OK folks, tear me a new one

[4sarge]

The problems spoken of in this thread fail to address the real problem. It is not as though the govt. is some evil organization out there working independently of the people. Nearly half the people in this country are afraid of your guns and mine. Not because they should be. It is an irrational fear and the govt. is expected to save them. Blame the sheep with no spine.

It depends on how you define "EVIL" Big Government is always looking to regulate and tax anything and everything that they can for Big Government to grow and prosper. Name one thing other than basics that the Government has made better without over regulation and employing thousands to unsuccessfully regulate.

War on Drugs, Border Security, TSA, BATF etc. BIG GOVERNMENT is a living breathing Beast that consumes all that it can. Simple is Better. Look at the Tax Code. The IRS doesn't even understand it. We need Government but a Government that works for us, Not against us.

 

[Coach]

"Name one thing other than basics that the Government has made better without over regulation and employing thousands to unsuccessfully regulate."

1). Pure Food and Drug Act 1906. I don't know about you but I don't like mouse turds in my cottage chesse.

2). How about a road system that is the envy of the rest of the world.


The govt will work for us if we make it. The ballot box is a start.

 

[Fletch]

BTW Fletch, thanks for posting...I'll never be uncivil with someone that doesn't see eye-to-eye with me, but I will have a civil debate 'til the cows come home.

Again, we probably see eye-to-eye much more than you realize. Philosophically, I'm a hardcore libertarian of the Hoppean variety (see [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Monarchy-Natural/dp/0765808684/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1214920482&sr=8-1"]Democracy: The God that Failed[/ame]). On the practical side of things, I'm wondering if licensing and registration is the hill I want to die on.

 

[Fletch]

For example: this doesn't sound half bad to me.

[ame=http://youtube.com/watch?v=zYXIjQM4Mkg&feature=related]YouTube - Gun Control (Titus)[/ame]

 

[Bill of Rights]

"Name one thing other than basics that the Government has made better without over regulation and employing thousands to unsuccessfully regulate."

1). Pure Food and Drug Act 1906. I don't know about you but I don't like mouse turds in my cottage chesse.

2). How about a road system that is the envy of the rest of the world.


The govt will work for us if we make it. The ballot box is a start.

Hey Coach... I think I recall reading that a certain amount of rat turd in some food (I forget which one) is acceptable to gov't regulators.

To me, it seems more like the free market would fix problems like that-that is, when the public finds out either from employees or from private testing that some food item is unsafely prepared, they just stop buying from that company until the co. changes it's practices. Case in point: Underwriters Laboratories (UL listed) is a private business that tests and lists or fails to list devices.

As for the roads-yeah, Larry, Daryl, and Daryl standing on the side of the road in their orange vests and green shirts are doing a bang-up job fixing roads, that's why it takes months to do a mile of roadway and there are always cost-overruns. No insult to any road workers; this is a slam on their management alone. Or lack thereof.

Government can't manage it's way out of a wet paper bag.

I know this is going to sound sarcastic, but it's meant toward the system, not toward the poster.

Blessings,
B

 

[Bill of Rights]

For example: this doesn't sound half bad to me.

YouTube - Gun Control (Titus)

I really hope you're kidding that this doesn't sound half bad to you, Fletch. This is exactly the kind of thing the Brady Bunch says will happen- people being shot over trivial things. Sure, the carjacking thing is a real crime, but they don't show that the confronted carjacker is likely running and crapping his pants at the same time. Crime averted, no one dead. This is, IMHO, a terrible video to post.

Blessings,
B

 

[Fletch]

OK, disclaimers in the original post don't work, reinforcing refusals to argue don't work, and (admittedly dark) humor doesn't work. I give up.

 

[4sarge]

"Name one thing other than basics that the Government has made better without over regulation and employing thousands to unsuccessfully regulate."

1). Pure Food and Drug Act 1906. I don't know about you but I don't like mouse turds in my cottage chesse.

2). How about a road system that is the envy of the rest of the world.


The govt will work for us if we make it. The ballot box is a start.

I said Basics, common defense etc. and the road system if you haven't noticed has been going South for a very long time. Infra structure of the country (bridges, sewers etc) are in dire need of replacement but funds are being used to support non productive Government Give Aways.

Our drug system is bloated with useless regulations that prohibit you from acquiring medicine at a reasonable cost and Hot Dogs as a prime example are allowed to contain such niceties as rat hair.

The Ballot Box is fixed. The powers that be hand pick who will be running and Not who the common people want or need. Both parties are out to protect their status quo. Term limits and a return to a citizen legislature is what is needed. Instead we have institutionalized government, for and by government intervention.

 

[indyjoe]

The way I see it, the biggest problem is a two party system, that controls the media. I'm trying to remember what country it is that has a smarter voting system. You list votes in order of preference.

1 - Ron Paul
2 - OK Candidate
3 - Not So Great Candidate
4 - Obama

Now after first tally, If you first cut doesn't make it to a high enough level, your second is used, etc.

This would effectively eliminate parties and would stop the whole idea of "throwing your vote away" to vote with the only person you could bring yourself to vote for.

McCain scares me a bunch, because the war is helping kill the dollar's value faster than ever. Leaving a war we shouldn't be fighting isn't surrender, it is common sense.

Obama scares me even more.

Again stuck with least of two evils. It has been that way since I've been voting.

 

[Bill of Rights]

OK, disclaimers in the original post don't work, reinforcing refusals to argue don't work, and (admittedly dark) humor doesn't work. I give up.

Sorry, Fletch, I just didn't see any humor in this, just fuel for the antis. We'll agree to disagree on it. Deal?

The way I see it, the biggest problem is a two party system, that controls the media. I'm trying to remember what country it is that has a smarter voting system. You list votes in order of preference.

1 - Ron Paul
2 - OK Candidate
3 - Not So Great Candidate
4 - Obama

Now after first tally, If you first cut doesn't make it to a high enough level, your second is used, etc.

This would effectively eliminate parties and would stop the whole idea of "throwing your vote away" to vote with the only person you could bring yourself to vote for.

McCain scares me a bunch, because the war is helping kill the dollar's value faster than ever. Leaving a war we shouldn't be fighting isn't surrender, it is common sense.

Obama scares me even more.

Again stuck with least of two evils. It has been that way since I've been voting.

This sounds like it would work but for one problem. I think it was Josef Stalin who said, "It matters not who casts the votes, only who counts them."

Having the jackasses and the RINOs (note: Not Rhino! ) "policing" each other is like having the weasel raid the henhouse while the fox "guards".... and vice versa.

And with all that, we're the ones with egg on our faces.

The Founders set up a pretty good system, but like most other things, leave it to government to f**k it up.

Blessings,
B

 

[Disposable Heart]

OK, disclaimers in the original post don't work, reinforcing refusals to argue don't work, and (admittedly dark) humor doesn't work. I give up.

Never give up on what you believe, no matter what anyone else says. Some people will scream, pull their hair, tell you are wrong, point out "facts" to prove you are wrong, challenge your patriotism, your intelligence, and when things degenerate sufficiently, your sexuality, all because you have an opinion that threatens their views.

I for one, actually believe in some of the gun control measures passed in the 90s. Bill Ruger had a reasonable point (maybe not a good one, but one he founded by his research and beliefs). I belive misdemeanors should be automatic no gun restrictions. I catch flack for that occasionally, but its all part of having one's opinion. To fold is to say: Yes I agree entirely. You have beaten my head in and let my mind matter flow into the street. Freedom of expression and speech (core to freedom of OPINION) are fundamentals that many people touting the Constitution ignore while questioning your views. There is nothing wrong with questioning another person, but be civil about it.

You can agree with someone, you can disagree with someone, but realize it is their opinion, nothing more. I suspect I am now on someones poop list, but that is a small price to pay to have one's ability to think independant of a party line.

Fletch: Have a different opinion! Many on the internet (not necessarily here) will yell, scream troll, etc... But in the end, you have your dignity by even expressing it. A man garners far more respect from me by expressing themselves and who they are (their beliefs and opinions) than by folding under what they see is the entire world weight against them. Let your own feeling of being sentient be Atlas against the crashing world.

 

[Fletch]

You misunderstand. I give up on trying to explain myself, not on what I believe.

 

[JetGirl]

Never give up on what you believe,

I for one, actually believe in some of the gun control measures passed in the 90s.

Fletch: Have a different opinion! ... But in the end, you have your dignity by even expressing it.

*tap tap tap* Hello? *tap tap* Is this thing on?
Did you even READ his initial comments on that site?

"I want to make something very clear: give me the keys to the kingdom, and "shall not be infringed" will mean exactly what it says. I would remove all restrictions on the ownership ("keep") and carrying ("bear") of any kind of weapon. I would go much further than most people who call themselves "pro-gun". "Infringing" on the right begins the moment you start trespassing on it... "
(emphasis mine)

That doesn't sound like a fold to me. I'm pretty sure this guy is John Galt.

 

[Fletch]

I'm pretty sure this guy is John Galt.

You flatter me

 

[Benny]

Originally Posted by Fletch
For example: this doesn't sound half bad to me.

YouTube - Gun Control (Titus)

I love the first 23 seconds of the video. It is on point and I completely agree. But the last 38 seconds of the video is anti-gun propaganda.

 

[Fletch]

I love the first 23 seconds of the video. It is on point and I completely agree. But the last 38 seconds of the video is anti-gun propaganda.

Like all comedy, it's a mixed bag.

 

[Disposable Heart]

I miss Titus. Was a funny show.

 

[flagtag]

Just to play devil's advocate for a moment... it seems to me that the vast reams of form 4473's accumulated in the last 40 years constitute a de facto registration system. It's just held in the records of gun shops rather than at a government office. The ATF has the right to go paw through those records, so this seems like a rather useless distinction.

And since NICS went into effect, they have a registry of gun buyers. Don't exactly need a registry of guns, all they have to do is show up and say "you bought some guns. Where are they?"

So... with 40 years of one kind of registration, and 10 years of another... why haven't we seen more confiscation? Why aren't we gun owners up in arms over these forms of stealth registration, but go ballistic any time overt registration is mentioned? Why haven't we taken the NRA to task for supporting the NICS? Why hasn't GOA or some other more ideologically pure organization supplanted the NRA as the "go to" guys for defense of gun rights?

4473 - isn't that the form that the invading force used to confiscate guns (or to determine who had them) in Red Dawn?

(too bad I sold all my guns - 10 years ago - and, oh, dear, look at this! The buyer's info sheets that I had were ruined when the roof leaked and they got all wet! Shucky derns! Tsk, tsk, tsk! :rolleyesedit