Ruger 10/22 Failure to Fire Issues

[Rayne]

I recently purchased a 1989 sporter model. When I got it the rifle looked like you had just taken it out of the box. There wasn’t a blemish on it. So when I stripped it down to do some trigger work and dremmel out the bolt release to make it an automatic release, I was surprised to see that the bolt was pitted badly.

I had tested fired about 50 rounds through it before I took it apart to make sure it functioned properly. It seemed to function fine that day. I had it out at a distance shoot a few weeks later and forgot my mags so Suprtek from INGO loaned me three 25 round mags already loaded. I had multiple failures to fire, failure to feed and stove pipes. I would say about 8 to 10 out of the 75 rounds I shot that day. I asked Supertek what kind of ammo he had loaded in his mags and it was federal bulk pack, same as what I usually use.

So a few days later I took the rifle out and shot 25 rounds of Federal Bulk pack, I had 3 FTF. They had good clean strikes, but did not fire. Then I shot 50 rounds CCI mini mags and had 1 FTF. Again it appeared to be a good clean strike. I went back and shot 25 more rounds of Federal Bulk pack and had 1 more FTF. I loaded all 5 of the FTF rounds into a mag and shot them again and they all fired the second time through the gun. I didn’t have any failures to feed or stove pipes that day.

So back to the bench, actually it’s my kitchen table.

The sporter model I'm having trouble with now has tech sights and is the bottom rifle in the picture.

I tore both my rifles down so I could compare parts side by side. I didn’t find anything significant to my untrained eye. I did take a small bur off the top of the ejector. I haven’t been back out to test fire it again, but I’m hoping I can figure this problem out with some help from INGO, because I want to shoot this rifle at an Appleseed next weekend. I want to see if I can shoot a rifleman score when I can’t even see the target. I'm trusting YellowhouseJake an awful lot.

Here are some of the pictures I took while I had them tore down together.

Everything's so nice and neatly laid out.

I did notice two things on the bolt. The bolt on the bottom is from the scoped rifle and it seems to have a piece on top of the firing pin. (red circle)

The bolt on top belongs to the sporter model and where the arrow is pointing the pin seems to be out further than on the other bolt.

Another view of the difference in the pin.

While I had the sporter model tore down I decided to go ahead and float the barrel. To my delight the stock turned out to be solid walnut.

I used an 11mm socket and 150 grit sand paper. It took a while but it was worth it.

You can always tell walnut by it's pinkish color of the raw wood.

After hours of work, I wasn't so concerned about neatness any more. So much for a CDO personality. I will have to say, I had no parts left over, even with two of everything laying around.

So can anyone give me some suggestions as to what to look for? Did you see something in the pictures that I'm missing?

I’m going to go with the assumption, I still have a problem even though I haven’t test fired it again, because basically I didn’t change anything when I had it tore apart yesterday.

Thanks in advance for the advice and help that I know will be forth coming. INGO is a great place with wonderful people. I've really enjoyed the time I've spent here the last two years. Well 1 year, 10 months, 28 days and this is my 10,000 post.

 

[actaeon277]

I'm not sure what that piece of the firing pin.
That pin that's sticking out. I would make sure it's all the way in, or grind it a little shorter so that it's flush.
You might check the firing pin end. The end that strikes the primer. There's a possibility that it's been dry fired repeatedly over the decades. Check to see if it's deformed, or mushroomed on the end.
You might have to take a micrometer to check the length. I don't think the firing pin is too expensive, you might just want to swap it out.
I don't think the pitting should be a problem.

 

[rotortech]

What actaeon said. Plus, something I recently had a problem with on my newly purchased 10/22. The charging handle was hanging up on the guide rod. It acted much like you describe with FTE and stovepipe issues. It ran better using CCI mini mags than on Federal bulk.

When I was looking for problems I had the bolt out and I slid the charging handle down the rod to compress the spring. There were little bite marks on the rod where the charging handle was catching. It appeared that the hole in the charging handle was not chamfered or deburred properly. I polished the rod and the rifle worked much better. I plan to order a new recoil assembly from Ruger.

 

[Cpt Caveman]

Yup. Polish the guide rod, push the pin in to proper depth and make sure the firing pin is the proper length. It also may be rusted and kinda sticking in its pathway. You could always swap out the firing pins and if that takes care of the problem then you need a new firing pin. Chamfering the lower back part of the bolt will go a long way to making it run smoother too.
And get some kinda sealer on that barrel channel. A generous coating of wax works pretty well. You'll have to apply it again after it gets warm, it'll soak in. Or some kinda pol-u. product.
Good shooting at the seed!

 

[patience0830]

Hey Rayne. I know what that piece above the F/P is because I put it there. That is a poor mans pinning job on a 10/22 bolt. It's a BB squashed a bit and driven into the slot enough to hold the f/p down then filed flat. Not pretty but it works when a fellow doesn't have the carbide tooling to cut a hole in the bolt for an actual pin. I've done it to a couple and not had any problem with them. I'm sorry we didn't actually have time to look closer at the gun the day you bought it. I'd have noticed and told you about it. That one still works ok, right?

As for the pitted bolt, I've seen early 10/22's NIB, with bolts that rough. I'd be surprised if it didn't come that way.

 

[Rayne]

. That one still works ok, right?

Oh yes, that one works fine. Not a single problem with it. I did replace the buffer tubing that was in it with a nylon pin.

 

[jgreiner]

Just my 2 cents, but I have fewer problems in my .22's with the Winchester white box bricks from Walmart, than i ever do with Federal...and even CCI mini mags. I rarely get a FTF out of a box of 555. And they feed flawlessly through my Ruger Mark l.

 

[DRob]

Swap parts

My inclination right off the bat is your problems are related to the ammo. Different guns often have different appetites. That said, try switching the bolts so they are not matched up with the original trigger group. You should be able to isolate the problem if it's related to a bolt or TG. The BB trick is a pretty common mod and a lot easier than drilling the bolt and adding a pin. Just make sure the firing pin isn't hanging up on the bottom of the BB. Probably isn't or the issue would have shown up previously. If you find the problem is with one TG, you might consider an extra strength hammer spring. I also polish the bolt spring guide rods. They are really rough from the factory. I chuck mine up in a drill and use fine sandpaper or steel wool on them. Good luck.

 

[Indydrew]

Cpt Caveman is right...I would polish the guide rod and replace the guide rod spring then go a step further and replace the firing pin and the extractor because they are cheap and its an easy fix.

If the bolt is that pitted on the top, the bottom is probably as bad...You might try running it back and forth on 1000 grit sandpaper on a flat surface to smooth it out, anytime you can get rid of friction its a good thing.

I will throw out that I have problems like you describe with the 25 round mags from Ruger and my 10/22's hate Remington bulk stuff...I test with 10 rd mags and CCI minimags and it seems to work better...but your mileage may vary.

Good luck and let us know how this works out...

-A

 

[Caldad]

If they're the Ruger brand 25rnd mags, that may be a big part of the problem (if not all of it). I have two that caused the same problems... failure to feed, extract, jams...

There are several very simple and quick things that can be done to improve the mags... Ruger should be ashamed that they don't put in the extra minute while manufacturing the mags in the first place. Instead they include a disclaimer that the mags are picky with ammo, and to try different ones to see what works... what a joke! Out of the box, my mags both fed some old Federal lead rnd nose without a problem. When that was gone and I switched to Federal bulk pack hollow points, the mags started to suck big time... failures to feed, extract, jams... it was like I was shooting a completely different firearm.

So you ask what did you do about it... a few simple things:
1) disassemble the mag(s)
2) with a small rounded file smooth out the feed-ramp part of the mag (the mold Ruger uses leaves a seam in the middle of the area in front of where the bullet travels causing failure to feeds with some ammo) ...don't change the angle of the feed-ramp, just smooth it out. Then use about a 800 grit sand paper wrapped around the file to polish it a little.
3) You'll also notice that the follower has a lot of play in it. So lets fix that, and make the follower ride a little higher, helping to feed the ammo better. Saw this somewhere on the web, and it works... use a spent 22 short, or a cut-down 22LR and add it between the two pieces of the follower.
4) Sand using 800 grit paper, the areas inside the mag where the follower rides (in the direction the follower travels). This will reduce any added friction. ...it'll act like microscopic railroad tracks for the follower, v. the sporadic little (speed) bumps in the plastic the way it comes from the factory.
5) Clean the above areas with an alcohol swab, and reassemble.

After making the above minor changes, my mags have feed everything without a problem.

Good luck!

 

[SAILORGOLF46]

I also have a sporter mfg 1992 will not function with WWB, all others ok. Have only used factory 10 rnd mags.

 

[top hat 45]

i'd like to hear what got fixed or worked for a repair.

will it fire ,rayne?

 

[Rayne]

Sorry, just now getting back to them. Had problems all week after work and didn't get out to test fire them until today. What a beautiful day.

Ok, here's what I did... I traded bolts and trigger assemblies in the rifles. This could get confusing. The tech sighted rifle is the one having troubles with failures to fire. I took the bolt and trigger assemble from the scoped rifle and installed them into the tech sighted rifle. I also took the bolt and trigger assemble from the tech sighted rifle and put them in the scoped rifle.

So both rifles were reassembled. I tested the tech sighted rifle first and on the second shot I had a failure to fire. I ran about 150 rounds through the tech sighted rifle and had 8 failure to fires. That average isn't that bad, but still not good, especially when 3 of those failures to fire were right in a row.

The scoped rifle with the tech sighted rifle's bolt and trigger assemble was fired about 50 rounds and not a single failure to fire.

Here is a pictures of the firing pins hits on the cartridges that fired and those that didn't.

So now I'm really confused. I thought I had a firing pin problem, but the problem stayed with the rifle not the bolt, firing pin, or trigger assemble. I'll have to read back over Top Hat 45's PM and see if he had any suggestions for this scenerio. Or feel free to post of your advice right here for everyone to see.

Thoughts? Ideas? Suggestions?

 

[actaeon277]

Check the receiver out for burrs or defects. Run the action back and forth while it is in the receiver.
You want to make sure it moves smoothly with no resistance at anyplace in the stroke.
I can't think how it would happen, but maybe the receiver got deformed, pinched in. It wouldn't have to be much. Just enough to slow down the bolt.

 

[top hat 45]

first thought is the barrel face not square with the receiver. i've got a couple of other barrels you can try if you have time. several other bolts too. trigger group not the culprit.

happens sometimes because of misaligned barrel to receiver, lapping barrel only a partial cure.

 

[1911ly]

I would have bet the issue would have been the bolt. top hat 45's suggestion sounds possible.

Does the bolt side freely in the receiver? Try sliding it without the spring and wiggling it around to see if it hangs on something in the receiver. It's a long shot.

I had issues with FTE's in my 10-22. I bought it from a neighbor that bought for his dad back in the early 90's. Never fired and still in the box. I tore it down and could not get the bolt out when I cleaned it up for the first time(before I shot it)! I decided to test as it as is. I had FTE's almost immediately.

There was flash (left over metal from molding) at the back edge of the ejection port on the receiver. I don't have a clue how they got the bolt in. A half hour with a jewelers file (not a Dremel fan on a gun). I got the bolt out and the extractor was poorly stamped. I stoned it flat and have had no more FTE's in 2 years. I truly enjoy the gun. It has near 20k rounds of Federal 550 bulk without any issues.

 

[Rayne]

Took the rifle to Top Hat 45's today and he was correct. The face of the barrel was not square. We switched barrels out and I put 70 flawless rounds through it. There are alot of things to tweek yet, to make it smoother, which will come with time and money, but for right now I just wanted it to consistantly fire for an appleseed event next weekend. The true test will be then, when I will run 3 to 5 hundred rounds through it. Top Hat 45 said to let him know how it functioned, so I'll post up about it after next weekend.

Thank you so much Top Hat 45 and MissyB, Your hospitality once again was above and beyond. It's a good thing I live so far away or you'd have to be getting a restraining order to keep me from being on your door step every Sunday afternoon Plus I'd be alot poorer, cause I've seen some mighty sweet things at your place that I'd love to have myself.

IndyGunWorks; Thank you very much for getting my front sight off my old barrel and reinstalled on the new one. I didn't mean for you to do it all yourself, just needed some help breaking the screws loose. I appreciate you taking time to lend a hand.

 

[top hat 45]

you are welcome and come out anytime but call first as missy b knows how far it is to the end of drive for bullit drop.

for any of you that are interessted, rayne's barrel only contacted less than 30% of the bolt, due to the shiny spots on the barrel face. i checked the fit between the new barrel that we put on to the face of the receiver, 100 % contact. the head space on a 10-22 needs to be .042. measuring rayne's bolt, i found .502 for a clearance and with the cant of the face of the original factory barrel it was probably about .600 that the firing pin had to jump for consistant firing. ideally, with more time, squaring and truing bolt face and cutting back to .042 headspace, would be optimum, but i think all will be fine for open sights and the appleseed shoot. btw, good luck on achieving your goal there.

a lot of you know rayne from different shoots, etc. i would like to post she is one of the nicest LADIES, caps intended, to come to our home to shoot,and welcome anytime with her family and friends........daryll

 

[actaeon277]

I'm glad a solution was found.
I'm gonna have to remember that tidbit.

 

[Rayne]

Well the Ruger ran like a top all weekend. Not a single Failure to Fire. Can't say so much for the operator behind the trigger though.

I was certain I was going to come home disappointed. I had issues with my sitting position and getting all the shots off a couple time. I put the wrong magazine in one time and fumbled around trying to get the right one. Plus I couldn't get the magazine to seat another time and it dropped after every fire. But I eventually shot two rifleman scores, and this time with iron sights.

I will say that at this appleseed I had to really be focused on what I was doing. And I mean focused in two ways. First on my vision and trying to see the front post clearly and then to know where my respitory pause put the sight in comparison to the target.

Second I had to really focus on what I was doing because I was taking so much time with my vision focus, I couldn't make any mistakes elsewhere or I would run out of time to get all my shots off.

The scoped ruger was loaned out to a new shooter and it ran smooth all weekend too. It was a great weekend and though the weather was cool and misty, it wasn't bad compared to what it could have been.

Oh and Top Hat 45, I'm a believer in the CCI Blazer ammo. Not a hiccup and it was consistant and clean. Now I just need to find it locally. Thanks again for all the help.