Proper order of things...buy/build first or paperwork first?

[nismoz33]

I've been searching here & other sites & can't seem to find a solid answer to my question.

I am looking at building an AR but want to have a 11.5" upper. I will be building the lower but am not sure as to the proper order of things.

Do I build the lower & purchase the upper & then send in the paperwork or do I need to fill out the paperwork & then start the build? Do I not have to build the lower first so that I have the serial number for the paperwork?

I'm just looking for a clear order of things if I pursue this process. I want to ensure that I don't build a lower & then have issues when I go to buy the upper I want & want to avoid any delays where I can.

Thanks for any help with this & I apologize if this has been answered before & I missed it in my searches.

Nick

 

[esrice]

You at least need a stripped lower so you can put the serial number on the Form 1.

Some recommend building the lower first so you make sure its in spec before you spend $200 on the Form 1.

You can buy the upper anytime, but be aware that if you receive it before your Form 1 comes back you'll need to store it away from your lower. Some will say that the law in this regard has changed recently but I would personally err on the side of caution.

And I'm probably the worst one to comment on timeline, as I pretty much had my entire SBR built (but separate) before I finally sent off my Form 1.

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

1. Buy the Lower.
2. Use the serial number already on the weapon as your serial number.
3. Engrave your name, city and state.
4. Submit Form 1.
5. Wait a very long time.
6. Receive approved Form 1 back.
7. Purchase upper / barrel and assemble.
8. Enjoy!

 

[nismoz33]

Thanks guys!

SemperFiUSMC, that was the process I had in mind from what I was able to put together from different sources....

 

[JoshuaW]

You could also build it as a pistol to start.

 

[nismoz33]

You could also build it as a pistol to start.

Are there any special requirements to build a pistol lower? What is involved to change a pistol lower to a rifle lower to use with a SBR upper? Is it the same process as getting the tax stamp on a rifle lower?

I've never really looked into pistol lowers so I am not familiar if there are any special rules/laws with them.

 

[ryknoll3]

You at least need a stripped lower so you can put the serial number on the Form 1.

Some recommend building the lower first so you make sure its in spec before you spend $200 on the Form 1.

You can buy the upper anytime, but be aware that if you receive it before your Form 1 comes back you'll need to store it away from your lower. Some will say that the law in this regard has changed recently but I would personally err on the side of caution.

And I'm probably the worst one to comment on timeline, as I pretty much had my entire SBR built (but separate) before I finally sent off my Form 1.

The law has absolutely NOT changed recently in this regard. You could find yourself in trouble if you are in possession of a lower receiver with a stock along with short upper.

You have a couple of options to keep you all nice a legal and safe:

1. Buy a stripped or complete lower. File a Form 1 with the configuration you intend to build, wait until approval comes back (3-5 months), buy upper and complete rifle.

2. Buy a stripped or complete lower. File a Form 1 with the configuration you intend to build. Buy upper and store and family or friends who do not own AR's , or at least possess an AR pistol or SBR's.

3. Buy a stripped lower. Buy short barreled upper. Build gun as complete pistol. File Form 1 with intended configuration. Upon receipt of approved Form 1, remove pistol buffer tube and install rifle stock of your choice.


Option 3 is probably the best route, because it allows you to function test your setup before you file the paperwork to insure your lower is GTG. Also, you have something to use until the paperwork is approved, instead of sitting with a half complete gun in the safe.

 

[JoshuaW]

Are there any special requirements to build a pistol lower? What is involved to change a pistol lower to a rifle lower to use with a SBR upper? Is it the same process as getting the tax stamp on a rifle lower?

I've never really looked into pistol lowers so I am not familiar if there are any special rules/laws with them.

Buy your stripped lower, make sure it is sold as a pistol or "other". Build the pistol. It becomes an SBR when you put a stock on it.

 

[Booya]

You could also build it as a pistol to start.

3. Buy a stripped lower. Buy short barreled upper. Build gun as complete pistol. File Form 1 with intended configuration. Upon receipt of approved Form 1, remove pistol buffer tube and install rifle stock of your choice.

Option 3 is probably the best route, because it allows you to function test your setup before you file the paperwork to insure your lower is GTG. Also, you have something to use until the paperwork is approved, instead of sitting with a half complete gun in the safe.

This is the route I took. The wait is forever so get the paperwork out as soon as you can and then, basically, just forget about it until it arrives.

Way I see it there is no sense in having an operational lower laying around you can't shoot right? Like stated earlier though, make sure your FFL sells the lower to you as "other".

 

[KDUBCR250]

You could also build it as a pistol to start.

+1 Waiting on my paper work now. As soon as it arrives Ill have a pistol buffer tube for sale

 

[DarkRose]

1. Buy the Lower.
2. Use the serial number already on the weapon as your serial number.
3. Engrave your name, city and state.
4. Submit Form 1.
5. Wait a very long time.
6. Receive approved Form 1 back.
7. Purchase upper / barrel and assemble.
8. Enjoy!

Was just getting ready to ask about the process, but just to clarify things a bit to get them straight in my mind...

- Does the lower need to be engraved before the Form 1 is submitted? Just in case it's denied for whatever reason, you're stuck with a lower with your name and location that doesn't need to be on there...

- Once the lower is registered, any upper (standard or SBR) can be put on that lower, but an SBR upper can ONLY go on that registered lower, correct?

 

[mjrducky]

Was just getting ready to ask about the process, but just to clarify things a bit to get them straight in my mind...

- Does the lower need to be engraved before the Form 1 is submitted? Just in case it's denied for whatever reason, you're stuck with a lower with your name and location that doesn't need to be on there...


It's recammended to have the lower engraved first because if you get your approval then the engraver screws up the spelling of your name in some way. Your stuck because the serial number is already registered and you can't change it.

- Once the lower is registered, any upper (standard or SBR) can be put on that lower, but an SBR upper can ONLY go on that registered lower, correct?

Correct once registered you can use any SBR upper on it (keep the original though) and yes the SBR upper can only go on an SBR registered lower or a Pistol AR.

 

[nismoz33]

- Once the lower is registered, any upper (standard or SBR) can be put on that lower, but an SBR upper can ONLY go on that registered lower, correct?

It is my understanding that ANY upper can go on a registered lower.

If you have a registered lower, you can user a SBR upper or any rifle upper. You just can't affix a SBR upper to a non-registered lower unless it is a pistol lower.

Correct?

 

[JoshuaW]

Was just getting ready to ask about the process, but just to clarify things a bit to get them straight in my mind...

- Does the lower need to be engraved before the Form 1 is submitted? Just in case it's denied for whatever reason, you're stuck with a lower with your name and location that doesn't need to be on there...

- Once the lower is registered, any upper (standard or SBR) can be put on that lower, but an SBR upper can ONLY go on that registered lower, correct?

Unless you have a checkered past, you shouldn't get denied. The engraving MUST be done before your stamp comes back. As stated previously, get it done ahead of time to eliminate the possibilities of having a mishap.

 

[DarkRose]

Unless you have a checkered past, you shouldn't get denied. The engraving MUST be done before your stamp comes back. As stated previously, get it done ahead of time to eliminate the possibilities of having a mishap.

Well, considering my IN LTCH and 03 FFL, I wouldn't expect to get denied, never even gotten a delay on a NICS check, proceed every time...

Got a batch of lowers I want engraved, think I'll have one of them done with the ATF legal name and location when I send them off, save some extra shipping...

 

[ryknoll3]

Unless you have a checkered past, you shouldn't get denied. The engraving MUST be done before your stamp comes back. As stated previously, get it done ahead of time to eliminate the possibilities of having a mishap.

Please cite regs on this. This is not true. You can do it before, during or after. If you do it after, it should be done in a very timely fashion, but there are no laws or CFR stating that it MUST be done before. Also, even after your stamp comes back, you have the option to send it back and request a refund if the firearm was NEVER assembled as an SBR, so you wouldn't have to have the engraving done before the stamp comes back.

Here's a little more logic behind this. You have to consider that AR's are not the only firearms that are SBR'd (though probably most common these days). You also have cases where someone might build a short barreled bolt action from scratch or some other such home made gun. You are not required to have manufactured the receiver before you send off for approval, so you wouldn't be required to have required engraving in place before it's approved either.

 

[Aszerigan]

Buy your stripped lower, make sure it is sold as a pistol or "other".

If you buy a stripped lower, it's registered as an 'other' anyway.

 

[supermahns]

Would it be possible to send in your paperwork for both a sbr and a suppressor at the same time if one wanted to speed the process of getting both approved?

 

[JoshuaW]

Would it be possible to send in your paperwork for both a sbr and a suppressor at the same time if one wanted to speed the process of getting both approved?

You can always send in paperwork for multiple items. They won't come back any faster, but they will come back close to the same time.


Ryknoll3, I stand corrected. The way I understood it was that it had to be engraved prior to the stamp. Now I would assume that it has to be engraved before it is built as an SBR, correct?

 

[DarkRose]

One other engraving question...

Does it have to be full legal name? I think most I've seen are just first and last or first, middle i., and last...

Also with the full legal question, if it's just first and last, does it have to be legal first name, or can it be like Bob for Robert, Drew for Andrew, Steve for Steven or Stephen, Mike for Michael, etc.? I know nicknames don't work, but common accepted abbreviated names?

The link I found to the regs doesn't work but was stated on the site as

"Required information on an SBR is the model (if such designation has been made), caliber or gauge, and the manufacturer’s name (or recognized abbreviation). Also for a domestically made (SBR) the city and state (or recognized abbreviation), where you as the manufacturer made the firearm."

It just says "manufacturer's name", not full legal name, or legal name...

Just want to make sure when I go down this road, my i's are dotted and t's crossed.