Pastors getting shot

[Indy_Guy_77]

For now, in general, our church is a no-go-zone due to the school/daycare/preschool/whatever that goes on throughout the week.

Doesn't stop many folks from carrying, though. It does stop me, however, because I'd just as soon not be a felon.

BUT, very soon, there will be several armed men acting in an "official" security capacity at the church...

-J-

 

[Protest]

Pastor Protest
Would I be welcome to open carry when I visit your church? I doubt if many people would notice the .44 strapped to my hip anyway

Absolutely welcome to!

 

[Roadie]

You sound like my kinda Pastor! Hmm, we ARE looking for a new church....

 

[Renegade1978]

I pastor a Baptist church and I am always armed on Sundays. We have no school as part of our church. I have spoken with one of my deacons (a former LEO) and he is going to approach several of the men in our church who have permits. We'll be asking them to be prepared to protect the innocent members of our church.

 

[JohnBoy1]

Some people have no heart or soul, I now no why my great uncle carried a 1911 though.

 

[1946]

Question out of ignorance. If the church has a preschool Mon. through Fri. only, and the building is used for church only on Sunday. Does the no carry school zone apply for Sunday service?

 

[JohnBoy1]

Not to my knowledge, i never had anyone say anything about it except wanting to see my 686 when leaving.

 

[bigiron]

Question out of ignorance. If the church has a preschool Mon. through Fri. only, and the building is used for church only on Sunday. Does the no carry school zone apply for Sunday service?

YEP! it applies 24/7 and 365. only exception is written documentation that you are "employed" or "an authorized" security agent. i would get the statute but my wife is ready to leave for church, coincidently. oh yeah, i'll be carrying as usual.

Protest: i'd be careful, you're on the road to host an INGO open carry event one sunday. you'll love the INGO crowd but we get fidgety sitting in wooden pews. GOD BLESS and be safe up there!

 

[Bill of Rights]

Question out of ignorance. If the church has a preschool Mon. through Fri. only, and the building is used for church only on Sunday. Does the no carry school zone apply for Sunday service?

Yes. A school is never not a school.

 

[Bill of Rights]

YEP! it applies 24/7 and 365. only exception is written documentation that you are "employed" or "an authorized" security agent. i would get the statute but my wife is ready to leave for church, coincidently. oh yeah, i'll be carrying as usual.

Protest: i'd be careful, you're on the road to host an INGO open carry event one sunday. you'll love the INGO crowd but we get fidgety sitting in wooden pews. GOD BLESS and be safe up there!

IC 35-47-9
IC 35-47-9
Chapter 9. Possession of Firearms on School Property and School Buses
IC 35-47-9-1
Exemptions from chapter
Sec. 1. This chapter does not apply to the following:
(1) A:
(A) federal;
(B) state; or
(C) local;
law enforcement officer.
(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or
(B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;
to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.
(3) A person who:
(A) may legally possess a firearm; and
(B) possesses the firearm in a motor vehicle that is being operated by the person to transport another person to or from a school or a school function.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.11.

IC 35-47-9-2
Possession of firearms on school property, at school function, or on school bus; felony
Sec. 2. A person who possesses a firearm:
(1) in or on school property;
(2) in or on property that is being used by a school for a school function; or
(3) on a school bus;
commits a Class D felony.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.11.

Now... if whoever is in charge of the school (maybe the pastor?) approves you to carry there... This law is inapplicable.

In addition, I am of the belief that Sec. 1. This chapter does not apply to the following:
(1) A:
(A) federal;
(B) state; or
(C) local;
law enforcement officer.
(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or
(B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;
to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.
(3) A person who:
(A) may legally possess a firearm; and
(B) possesses the firearm in a motor vehicle that is being operated by the person to transport another person to or from a school or a school function.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.11.


However, an attorney has advised me that this is an incorrect reading. If you choose to attempt this, I would recommend having representation already arranged.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Joe Williams]

Question out of ignorance. If the church has a preschool Mon. through Fri. only, and the building is used for church only on Sunday. Does the no carry school zone apply for Sunday service?

Yes. 24/7/365. Whether school is in session or not.

 

[Guy9]

Not brave enough to carry to church yet. Dont think the past. would care, but never asked him. Only concern is for the congragation if somthing happens, lots of people to get in the way,or over penatration. Any thoughts on that?

 

[nalees]

i will be starting seminary in August and i have had my LTCH for over a year now. i cannot carry on our church grounds due to it being a K-12 school, as well. i'm glad you posted the law about being able to be granted "permission" to carry as an authorized protector. i will have to speak up at my first staff meeting about that request

 

[Que]

I'm sure my Pastor would not go for anyone carrying a gun, but what gets me is that so many Pastors, these days, have armor bearers (guards), who watch over them and ensure their safety. Also, there are plenty of deacons, etc., who get the offering to the finance office.

I will always to live according to my signature...

 

[Magneto]

This is something I have thought alot about. I serve in my church, and sit about 5 feet from the main entrance, but not where I am going to be the first targeted. If someone was to walk into church with intent to harm, I am in the perfect spot to stop them. I have not talked with the Pastor about this, but the elder who sits next to me is a fellow ingo member, and as long as we do it responsibly, I doubt he would have much problem with it. I do worry about someone that is unstable coming in during service looking to do harm.

 

[Delmar]

... I do worry about someone that is unstable coming in during service looking to do harm.

Don't worry, just be prepared.

 

[mettle]

This is something I have thought alot about. I serve in my church, and sit about 5 feet from the main entrance, but not where I am going to be the first targeted. If someone was to walk into church with intent to harm, I am in the perfect spot to stop them. I have not talked with the Pastor about this, but the elder who sits next to me is a fellow ingo member, and as long as we do it responsibly, I doubt he would have much problem with it. I do worry about someone that is unstable coming in during service looking to do harm.

I look, sadly, for more jihadist activity to target smaller 'points of political influence' like churches soon. the cowards can expect virtually NO resistance or conflict as they slaughter away. They could be in and out in 3 minutes. I think it's time for America to man up. Especially the Christian Man.

 

[WeAreNotAlone]

As noted above whenever people are known to be disarmed, it emboldens the criminal element.

Everyone disarmed= Easy Pickens
Everyone armed = Criminal goes somewhere else.

Another fun fact= Professional Criminals don't fear the Police, as much as a Civilian that is armed and protecting their children.

With the above said more people have died at the hands of governments, their rulers than anything else.

I think everyone that A: Believes in Freedom, and B: Wants to keep their guns read thru the below links-

The Smallest Minority

DEATH BY GOVERNMENT: GENOCIDE AND MASS MURDER

(The above represents 8 YEARS of cluing data and research)

While the above church /school shootings are a tragic we are at this point in time in real danger of losing our Second Amendment.

Some numbers of those that died at the hand at the hands of those in power.

1. 169,202,000 Murdered: Summary and Conclusions [20th Century Democide]
​

I BACKGROUND

2. The New Concept of Democide [Definition of Democide]
3. Over 133,147,000 Murdered: Pre-Twentieth Century Democide​

II 128,168,000 VICTIMS: THE DEKA-MEGAMURDERERS

4. 61,911,000 Murdered: The Soviet Gulag State
5. 35,236,000 Murdered: The Communist Chinese Ant Hill
6. 20,946,000 Murdered: The Nazi Genocide State
7. 10,214,000 Murdered: The Depraved Nationalist Regime​

III 19,178,000 VICTIMS: THE LESSER MEGA-MURDERERS

8. 5,964,000 Murdered: Japan's Savage Military
9. 2,035,000 Murdered: The Khmer Rouge Hell State
10. 1,883,000 Murdered: Turkey's Genocidal Purges
11. 1,670,000 Murdered: The Vietnamese War State
12. 1,585,000 Murdered: Poland's Ethnic Cleansing
13. 1,503,000 Murdered: The Pakistani Cutthroat State
14. 1,072,000 Murdered: Tito's Slaughterhouse​

IV 4,145,000 VICTIMS: SUSPECTED MEGAMURDERERS

15. 1,663,000 Murdered? Orwellian North Korea
16. 1,417,000 Murdered? Barbarous Mexico
17. 1,066,000 Murdered? Feudal Russia

 

[Flitmob]

I have no problem with men or women of the cloth carrying guns. I think someone would think twice about ripping off a church or causing problems there. I think the parish should know and know why. I see a lot of "haters" out there and if I was of certain denominations I would feel more comfortable knowing that someone was looking after my body on this planet and my soul when I leave this planet.

 

[bigiron]

Not brave enough to carry to church yet. Dont think the past. would care, but never asked him. Only concern is for the congragation if somthing happens, lots of people to get in the way,or over penatration. Any thoughts on that?

actually, i have completed quite a bit of research and thought on this exact subject. i have been in church faithfully serving since i was 18, which is the exact year i received my LTCH and began carrying. as all tactical situation, you have to be aware of over-penetratiion and chaos. people are trained to hit the deck when they hear gun fire. its just what we've been taught from the movies. you will have a few scramblers but you should be in a position to engage within 3-5 seconds once the first shot is fired. so, stay alert and be prepared. i used to practice my reaction while at the church alone. you have to be able to react within those few seconds otherwise by-standers will get in the way. over-penetration will happen but it can be managed. stay low and aim center mass. the trajectory of your shot should travel upwards unless obstructed. hitting a body center mass will give you the greatest odds that the energy will be absorbed by bone or body mass. also, try and not shot toward the chior or balcony if you can. my biggerst concern while in church is where i sit. i don't like to be way in the front and certainly not in the middle. i stay on the sides of the auditorium and away from the back doors which i cannot see behind me. i'm always aware of whos coming and going. i would suggest thinking about the layout of the church, identifying exits and being able to react within that split-second window to engage. other than all that, focus your attention on GOD.