Red flag orders - the left has found a magic bullet against guns

[drillsgt]

And some sort of method for compensating owners for loss and/or damages to property while in the state's care.

Ha, yeah, good luck with that nice Weatherby Mark V deluxe with scope after a year in a property room.

 

[KLB]

Not contending that current Indiana law (or any other current law) is the best approach, but with appropriate checks and balances, I believe that some sort of "red flag" law would be constitutional and would, in fact, be a good idea.

In theory (putting aside how exactly you prove it), if we knew that someone was threatening imminent violence or self-harm, taking away the means to inflict immediately inflict that harm is justified.

The problem, of course, and as always, is how to do this in a way that respects rights and does not give power to those who would lie to harm another. It's not at all an easy task.

Seems the more effective solution would be to remove the person.

If someone was had seriously decided to cause harm to someone, does anyone think that they wouldn't be willing to acquire a weapon in another manner, or another manner of weapon?

These laws seem to be more about the perception of guns than actually protecting anyone.

 

[Leadeye]

Would there be a public record of how many times these confiscation warrants are asked for and how many are issued? I think everybody's concern is that this process would be "weaponized".

 

[lonehoosier]

Seems the more effective solution would be to remove the person.

If someone was had seriously decided to cause harm to someone, does anyone think that they wouldn't be willing to acquire a weapon in another manner, or another manner of weapon?

These laws seem to be more about the perception of guns than actually protecting anyone.

They’re about as useless as a protection order. It does not stop anyone from hurting some one else.

 

[Doublehelix]

This all comes down to us gun owners' PERCEIVED inability to secure our weapons. A few bad situations (as has been mentioned, Lanza, the Noblesville shooter) make us all seem like we just have tons of "assault weapons" and a "hordes of ammunition" laying around for the crazed relatives/neighbors to grab and do harm.

If we can prove our weapons are secured, why in the wide world of sports would they have any justification for confiscation when it is another individual who is purported to be the one that is the danger to society?

This is only half of the problem, because they can still claim the gun owner himself/herself is the dangerous one, and then all bets are off.

 

[Max Volume]

Branch Davidians, Randy Weaver....It's all about controlling the populace.

 

[sheepdog697]

This is absolutely unacceptable. Very sad to see property confiscated base off of a comment...

 

[HoughMade]

Seems the more effective solution would be to remove the person...

Which is an even greater intrusion upon liberty.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Ha, yeah, good luck with that nice Weatherby Mark V deluxe with scope after a year in a property room.

Yep.

 

[Hop]

For those of you OK with these red flag laws, just remember it took me 6 months & a lawyer to get back my pistol and I was only rear ended in a car wreck. No red flag confiscation. No warrant, no charges. Nothing but a slow walking, incompetent, 2A hating property room manager @ IMPD with staff that said "ha, sue us".

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

For those of you OK with these red flag laws, just remember it took me 6 months & a lawyer to get back my pistol and I was only rear ended in a car wreck. No red flag confiscation. No warrant, no charges. Nothing but a slow walking, incompetent, 2A hating property room manager @ IMPD with staff that said "ha, sue us".

Yeah...that's a problem with our system--even if you win, you still lose and they see no consequence whatsoever.

 

[2A_Tom]

Seems the more effective solution would be to remove the person.

If someone was had seriously decided to cause harm to someone, does anyone think that they wouldn't be willing to acquire a weapon in another manner, or another manner of weapon?

These laws seem to be more about the perception of guns than actually protecting anyone.

It amazed me that the consensus in the other thread was that they would rather give up their guns to confiscation them to submit to a 72 hour hold.

Personally, the idea that I might spend years and tens of thousands of dollars (after I am no longer deemed a threat) to get mu possessions back. According to reports damaged and fired during custody.

I believe that if I was red flagged I would rather be put on a 72 hour watch. I think I could handle that. The key would to be calm. Show the professionals that I was not a threat to anyone.

I also believe that anyone in that situation must be made completely whole financially and have punitive recourse against accusers if applicable.

 

[Tanfodude]

Per your (ahem) "request", I re-read the article (third time) and all of your posts in this thread.

While I would agree, it's not cause for "blaze of glory" time, I still fail to see how the circumstances, as described in the article linked in the OP (and summarized in my post), warrant the action taken to confiscate the property of Uncle X?

What, exactly, are you suggesting I'm missing here?

As I stated, they did the right thing in taking action, but I didn't agree on the confiscation hence I stated 'the process needs to be polished'. Then I posted 'Yup, they should have just taken the juve'. If these we're done on that Virginia tech, Adam Lanza and the Parkland case, huge chance that the shootings would have been avoided. That's why I also said if they had the accurate details, then taking action was the right thing to do.

Majority of the previous mass shootings were mental cases and inaction on the people around these nutcases.

 

[Tanfodude]

For those of you OK with these red flag laws, just remember it took me 6 months & a lawyer to get back my pistol and I was only rear ended in a car wreck. No red flag confiscation. No warrant, no charges. Nothing but a slow walking, incompetent, 2A hating property room manager @ IMPD with staff that said "ha, sue us".

Care to share your case if it's already been closed?

 

[lonehoosier]

Care to share your case if it's already been closed?

There’s a hole thread about it.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ndianapolis-pd-firearm-seizure-no-return.html

 

[Hop]

Care to share your case if it's already been closed?

Unfortunately it's a long thread. Here - https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ianapolis-pd-firearm-seizure-no-return-5.html
Kirk helped get my pistol back.
No lawsuit was files but man I seriously thought about it.

 

[Ark]

For those of you OK with these red flag laws, just remember it took me 6 months & a lawyer to get back my pistol and I was only rear ended in a car wreck. No red flag confiscation. No warrant, no charges. Nothing but a slow walking, incompetent, 2A hating property room manager @ IMPD with staff that said "ha, sue us".

And this is exactly why I have zero faith in confiscated guns ever being returned. Cops have sticky fingers and frequently consider themselves above the law. If they want your guns for themselves, or they think they know better than the court, you're never getting your property back. The only way to win is not to allow confiscation in the first place.

 

[KLB]

This all comes down to us gun owners' PERCEIVED inability to secure our weapons. A few bad situations (as has been mentioned, Lanza, the Noblesville shooter) make us all seem like we just have tons of "assault weapons" and a "hordes of ammunition" laying around for the crazed relatives/neighbors to grab and do harm.

If we can prove our weapons are secured, why in the wide world of sports would they have any justification for confiscation when it is another individual who is purported to be the one that is the danger to society?

This is only half of the problem, because they can still claim the gun owner himself/herself is the dangerous one, and then all bets are off.

Why should I have to prove my weapons are secured?

For that matter, why should I have to secure them?

What other possessions should I have to prove are secured? My vehicles? My fuel containers? My bags of fertilizer?

 

[Tanfodude]

Unfortunately it's a long thread. Here - https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ianapolis-pd-firearm-seizure-no-return-5.html
Kirk helped get my pistol back.
No lawsuit was files but man I seriously thought about it.

So, your case is more on firearm detention rather than the actual red flag situation. I thought you've been a victim of false flagging.

 

[2A_Tom]

For those of you OK with these red flag laws, just remember it took me 6 months & a lawyer to get back my pistol and I was only rear ended in a car wreck. No red flag confiscation. No warrant, no charges. Nothing but a slow walking, incompetent, 2A hating property room manager @ IMPD with staff that said "ha, sue us".

So, your case is more on firearm detention rather than the actual red flag situation. I thought you've been a victim of false flagging.

It seems pretty clear what he was saying.