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Temperature safe to heat a steel frame?
- Thread starter RCB
- Start date
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That is a great bit of info. Thank you very much. In my case, not desiring to heat treat but rather trying to avoid losing temper. Looks like anything over 400 may be problematic.
What I have been looking at is fixing pits in a steel pistol frame, with the intent to reblue. My thoughts have been to use a good hi-temp epoxy, combined with fine steel shavings in a 70/30 steel filing/epoxy combination. Still allowing for oxidation, but being less invasive than trying to TIG weld a frame.
The best hi-temp I have found is Lab-Metal Hi Temp, but it requires curing at 425 for an hour.
Naturally I would test this long before ever trying it on a pistol frame, but was curious of the effects of heating a pistol frame to 425.
I am aware of the bluing method of removing concealing pits, but these pits are just a tad too aggressive.
What I have been looking at is fixing pits in a steel pistol frame, with the intent to reblue. My thoughts have been to use a good hi-temp epoxy, combined with fine steel shavings in a 70/30 steel filing/epoxy combination. Still allowing for oxidation, but being less invasive than trying to TIG weld a frame.
The best hi-temp I have found is Lab-Metal Hi Temp, but it requires curing at 425 for an hour.
Naturally I would test this long before ever trying it on a pistol frame, but was curious of the effects of heating a pistol frame to 425.
I am aware of the bluing method of removing concealing pits, but these pits are just a tad too aggressive.
Knowing the alloy is still part of the equation, but now we know what you're trying to achieve. Let me try and break this down for you.
I do not think the bluing is going to adhere with any consistancy to an epoxy, it's just not the same as a steel base material. You're going to see the repair, very similiar to regulating a SxS, the flux, solder, lead must be cleaned or the hot, rust, or charcoal blue does not adhere, and looks .... well, repaired.
The steel filings have no place in this equation, cannot see the thought behind this, as it will add no strength, and possible weaken the epoxy bond.
There are several epoxies that will cure below 425, most automotive grade adhesives cure well below that temp, and will never come off. PM me if you want to try this route, I can recommend some inexpensive epoxies, but still do not think they will color right.
GTAW welding WILL kill the temper, will change the hardness and grain structure, may start a stress riser for a crack, and is not a safe choice at all. Please do not do this.
Can you post a pic of the pistol area in question?
I will post a pic once I get a chance (may be this next week before I get a chance)
The purpose of the steel filings is for bluing to activate on. You are correct, epoxy will not react with the bluing salts, but steel filings will. Using the bluing method to fill pits works well, but they have to be very small. By using epoxy and metal shavings the thought would be to bring steel filings up to level with rest of the frame, then blending the bluing in. The hi temp epoxy is not a must, just a potential bonding agent for the filings.
This is just sandbox thinking I guess you would say.
The purpose of the steel filings is for bluing to activate on. You are correct, epoxy will not react with the bluing salts, but steel filings will. Using the bluing method to fill pits works well, but they have to be very small. By using epoxy and metal shavings the thought would be to bring steel filings up to level with rest of the frame, then blending the bluing in. The hi temp epoxy is not a must, just a potential bonding agent for the filings.
This is just sandbox thinking I guess you would say.
"The hi temp epoxy is not a must, just a potential bonding agent for the filings."
There are many epoxies that will work, and many that will cure well at temps of 120-160 on just 20-50 minutes. Working time and cure times all vary with the product chosen, just make sure the one you select will air-harden.
"This is just sandbox thinking I guess you would say. "
Yes, but very easy to replicate with a similiar alloy, drill a few tiny holes, patch it and see what it looks like. If you need a few suggestions on the epoxy, send me a PM.
There are many epoxies that will work, and many that will cure well at temps of 120-160 on just 20-50 minutes. Working time and cure times all vary with the product chosen, just make sure the one you select will air-harden.
"This is just sandbox thinking I guess you would say. "
Yes, but very easy to replicate with a similiar alloy, drill a few tiny holes, patch it and see what it looks like. If you need a few suggestions on the epoxy, send me a PM.
CountryBoy19
Grandmaster
Why not just use the Devcon "steel putty" that is used for bedding rifle actions. I believe it is over 50% steel, and it is practically the strongest epoxy known to man. I'll try to find a link to it.
Here you go: Devcon 10110 Steel Putty
I couldn't find the actual metal content, but the MSDS says 30-60% steel and 1-5% Titanium. So that probably means that the steel content is around 45% and the Ti is around 2-3%.
MSDS: http://devcon.com/prodfiles/pdfs/sku_msds_38.pdf
I do know that is is pretty tough stuff, its nearly as strong as steel in some failure modes.
For the cheapest price, last time I bought it, I found a pretty good deal at a place called Marking Pen Depot I think (google it).
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IndyGunworks
Grandmaster
devcon steel will attract a magnet... i have a ton of it in my shop as its what i use to bed actions..... let me advise though, that this stuff will not take a blue... the expoxies in it will make it look VERY obvious.... your best course of action might be to fill in, and polish, and then sent it to cory nash and have him duracoat or cerakote the gun.... if you want to go the reblue route pm me for details, i am not quite set up for hot bluing yet but the ball is rolling and it wont be long... if you do reblue though, there isnt a whole lot you can do about the pitting short of filing it down to where it isnt very obvious, and even then it depends on how much material would have to be removed.
