Police force open a door

[coyn]

I just read this news article and questioned if the police were within their right to enter the home. Event In Larwill Ends In Arrest

They were going on the word of one individual that said she had text messages saying he was going to commit suicide. They may or may not have known for sure if he was actually inside the residence but it said they opened the door and made entry. Now it doesn't say they had a warrant but if they did not, is it legal for them to gain entry and in turn is the home owner within his rights to defend?

 

[Kutnupe14]

I just read this news article and questioned if the police were within their right to enter the home. Event In Larwill Ends In Arrest

They were going on the word of one individual that said she had text messages saying he was going to commit suicide. They may or may not have known for sure if he was actually inside the residence but it said they opened the door and made entry. Now it doesn't say they had a warrant but if they did not, is it legal for them to gain entry and in turn is the home owner within his rights to defend?

Need a lil more than a text message to make entry.
Is there not more to this story? An ERT team, aka SWAT, makes entry (have no idea why), guy is pointing a gun at them, and isn't "handled?" Just seems odd. Beat officers normally handle suicides.

 

[JetGirl]

Please do not let Rookie know that reporting through text messaging can cause a SWATting.

 

[inrunner]

"Guthrie was taken to Parkview Whitley Hospital for observation then jailed in Whitley County on a charge of pointing a loaded firearm. His bond has been set at $100,000 surety."

Now im sure that's fishy. I guess they could have shot him. a police officer would have said will killing the man " I'm only here to help"

 

[KLB]

Need a lil more than a text message to make entry.
Is there not more to this story? An ERT team, aka SWAT, makes entry (have no idea why), guy is pointing a gun at them, and isn't "handled?" Just seems odd. Beat officers normally handle suicides.

Sheriff's deputies made the entry and had the gun pointed at them.

Deputies were unable to get the man to answer his front door, but forced open a rear door on the mobile home and made entry. They were greeted by Jeremy Todd Guthrie, 41, who was pointing a handgun at them.

They then called for help

The officers immediately exited the residence and called for the Indiana State Police Emergency Response Team.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Sheriff's deputies made the entry and had the gun pointed at them.


They then called for help

Ah, gotcha, I misread

 

[inrunner]

They then called for help[/QUOTE]

Indiana Passes ‘Stand Your Ground’ Law

Indiana Passes ‘Stand Your Ground’ Law | The Real Revo

 

[coyn]

Sheriff's deputies made the entry and had the gun pointed at them.


They then called for help

Yeah, initally the deputies made entry then called swat after the owner pointed a gun while inside his home. My question, with the facts given in the article, did they have enough probable cause to gain entry in the first place?

 

[Kmcinnes]

First off, Why are the police intervening in a suicide? I can see it if other people were at risk but if the man was in the privacy of his own home and wanted to kill himself and was harming no one other than himself than that is his business not theirs. Not saying its right but we don't need the police to save us from ourselves.

Second from my understanding they can not enter without a warrant, so the man was in his rights, now if he handled it properly is still in question imho. We don't know any of the particulars other than what the police said (and I respect all of our law enforcement men and women) but maybe the man was asleep and woken up by the banging on his door and then next thing you know the door is being kicked in.......I think I would do the same thing however when asked to put the gun down and found out what was going on I would have cooperated.

 

[JetGirl]

First off, Why are the police intervening in a suicide?

Because in our society, suicide is breaking the law.
And the authorities know what's best for you.

Fling purple where you need it.

 

[Kutnupe14]

First off, Why are the police intervening in a suicide? I can see it if other people were at risk but if the man was in the privacy of his own home and wanted to kill himself and was harming no one other than himself than that is his business not theirs. Not saying its right but we don't need the police to save us from ourselves.

Second from my understanding they can not enter without a warrant, so the man was in his rights, now if he handled it properly is still in question imho. We don't know any of the particulars other than what the police said (and I respect all of our law enforcement men and women) but maybe the man was asleep and woken up by the banging on his door and then next thing you know the door is being kicked in.......I think I would do the same thing however when asked to put the gun down and found out what was going on I would have cooperated.

He should have simply should have stayed silent and killed himself. If it was "his business," he shouldn't have been texting anyone else. It's ridiculous to think that if a person calls another and states that he is going to kill himself, that they won't call the police to stop it.

 

[IndyDave1776]

He should have simply should have stayed silent and killed himself. If it was "his business," he shouldn't have been texting anyone else. It's ridiculous to think that if a person calls another and states that he is going to kill himself, that they won't call the police to stop it.

One huge flaw. You are requiring rational thought from a person who by nature of the situation necessarily is in an irrational state of mind.

 

[coyn]

He should have simply should have stayed silent and killed himself. If it was "his business," he shouldn't have been texting anyone else. It's ridiculous to think that if a person calls another and states that he is going to kill himself, that they won't call the police to stop it.

It's because he wasn't really going to kill himself. He texted because he is very depressed and it was his way of asking for help. He just went about it in the wrong way. Now he gets to sit in jail and not get the help that he obviously needs.

 

[netsecurity]

I think that if the police, or fire/rescue have probable cause to believe that someone is in imminent danger they can enter without a warrant to do a welfare check (10-42?) on the person. This would be different than a search warrant, because they cannot search, but I bet if something illegal was in plain view they would be allowed to make an arrest.

 

[IndyDave1776]

It's because he wasn't really going to kill himself. He texted because he is very depressed and it was his way of asking for help. He just went about it in the wrong way. Now he gets to sit in jail and not get the help that he obviously needs.

I thought about this and then though better of making a conclusion thinking about something that happened when I was about 8 years old. A woman made a couple of calls to fellow members of an organization of a similar nature to the text in question, which was dismissed on the same grounds as your conclusion. She was found dead the next morning.

If someone makes contact over suicide, it is true that it is a plea for help, but assuming it to be a hyperbole is not a safe assumption. It could well be that such a person doesn't really want to die but doesn't see a viable alternative. If no one can supply that viable alternative, chances are that this person will be found dead.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I think that if the police, or fire/rescue have probable cause to believe that someone is in imminent danger they can enter without a warrant to do a welfare check (10-42?) on the person. This would be different than a search warrant, because they cannot search, but I bet if something illegal was in plain view they would be allowed to make an arrest.

This is my understanding also.

I thought about this and then though better of making a conclusion thinking about something that happened when I was about 8 years old. A woman made a couple of calls to fellow members of an organization of a similar nature to the text in question, which was dismissed on the same grounds as your conclusion. She was found dead the next morning.

If someone makes contact over suicide, it is true that it is a plea for help, but assuming it to be a hyperbole is not a safe assumption. It could well be that such a person doesn't really want to die but doesn't see a viable alternative. If no one can supply that viable alternative, chances are that this person will be found dead.

If I am contacted by a friend or loved one contemplating suicide, you can bet I'll be contacting the police to hopefully save a life.

 

[IndyDave1776]

If I am contacted by a friend or loved one contemplating suicide, you can bet I'll be contacting the police to hopefully save a life.

Assuming that there isn't a significant geographical barrier, why the police? They don't have magical counseling powers and do not know your loved one.

 

[netsecurity]

Assuming that there isn't a significant geographical barrier, why the police? They don't have magical counseling powers and do not know your loved one.

Probably because medics aren't trained to deal with guns...

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Assuming that there isn't a significant geographical barrier, why the police? They don't have magical counseling powers and do not know your loved one.

Agreed...just keeping in the theme of the thread.

 

[SERparacord]

Not sure if I would call the cops or not. It may depend on the quality of the firearms in the estate sale.