Reason Magazine openly advocates forced vaccination

[Hotdoger]

Then we find out Rambone's bulldozer is really the size of a matchbox and the damage is minuscule and everyone has been spun into Rambone's web again.

 

[dirtfarmerz]

Of course it appears the bulldozer is actually working in a construction zone doing the work it was contracted to do...

Okay, I should have seen that one coming. You make the bulldozer seem like Obamacare.

 

[Bunnykid68]

I think the bulldozer needs racing stripes

 

[jamil]

It seems like most of Rambone’s posts go something like this:

Rambone is letting us know there is a bulldozer coming down our street. It is taking out all of the mailboxes, tearing up half of the driveways and some of the front porches of our homes. Rambone believes that the bulldozer will eventually hit some of our homes and possibly end some lives. He says every minute counts and that if we don’t do something, we will suffer because of our lack of effort.

88GT informs us the operator of the bulldozer is driving with an expired license.

Churchmouse tells us he sure would like to drive that thing, maybe swerve to the “left” side of the road more.

mrjarrell says the bulldozer isn’t quite big enough for the job it needs to do.
GodFearinGunTotin is watching, wondering where the bulldozer is going from here…

Dirtfarmers, yikes, believes the diesel’s emissions are exceeding current EPA standards.

Streak says the operator of the bulldozer is doing a good job, but it’s not going quite fast enough.

HeadlessRoland tells us that Rambone has been correct on other issues and from all the damage that is out there for everyone to see, he is probably correct this time.

CarmelHP is complaining that the bulldozer is rusted and looks like it should be scrapped.

And then Rambone reminds us, again, that the bulldozer is coming down the street and that it is doing more damage now than it was when he first told us about it.


If I have not mentioned it before, I really enjoy being a member of INGO.

I'm pretty sure that's just the video of my son when he was three pushing that big Tonka around the living room.

 

[JetGirl]

Wait a sec...

What responsibility do contagiously sick people have to their community?

I've never understood how the unvaccinated pose a threat to the vaccinated?

From the article:

recently wrote a piece which has raised a lot of eyebrows, titled: Refusing Vaccination Puts Others At Risk: A Pragmatic Argument for Coercive Vaccination.

Vaccinated people spread disease too. And people who appear healthy can carry disease.

If vaccinated and healthy-appearing people spread/carry/host anyhow...then what's the point?
What is the point of employing people to work in big corporate money-making labs producing tons of costly meds overseen by the tax supported FDA to be distributed by employed workers just to....

Wait...

Never mind.

 

[Lex Concord]

This is very disappointing. Reason says that there is "no principled libertarian case for vaccine refusal."

I beg to disagree.

Reason Magazine openly advocates forced vaccination | Police State USA

No surprise here. I got one free issue of Reason about 10 years ago, and it stank of collectivism then.

I don't beg to differ, I stand and offer them an opportunity to kiss my ass (I'd demand it, but I actually believe in freedom and the ZAP).

 

[qmikep]

No surprise here. I got one free issue of Reason about 10 years ago, and it stank of collectivism then.

I don't beg to differ, I stand and offer them an opportunity to kiss my ass (I'd demand it, but I actually believe in freedom and the ZAP).

A few years ago I received an advertisement from Reason. At the time I had no idea what Reason magazine was. I just knew I was furious, as the advertisement had a satellite photo of my home on it.

 

[88GT]

Do you take the same position if somebody suffering from AIDs knowingly engages in sexual acts with another person? What if they did it with specific intent to infect others? To reiterate, going to work and suffering through a cold is one thing but at some point, maybe depending on intent and seriousness, there would be some sort of criminal intent.

Perhaps I need to backtrack and explain my use of a certain word. It might help to draw that line. I see communicable as infectious without direct bodily contact or fluid transfer. Most of what we vax for in early childhood falls under this definition. It's why the darn diseases are/were so prevalent. HIV/AIDS is not transmissible between people by indirect contact. It's not even transmissible through most normal bodily contact. And even some fluid transfer is insufficient for transfer. You won't get HIV from sitting in the same room with someone. But you can "catch" the flu, chicken pox, or measles from being in the same room. For some things, you can "catch" it after the infected individual has already left the room.

Having said that, no one is going to "catch" HIV/AIDs, so it's a poor analogy to use in our discussion about whether infected individuals need to quarantine themselves.

So your example not only uses a disease that can't be "caught" but also introduces the component of malice with forethought. Do I draw a line between your example and the on-going argument that public appearance with an infection is an overt act of agression? Yeah, I do.

It seems like most of Rambone’s posts go something like this:

Rambone is letting us know there is a bulldozer coming down our street. It is taking out all of the mailboxes, tearing up half of the driveways and some of the front porches of our homes. Rambone believes that the bulldozer will eventually hit some of our homes and possibly end some lives. He says every minute counts and that if we don’t do something, we will suffer because of our lack of effort.

88GT informs us the operator of the bulldozer is driving with an expired license.

Churchmouse tells us he sure would like to drive that thing, maybe swerve to the “left” side of the road more.

mrjarrell says the bulldozer isn’t quite big enough for the job it needs to do.
GodFearinGunTotin is watching, wondering where the bulldozer is going from here…

Dirtfarmers, yikes, believes the diesel’s emissions are exceeding current EPA standards.

Streak says the operator of the bulldozer is doing a good job, but it’s not going quite fast enough.

HeadlessRoland tells us that Rambone has been correct on other issues and from all the damage that is out there for everyone to see, he is probably correct this time.

CarmelHP is complaining that the bulldozer is rusted and looks like it should be scrapped.

And then Rambone reminds us, again, that the bulldozer is coming down the street and that it is doing more damage now than it was when he first told us about it.


If I have not mentioned it before, I really enjoy being a member of INGO.

I wouldn't care if the license was expired. Anyone who is familiar with me knows I don't have much love for licensing of any kind.

 

[Rob377]

Of course it appears the bulldozer is actually working in a construction zone doing the work it was contracted to do...

Which is, of course, building a FEMA slave labor camp.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Perhaps I need to backtrack and explain my use of a certain word. It might help to draw that line. I see communicable as infectious without direct bodily contact or fluid transfer. Most of what we vax for in early childhood falls under this definition. It's why the darn diseases are/were so prevalent. HIV/AIDS is not transmissible between people by indirect contact. It's not even transmissible through most normal bodily contact. And even some fluid transfer is insufficient for transfer. You won't get HIV from sitting in the same room with someone. But you can "catch" the flu, chicken pox, or measles from being in the same room. For some things, you can "catch" it after the infected individual has already left the room.

Having said that, no one is going to "catch" HIV/AIDs, so it's a poor analogy to use in our discussion about whether infected individuals need to quarantine themselves.

So your example not only uses a disease that can't be "caught" but also introduces the component of malice with forethought. Do I draw a line between your example and the on-going argument that public appearance with an infection is an overt act of agression? Yeah, I do.

It's the behavior of the ill person and their responsibilities are what I find the interesting part of the discussion. Whether it's the common cold, small pox, or AIDs, is really irrelevant. The potential harm the ill person may inflect by his/her interaction depends on a great many factors, as you summarized. Whether those can be or ought to be codified into law is certainly an argument, despite my previous posts, I don't know that I would relish. But to deny the ill person has some personal responsibility has me scratching my head.

 

[Bunnykid68]

It's the behavior of the ill person and their responsibilities are what I find the interesting part of the discussion. Whether it's the common cold, small pox, or AIDs, is really irrelevant. The potential harm the ill person may inflect by his/her interaction depends on a great many factors, as you summarized. Whether those can be or ought to be codified into law is certainly an argument, despite my previous posts, I don't know that I would relish. But to deny the ill person has some personal responsibility has me scratching my head.

And has been said they may be contagious for days or weeks before they are even aware they have it themselves so now you have to draw a line on when they knew they had said infection and whether or not they intentionally tried to get others sick once they were aware. That is not only a slippery slope its a damned rock slide of biblical proportions in my opinion

 

[Rob377]

And has been said they may be contagious for days or weeks before they are even aware they have it themselves so now you have to draw a line on when they knew they had said infection and whether or not they intentionally tried to get others sick once they were aware. That is not only a slippery slope its a damned rock slide of biblical proportions in my opinion

Why do you hate Mary Mallon, and others like her? Why do you renounce her God/FSM-given right to work in the food industry? Why do you hate freedom?

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

And has been said they may be contagious for days or weeks before they are even aware they have it themselves so now you have to draw a line on when they knew they had said infection and whether or not they intentionally tried to get others sick once they were aware. That is not only a slippery slope its a damned rock slide of biblical proportions in my opinion

I'll grant all that. I'll ask it another way...If you know you're sick, do you feel any responsibility for going out in public and possibly making other people sick? I'm not even talking at this point about whether it ought to be illegal.

I guess it's just me. I don't go to work when I'm sick, when I believe I have a greater possibility of giving my illness to another. I believe I have that responsibility.

 

[Bunnykid68]

Why do you hate Mary Mallon, and others like her? Why do you renounce her God/FSM-given right to work in the food industry? Why do you hate freedom?

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Typhoid Mary.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Typhoid Mary.

 

[Bunnykid68]

Typhoid Mary.

That part I understood, the rest, not so much.

I think she rocks. They tormented her because she was stronger than the rest of the sheep.

 

[Bunnykid68]

I'll grant all that. I'll ask it another way...If you know you're sick, do you feel any responsibility for going out in public and possibly making other people sick? I'm not even talking at this point about whether it ought to be illegal.

I guess it's just me. I don't go to work when I'm sick, when I believe I have a greater possibility of giving my illness to another. I believe I have that responsibility.

I typically stay away from people when I am sick, but sometimes I have no choice but to go work, no one else is going to step up and pay my bills. But I am also spreading those germs for days before it effects me in a way that I know that I am sick.

 

[rambone]

I'll grant all that. I'll ask it another way...If you know you're sick, do you feel any responsibility for going out in public and possibly making other people sick? I'm not even talking at this point about whether it ought to be illegal.I guess it's just me. I don't go to work when I'm sick, when I believe I have a greater possibility of giving my illness to another. I believe I have that responsibility.

Have you heard of chicken pox parties?

 

[mrjarrell]

Reason has a response to the original article and a rebuttal to the response. By the way, the author did not title the article as "coercive vaccination". The editors at Reason did that. Reason is not advocating one thing or the other, they are just running articles, not taking a stance.

Vaccination and Free Choice - Reason.com

Vaccines and the Responsibility To Not Put Others at Risk - Reason.com