeks ago when a similar situation happened?

They (LEOs) came in our building and told everyone to stay where they were or go to a secure area (whatever that means in a gun-free-zone). However, after our patients were told to go home for the day we just took off. No one standing by the door keeping us in, nothing locked, maybe in some of the other buildings...I don't know. When I left there were people walking around campus like nothing was going on...basically because, nothing was going on.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Fox 59 reporting that NO ONE saw ANY person with a firearm.

IMPD is on now saying that sending the entire department, plus Human Resources, was not an overreaction.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Well, at least student, and non-student pranksters, now know how to shut down IUPUI.

 

[ModernGunner]

To hunterft6 - No worries. Some times the wrong button gets hit or whatever. Not a problem.

The problem is laws don't state what is legal, they state what is illegal, sometimes with exceptions. Thus you will not find what you are looking for. Rest assured that there have been many discussions about colleges and it is ONLY against policy, not against the law. The only time it is illegal is when there is a daycare or other off limits facility on the campus but even then it is only illegal in that area.

Thanks. However, I would point out that "many discussions about colleges" does NOT make it legal to carry on a campus because those 'discussing' it believe a college / university is not a "school". In fact, colleges / universities are often referenced as "secondary schools" or "post-secondary schools", or "schools of higher learning".

Case in point - Lawyers, Doctors, Nurses, Dentists, etc. go to "law school", "medical school", "nursing school", and "dental school", respectively. Which are housed... where? At colleges and universities.

So, it can certainly be determined that colleges / universities ARE "school" UNLESS there is some determination, something, that, for the purposes of carrying on campuses, colleges / universities are NOT "schools".

With respect to all who may be Officers of the Court, personal opinions don't really matter. If colleges / universities are NOT "schools", there must be something that so states that determination. Otherwise, it can be easily and readily 'argued' that they ARE "schools", and thus fall under 35-47-9.

I would wholeheartedly agree that, generally speaking, if some law doesn't specifically prohibit an action, it's legal to perform that action. However, that's not what I was 'arguing', nor was I 'arguing' that colleges / universities might have a policy regarding carry. That 'argument' isn't really applicable here anyway because it would appear that, based on the references noted above, colleges / universities ARE considered "schools" UNLESS there's something legislatively written that specifically states they are not.

And that's what I was asking for. Someone stated they're not "schools", and I was just respectfully requesting that information, and citation, for my own future reference, so I do not get caught up in some Catch/22. If that scenario were to happen, my stating "Well, there have been many discussions, and some lawyers believe that this campus isn't a school. So, I'm all good to go, and you can't arrest me!"

 

[jbombelli]

All this uproar, and nobody even saw ANYTHING?

I find myself in a bewilderment. I wonder how much today cost the taxpayer.

 

[bwframe]

Well, at least student, and non-student pranksters, now know how to shut down IUPUI.

Or a terrorist with bad intentions knows how to divert all attention to a campus area.

 

[jbombelli]

To hunterft6 - No worries. Some times the wrong button gets hit or whatever. Not a problem.



Thanks. However, I would point out that "many discussions about colleges" does NOT make it legal to carry on a campus because those 'discussing' it believe a college / university is not a "school". In fact, colleges / universities are often referenced as "secondary schools" or "post-secondary schools", or "schools of higher learning".

Case in point - Lawyers, Doctors, Nurses, Dentists, etc. go to "law school", "medical school", "nursing school", and "dental school", respectively. Which are housed... where? At colleges and universities.

So, it can certainly be determined that colleges / universities ARE "school" UNLESS there is some determination, something, that, for the purposes of carrying on campuses, colleges / universities are NOT "schools".

With respect to all who may be Officers of the Court, personal opinions don't really matter. If colleges / universities are NOT "schools", there must be something that so states that determination. Otherwise, it can be easily and readily 'argued' that they ARE "schools", and thus fall under 35-47-9.

I would wholeheartedly agree that, generally speaking, if some law doesn't specifically prohibit an action, it's legal to perform that action. However, that's not what I was 'arguing', nor was I 'arguing' that colleges / universities might have a policy regarding carry. That 'argument' isn't really applicable here anyway because it would appear that, based on the references noted above, colleges / universities ARE considered "schools" UNLESS there's something legislatively written that specifically states they are not.

And that's what I was asking for. Someone stated they're not "schools", and I was just respectfully requesting that information, and citation, for my own future reference, so I do not get caught up in some Catch/22. If that scenario were to happen, my stating "Well, there have been many discussions, and some lawyers believe that this campus isn't a school. So, I'm all good to go, and you can't arrest me!"

Instead, since we can't prove a negative ... go find the definition of "school" in the Indiana Code that INCLUDES colleges and universities. Good luck.

 

[sepe]

Instead, since we can't prove a negative ... go find the definition of "school" in the Indiana Code that INCLUDES colleges and universities. Good luck.

There are many colleges and universities with licensed daycare, preschools, and some (like BSU) with some sort of K-12. Does it, then, just apply to those portions of the campus or would it be campus-wide?

 

[jbombelli]

There are many colleges and universities with licensed daycare, preschools, and some (like BSU) with some sort of K-12. Does it, then, just apply to those portions of the campus or would it be campus-wide?

To the best of my knowledge it applies to those areas of the respective campus, since it would apply to that portion of the property being used for that purpose, since the rest of the property is not under the control of the daycare/preschool/whatever and is not being used by it. But I am not 100% sure on that.

 

[Boring2u]

Finally, could / would someone be willing to post the exact IC that it's NOT illegal to carry a firearm on to University or College property? Someone posted this (IC 35-47-9):

Indiana Code 35-47-9

But that information does NOT say it's legal (or, not illegal) to carry a weapon on campus. IC 35-47-9 only states that it's legal IF the person carrying the weapon legally possesses it AND the weapon is in their vehicle AND they're dropping off or picking someone up on the school property. Someone (later response) also stated that a 'university or college' is NOT a school. Someone have the IN statute that so states this?

Thanks in advance for any assistance.

IC 35-47-9 covers Possession of Firearms on "School Property" and School Buses. IC 20-33-8-5 defines "School Property" as

1. A building or other structure owned or rented by a school corporation
2. The grounds adjacent to and owned or rented in common with a building or other structure owned or rented by a school corporation.

(Granted, 20-33-8-5 also states that the definition is for chapter 20-33-8, specifically)

To continue that train, 20-18-2-16 (a) states:
"School corporation", for purposes of this title , means a public school corporation established by Indiana law. The term includes a:

(1) school city;
(2) school town;
(3) school township;
(4) consolidated school corporation;
(5) metropolitan school district;
(6) township school corporation;
(7) county school corporation;
(8) united school corporation; or
(9) community school corporation.​

Other variations of 20-18-2-16 include Charter Schools and "a joint career and technical education program created under IC 20-37-1"

I know this doesn't clearly state that Colleges are excluded, and it does not specify that the definition applies to Gun Laws (frankly, 20-33-8 covers Student Discipline). It's the closest thing I could find in the IC related to the definition of school without carefully combing all INGO posts.

Reminder: IANAL

Also, don't forget the potential definition of "School Buses"

 

[Captain Morgan]

Questions raised about confusion around IUPUI gunman alert - 13 WTHR Indianapolis

Another article from WTHR that states the gun never left the trunk of the car. I got unfriended on facebook because I'm an ******* with a narrow world view who hijacked a concerned person's thread alerting people about a safety issue, which as it turns out was a complete overreaction by uthorities after a gun was seen in the trunk of a car. I so wish I'd screen captured the thread.

 

[bwframe]

Where are the students in the news interviews who should be saying, "We were totally defenseless in this gun free zone."?

 

[philo]

IC 35-47-9 covers Possession of Firearms on "School Property" and School Buses. IC 20-33-8-5 defines "School Property" as

1. A building or other structure owned or rented by a school corporation
2. The grounds adjacent to and owned or rented in common with a building or other structure owned or rented by a school corporation.

(Granted, 20-33-8-5 also states that the definition is for chapter 20-33-8, specifically)

To continue that train, 20-18-2-16 (a) states:
"School corporation", for purposes of this title , means a public school corporation established by Indiana law. The term includes a:

(1) school city;
(2) school town;
(3) school township;
(4) consolidated school corporation;
(5) metropolitan school district;
(6) township school corporation;
(7) county school corporation;
(8) united school corporation; or
(9) community school corporation.​

Other variations of 20-18-2-16 include Charter Schools and "a joint career and technical education program created under IC 20-37-1"

I know this doesn't clearly state that Colleges are excluded, and it does not specify that the definition applies to Gun Laws (frankly, 20-33-8 covers Student Discipline). It's the closest thing I could find in the IC related to the definition of school without carefully combing all INGO posts.

Reminder: IANAL

Also, don't forget the potential definition of "School Buses"

You are quoting the wrong code. IC35-47 will rely on the definitions in 35-31.5 not 20-18. Here it is:

IC 35-31.5-2-285
"School property"
Sec. 285. "School property" means the following:
(1) A building or other structure owned or rented by:
(A) a school corporation;
(B) an entity that is required to be licensed under IC 12-17.2 or IC 31-27;
(C) a private school that is not supported and maintained by funds realized from the imposition of a tax on property, income, or sales; or
(D) a federal, state, local, or nonprofit program or service operated to serve, assist, or otherwise benefit children who are at least three (3) years of age and not yet enrolled in kindergarten, including the following:
(i) A Head Start program under 42 U.S.C. 9831 et seq.
(ii) A special education preschool program.
(iii) A developmental child care program for preschool children.
(2) The grounds adjacent to and owned or rented in common with a building or other structure described in subdivision (1).
As added by P.L.114-2012, SEC.67.


Unless we have school corporations running colleges and universities they are not covered by this definition. To save you time looking things up, IC12-17.2 covers licensed daycares and IC 31-27 covers residential child care facilities.

 

[KW730]

To hunterft6 - No worries. Some times the wrong button gets hit or whatever. Not a problem.



Thanks. However, I would point out that "many discussions about colleges" does NOT make it legal to carry on a campus because those 'discussing' it believe a college / university is not a "school". In fact, colleges / universities are often referenced as "secondary schools" or "post-secondary schools", or "schools of higher learning".

Case in point - Lawyers, Doctors, Nurses, Dentists, etc. go to "law school", "medical school", "nursing school", and "dental school", respectively. Which are housed... where? At colleges and universities.

So, it can certainly be determined that colleges / universities ARE "school" UNLESS there is some determination, something, that, for the purposes of carrying on campuses, colleges / universities are NOT "schools".

With respect to all who may be Officers of the Court, personal opinions don't really matter. If colleges / universities are NOT "schools", there must be something that so states that determination. Otherwise, it can be easily and readily 'argued' that they ARE "schools", and thus fall under 35-47-9.

I would wholeheartedly agree that, generally speaking, if some law doesn't specifically prohibit an action, it's legal to perform that action. However, that's not what I was 'arguing', nor was I 'arguing' that colleges / universities might have a policy regarding carry. That 'argument' isn't really applicable here anyway because it would appear that, based on the references noted above, colleges / universities ARE considered "schools" UNLESS there's something legislatively written that specifically states they are not.

And that's what I was asking for. Someone stated they're not "schools", and I was just respectfully requesting that information, and citation, for my own future reference, so I do not get caught up in some Catch/22. If that scenario were to happen, my stating "Well, there have been many discussions, and some lawyers believe that this campus isn't a school. So, I'm all good to go, and you can't arrest me!"

I have first hand experience of officers being told they can't file any charges on someone for having a gun on a college campus. And the relevant IC has been posted further up on this page. Any more questions?

 

[Manatee]

Mass hysteria.