Reloads for carry?

[LarryC]

As an instructor I advise against handloads. I carry only factory JHP. There is no way I would ever carry a handload for EDC for a couple reasons. 1. Even though you might get cleared criminally the Civl Lawsuit is what I don't want to give them fodder (no pun intended) and you will be sued if your in a shooting. And 2. I can't assemble anything much more effective than good quality factory options availible.

But everyone can do what they can afford to do.

I certainly agree, my son and I both are highly experienced and reload many thousands of loads, with some of the best equipment available.

However many of the Factory "Maximum defense rounds" (they have various names but are the hottest loads available that meet all the FBI ballistic standards for penetration and expansion), are loaded with proprietary powders not available to the re-loader's commercially. I'm not sure but possibly some of the bullets are also specially selected.

I am certainly not concerned if the accuracy is different from what I practice with as the distance I would be shooting in my home is less than 30 foot. Outside I believe anything over 30' would certainly be questionable to a Jury as to being a self defense round. So if I am so inaccurate with the round to miss by 10 MOA - (that is terrible shooting), I would still be off by 1" at 30 foot range! Hardly see that as a problem.

Sure it is more expensive, but all you need to shoot is a clip or two to insure your firearm performs perfectly with the rounds (all mine always have), and that you are aware of the recoil etc. (which may be higher than you are used too seeing), then carry the rounds for a year or so - then replace - if you have put it in and out of the clip or for any reason you think you should.

All liability issues are then covered as you can honestly state "I purchased what the Police officers use", I don't think any (even the addle-brained liberal) jurists can argue with that logic.

I do have and will continue to reload Hornady and other hollow point "self defense" bullets into some cartridges. Also load a lot of self cast semi- and full wadcutter's. In a SHTF situation, I have a large stock of available ammo. But in that case I don't think anyone will worry about prosecutors or Juries.

 

[in625shooter]

I interpret in the court system from time to time for non-Engiish speakers. I had a short conversation with a prosecutor about being involved in a shooting while carrying reloads, and the comment was that if the shooting was justified it was justified... type of ammo used wouldn't be an issue... but... I too carry factory loads.

Prosecutors only charge you for a Criminal offense. Thats usually all they look at (was you using force justified) However on the Civil suit you will take your own chances and handloads could very well get played and you demonized over it. Will it get so far as a civil suit probably, will it get even farther as to YOU being on the witness stand? Could be but I myself am not giving a Civil attorney any angle for a jury to ponder.

Like I said earlier everyone can do whatever they think they can afford, if they aren't worried about it more power to them!

 

[88E30M50]

I would think you could make a stronger case for using reloads as the responsible thing to do than a prosecutor could make by demonizing you for them. Any gun owner knows that the key to proficiency is practice. The more practice the better. As any reloader knows, you don't save money reloading, you just shoot more. Also, it's commonly accepted that different bullets will work differently in the same gun. Would it not make sense then that the responsible thing to do as a gun owner is to reload your own ammo to exacting tolerances so you can shoot far more of your exact carry ammo on a given budget in an effort to become as good as you could possibly be?

If you can practice more with the exact ammo you use on a daily basis for carry, you are going to be more accurate and consistent with your handgun. Or, put another way, is carrying a high end commercial SD round, while practicing with a generic FMJ going to put you more at risk of being prosecuted because you accidentally shot a bystander while flinging a mag a ammo you are not practiced with?

All that said, I carry commercial ammo. I am simply making the point that the argument of adding to a prosecutors case by hand loading could be just more myth like how OC will get you shot first.

 

[M67]

Never understood why ammo companies could design bullets meant to kill but us common folk can't carry a round that probably shoots more accurately that the factory stuff.

That being said, when I carry my 1911, I'm just carrying reloaded ball ammo. When I'm carrying the 657 through the woods I'm carrying hand loads.

.357 and 9mm I'm just carrying what I can find anymore

 

[in625shooter]

I would think you could make a stronger case for using reloads as the responsible thing to do than a prosecutor could make by demonizing you for them. Any gun owner knows that the key to proficiency is practice. The more practice the better. As any reloader knows, you don't save money reloading, you just shoot more. Also, it's commonly accepted that different bullets will work differently in the same gun. Would it not make sense then that the responsible thing to do as a gun owner is to reload your own ammo to exacting tolerances so you can shoot far more of your exact carry ammo on a given budget in an effort to become as good as you could possibly be?

If you can practice more with the exact ammo you use on a daily basis for carry, you are going to be more accurate and consistent with your handgun. Or, put another way, is carrying a high end commercial SD round, while practicing with a generic FMJ going to put you more at risk of being prosecuted because you accidentally shot a bystander while flinging a mag a ammo you are not practiced with?

All that said, I carry commercial ammo. I am simply making the point that the argument of adding to a prosecutors case by hand loading could be just more myth like how OC will get you shot first.

I think I am following you however, The only reason a Prosecutor would bring up the use of handloads would be IF THEY ARE CHARGING YOU Criminally. If it was a good shoot it was a good shoot

Where I think most people are missing the point is your example in red most gun owners know but does your jury? also what can be brought up "Are you formally trained in a trade school, certified or self taught etc. sounds minute but could be brought into play.

Example in Green you are doing exactly like many LE Agencies do which can be used to help you. If it's good enough for them the same though as using the same JHP as a local LE agency uses.

Example in blue....tough luck if it was an accident while lawfully engaging a bad guy it's prosecutory discretion if you are charged criminally however you will be civilly sued which again if you used hand loads could not look good.

 

[Wannabe Alchemist]

I would think you could make a stronger case for using reloads as the responsible thing to do than a prosecutor could make by demonizing you for them. Any gun owner knows that the key to proficiency is practice. The more practice the better. As any reloader knows, you don't save money reloading, you just shoot more. Also, it's commonly accepted that different bullets will work differently in the same gun. Would it not make sense then that the responsible thing to do as a gun owner is to reload your own ammo to exacting tolerances so you can shoot far more of your exact carry ammo on a given budget in an effort to become as good as you could possibly be?

If you can practice more with the exact ammo you use on a daily basis for carry, you are going to be more accurate and consistent with your handgun. Or, put another way, is carrying a high end commercial SD round, while practicing with a generic FMJ going to put you more at risk of being prosecuted because you accidentally shot a bystander while flinging a mag a ammo you are not practiced with?

All that said, I carry commercial ammo. I am simply making the point that the argument of adding to a prosecutors case by hand loading could be just more myth like how OC will get you shot first.

Seems to me you are contradicting yourself. Not that I care though...I KNOW I am saving money reloading.

 

[Tydeeh22]

has anyone actually busted out the calipers on the "factory" rounds? its insanity.. i'ver personally recorded upwards of 30 thousandths of variation from one round to another.. if im tried via civil suit, then fine.. i have all my data logged and multiple rounds for testing and data retrieval. but know this.. my tolerances for MY loads.. is 1 thousandth of an inch up / down.

with what this is being made up as.. god forbid someone decides to put a 3.5 pound connector in their glock.. the court will jump all over that too huh.

 

[Wannabe Alchemist]

Sounds like McDonald's hot coffee all over again.

 

[84VETTE]

If i was in the situation of being harassed by the prosecutor, I would just be like "Have you seen the price of 10mm auto lately? That's why I carry with hand loaded ammunition."

 

[Robert Richardson]

If I have to pull the trigger on someone,I do mean to kill them. So doe's it really matter if it's a reload or factory ammo? Don't think so.

 

[actaeon277]

If I have to pull the trigger on someone,I do mean to kill them. So doe's it really matter if it's a reload or factory ammo? Don't think so.

Now you're talking fact/reality. Unfortunately you have to deal with perception of the Prosecuting Attorney and the members of the jury. Many of whom may believe everything the tv says.

 

[88E30M50]

...The only reason a Prosecutor would bring up the use of handloads would be IF THEY ARE CHARGING YOU Criminally. If it was a good shoot it was a good shoot

I was thinking the same thing while writing that. It it's a good shoot, none of this should matter.

Seems to me you are contradicting yourself. Not that I care though...I KNOW I am saving money reloading.

I don't think that's a contradiction. If you have a $100 per month shooting budget you can shoot 200 rounds of .45 acp if bought commercially. But, if you reload, you can shoot about 500 rounds for the same money. Either way, you've stuck to your $100 budget but one of those ways let you shoot far more than the other. Most reloaders I've talked to tend to shoot more for their given dollar. I know that my family shoots far more because of reloading than we did when we bought commercial ammo.