School shooting in Ohio

[Coach]

The teachers I had when I was in school were liberal nanny state communists. They would never dream of picking up a firearm for self defense or even the defense of others. (That's what the Police are for)


I really don't know the best way to stop this ridiculous behaviour that has become so prevelent these days. How am I going let my kids go to a place where they are not safe?

You cannot judge by the group. I am a teacher, and I can shoot. Put a shooter in my classroom door and I like my chances of shooting him before he can do much damage. As it stands right now I have to win a gun fight without a gun. At least give me a chance. I don't want to die for my students but I certainly willing to shoot a gun wielding nut job for them.

 

[Titanium_Frost]

My apologies Coach, present company excluded from my previous rant. And not ALL of my teachers were that bad but the majority were not that great and I tended to be on a string of retiring teacher's last year.

 

[dusterboy49]

Todays news 02/28/12, states that the shooter was a victim of "bullying" and other mistreatment by his fellow students.
I'm sure that will be used as a defense.

 

[jedi]

At the end of the day even if you allow guns in the school either via teachers or the student's themselves (ie. 18 year old seniors in HS) it would not have made a difference in this and many of the other school shootings.

The firearm is nothing more than the tool that these kids are using to get rid of their pain or impose pain on those that had wronged them. From the article this kid was targeting certain students. So even if you have GGWGs (good guys with guns) in that room this kid was still going to be able to kill/hurt at least one other student before the GGWG could have come to bear on him.

As such the more and more I think about it in the other post on this topic someone wrote in pruple "We need to ban schools". I think that actually should NOT be in purple and try it out to see if it works since banning guns has not.

-Jedi

 

[KLB]

Not to say that teachers should not be armed, but someone explain to me how that would have stopped this. He shot his targets in a cafeteria, then apparently ran. He did not wander the school shooting people like others have.

The best I can see is there may have been fewer victims if someone with a weapon had been in the cafeteria.

In the end this is another sad story.

 

[HICKMAN]

funny thing was, it was a coach that ran the kid off.

 

[jedi]

Not to say that teachers should not be armed, but someone explain to me how that would have stopped this. He shot his targets in a cafeteria, then apparently ran. He did not wander the school shooting people like others have.

The best I can see is there may have been fewer victims if someone with a weapon had been in the cafeteria.

In the end this is another sad story.

Correct KLB this was a targeted hit. The shooter was after very specific targets. Nothing other than 2 extremes (banning schools or full body and bag searches) could have prevented this from occuring at the school.

& if you do full body/bag search then I'm sure the shooter would have just one uped his game and instead of using a gun he would of moved up in "weapon" to a bomb or running the person over, etc...

Or if you ban schools then the shooter would have just sought the victim out somewhere else.

How do you defend against that? You can't really appart from teaching everyone self-defense, situation awareness, and independednt thinking all of which are counter what we are now doing.

 

[HICKMAN]

Todays news 02/28/12, states that the shooter was a victim of "bullying" and other mistreatment by his fellow students.
I'm sure that will be used as a defense.

good, I'm sick of the bullying that goes on in schools these days, it's vicious.

My niece has a kid in her school that is a little slow and some jack-hole decides to put up a Facebook page for these turds torment him. Glad to see parents got involved quickly and notified law and school both.


Some kids are just evil these days.

 

[dom1104]

This hits very close to home, Chardon is my hometown, my family lives there, friends with children in the HS etc.

Its a very white, very well to do area. Large country houses type deal. Only a short drive from a large Amish community.

Lots of civic events, craft shows, bands in the town square park sort of thing.

Its a shame.

 

[KLB]

good, I'm sick of the bullying that goes on in schools these days, it's vicious.

My niece has a kid in her school that is a little slow and some jack-hole decides to put up a Facebook page for these turds torment him. Glad to see parents got involved quickly and notified law and school both.


Some kids are just evil these days.

Sadly this is nothing new. There are just new ways for kids to torment others today.

 

[dom1104]

Just got off the phone, with my mom, who spoke to mother of a boy who was at the table where one of the boys was shot in the head. He was best friends with the injured boy. He held him, covered, she said he was soaking in blood untill the EMTs came.

He is mentally messed up at the moment.

The boy was covered in blood, the shooter whos name is TJ Lane, was well known to be a herion user, and bought his drugs at a gas station I used every week.

The shooter was dating a homeschooled girl oddly enough, who broke up with him, and started dating one of the slain boys. The shooter was very upset over this.

Everyone thought it was a toy gun.

The shooters father is well known in town as a bad man.

The children dialed 911 on their phones, the police arrived in minutes.

The town is in shock, the churches are packed full of people, and there are helicopters and news crews and fire trucks everywhere.

 

[dom1104]

The gun is rumored to be a 22lr pistol, and thats the reason the children thought it was a toy gun.

 

[catielynnb]

Good, I'm sick of the bullying that goes on in schools these days, it's vicious.

My niece has a kid in her school that is a little slow and some jack-hole decides to put up a Facebook page for these turds torment him. Glad to see parents got involved quickly and notified law and school both.

Some kids are just evil these days.

Sadly this is nothing new. There are just new ways for kids to torment others today.

Honestly, it will never stop. Ever. I hated high-school for more than just the stupid people and the lack of real education. I saw the kids who were tormented to extremes, and standing up to the tormentors got you the flack faster. Kids are not taught the way they should be anymore(imho), we give them technology faster and they're more adept at learning ways to hide what they're doing. It's not until something tragic happens that parents and kids alike realize the damage that something as simple as a misguided text message can really do.

Who really knows what the shooter was dealing with, we pin it on drugs, a bad father, a bad home-life but never really put the blame where it belongs. It's not all on the kids who may have talked about him, or started whatever years ago or maybe even with this recent break-up the media is including. He was the one who did the most wrong...

I lived through a very tragic Junior and Senior year at my high-school. Four girls, from my graduating class, committed suicide due to bullying. They didn't take it out on us as a student body like this boy did... but they took their own lives. It was so weird standing at a casket of someone you spoke to the day before that was planning her college life.

Don't take this as I'm supporting the boy who went in and murdered two of his classmates and injured others.... I'm just putting another spin on it from what I've seen. Keep in mind I have lived in a rather small box most of my life, so my opinions are my own.


I am keeping the town, families and the children in my prayers... the healing from this will be a long road.

 

[finity]

The teachers I had when I was in school were liberal nanny state communists.

Wow.

That sounds ALMOST as bad as conservative police-state fascists.

How am I going let my kids go to a place where they are not safe?

There is NO WAY you can protect your kids 24/7. It just isn't possible or reasonable.

Do you never let them go to the movies alone? Spend the night at a friends house? Play at the park alone (at an appropriate age of course)?

Sometimes bad things just happen & there's nothing we can do to stop it.

Schools are one of the safest places to be. Much safer than even being in the car with you. How many kids are injured at school (especially through kid on kid violence) compared to kids killed in auto accidents each year?

Think about that for a minute & you'll find your worries about sending them to school are way overblown.

As such the more and more I think about it in the other post on this topic someone wrote in pruple "We need to ban schools". I think that actually should NOT be in purple and try it out to see if it works since banning guns has not.

-Jedi

Yeah, I agree that the way to make anything better is to make make more people more ignorant than they already are.

About the only time in history that schools weren't in widespread use was during the "Dark Ages". There was a reason they were called that & why what followed was called the "Renaissance" or the "Enlightenment".

There's no way I would want to go back to those times to satisfy some wrongfully idealized "romantic" time in our history.

Honestly, it will never stop. Ever. I hated high-school for more than just the stupid people and the lack of real education. I saw the kids who were tormented to extremes, and standing up to the tormentors got you the flack faster. Kids are not taught the way they should be anymore(imho), we give them technology faster and they're more adept at learning ways to hide what they're doing. It's not until something tragic happens that parents and kids alike realize the damage that something as simple as a misguided text message can really do.

Who really knows what the shooter was dealing with, we pin it on drugs, a bad father, a bad home-life but never really put the blame where it belongs. It's not all on the kids who may have talked about him, or started whatever years ago or maybe even with this recent break-up the media is including. He was the one who did the most wrong...

I lived through a very tragic Junior and Senior year at my high-school. Four girls, from my graduating class, committed suicide due to bullying. They didn't take it out on us as a student body like this boy did... but they took their own lives. It was so weird standing at a casket of someone you spoke to the day before that was planning her college life.

Don't take this as I'm supporting the boy who went in and murdered two of his classmates and injured others.... I'm just putting another spin on it from what I've seen. Keep in mind I have lived in a rather small box most of my life, so my opinions are my own.


I am keeping the town, families and the children in my prayers... the healing from this will be a long road.

The problem as I see it is we either spend so many resources on the whole "zero tolerance" thing (expelling a kid for aspirin or a drawing of a weapon ) or just looking the other way to give these students who are at times BRUTALLY bullied any hope at all.

Then when they get to the point that they can't tolerate it any longer they either kill themselves or someone else. Either way it is a huge tragedy. IMHO, though, it's way worse when a kid who has been bullied kills themselves than if they took the bulliers with them. In the former the bullies completely win. In the latter there are at least SOME consequences for their actions. If the schools refuse to effectively stop the bullying then what other choices are there for the kid who has to deal with it everyday? If we, as adults had to endure endless harrassment day after day & the authorities refused to do anything about it then I believe we would also be justified in stopping it using whatever means was necessary. Why should a kid have any fewer options? They are less emotionally capable of handling harrassment than adults but we expect more from them for some reason.

Don't get me wrong. I don't think that anyone should takes things into their own hands outside of EXTREMELY severe situations.

What I'm saying is that as adults the teachers & adminstrators have a huge responsibility in making sure that schools are as welcoming as possible for EVERY student & getting it through to them that bullying won't be tolerated. Stop looking the other way. In my experience the bullies who get away with it are the athletes/cheerleaders/etc or other "popular" kids who the teachers don't want to upset their parents.

I know it happens. It happened with my kids & it's still happening now. There is no other situation in the adult world where bullying is even tacitly condoned anymore. There are either laws to prevent it or workplace rules to stop it. For violating the rules you either get arrested or fired.

You need to learn at a very young age that there are repercussions for treating others like crap & that society won't tolerate it.

 

[Titanium_Frost]

Finity of course I know all that I am just working out some frustration/fear mostly because I am a new dad. My son is not even 10 months old yet so I have quite a while to ponder it.

 

[finity]

Finity of course I know all that I am just working out some frustration/fear mostly because I am a new dad. My son is not even 10 months old yet so I have quite a while to ponder it.

Once you raise 7 it becomes old-hat.

 

[HICKMAN]

Finity of course I know all that I am just working out some frustration/fear mostly because I am a new dad. My son is not even 10 months old yet so I have quite a while to ponder it.

you yourself a favor and home school your kids... everyone will be far better off.

If not... charter or private school. The decline of the schools since my kids started 15 years ago is staggering.

 

[radar44]

Part time bully --
Part time -- hide behind the authority's and feign a mystery over why the person being bullied is upset....

The shooter was wrong , but bullies REALLY p*ss me off .