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OC stop
- Thread starter Burnsy
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threedhuntr
Sharpshooter
He definitely should have a problem filling out his firearms collection after . 
In the article is says if he would have provided ID they would have ran it and let him go. I understand he didn't legally have to and it would make me sick if this were true, but in most cases is this the best option?
I don't want to perpetuate a police state and hand over my papers everytime I'm asked. However, I also don't want to be arrested and be up to my neck in expensive law battles that I simply can't afford. I want to stand up for my rights, but if I end up flat broke was it really worth it? Opinions on ONLY showing a LTCH?
I hate it that we have to worry about this crap. This is America!
I don't want to perpetuate a police state and hand over my papers everytime I'm asked. However, I also don't want to be arrested and be up to my neck in expensive law battles that I simply can't afford. I want to stand up for my rights, but if I end up flat broke was it really worth it? Opinions on ONLY showing a LTCH?
I hate it that we have to worry about this crap. This is America!
Cops knowingly broke the law. There was no reasonable suspicion of a crime, no probable cause. When they seized him they knew all this. They broke the law. If the community has to pay off for it, they will train their officers better.
Hope he gets a big payoff. Maybe the Ohio LEOs will finally learn they have to obey the laws, too. They have a history of abusing the citizenry.
Hope he gets a big payoff. Maybe the Ohio LEOs will finally learn they have to obey the laws, too. They have a history of abusing the citizenry.
If we do not defend our rights, we lose them.
HenryWallace
Expert
When will we see that this has everything to do with Guilty until Proven Innocent... And everything that the .gov is pushing on top of us has the same implications. EVERYTHING!
Why do we allow these parasites to continue these horrifying atacks and still act like they're doing this for our good? From the politicians to an angry non intillectual enforcer, it's solidifying the reasons to push back with our Rights! That's why the Roy Call refused to give his info.
"It is hard to imagine a more stupid or more dangerous way of making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong." ~Thomas Sowell
Why do we allow these parasites to continue these horrifying atacks and still act like they're doing this for our good? From the politicians to an angry non intillectual enforcer, it's solidifying the reasons to push back with our Rights! That's why the Roy Call refused to give his info.
"It is hard to imagine a more stupid or more dangerous way of making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong." ~Thomas Sowell
Fail of both parties
So here is my take
. While i total agree it is within the rights of the individual to keep his mouth shut and not provide anything to the LEO, I dont agree it is the SMART thing to do.
IF he is a law abiding citizen that like the rest of us is paying out taxes, living within our means, and has the greater good of the GREAT country we live in in mind, Then a simple, quick, and painless response to the officer like...
"Mr officer while it is within my rights to refuse to give any of this information to you per Ohio Code ... here is my DL and my CCW. MR Officer, what you are doing here is not only illegal but also one more reason why Law abiding citizens like myself that legally carry firearms get such a negative opinion of LEO's that should know such laws and rights."
I am sure this would of turned out very different.
Now unfortunately this is not the way that it happened so now we have a individual who is going to sue the local police department for 3million dollars. Great, now i agree they will settle out of court, so for the sack of argument lets say 2 mil. Of that 2 mil the attorney will take somewhere around 1-1.2 mil leaving the individual with 800K. so after taxes this guy is going to see around 500K. Now not that is anything to sneeze at. But who do you think is going to pay the 2 mil? the police officers?? No ... It is coming out of your pocket in the form of taxes. Even if a insurance company pays it, then the premiums go up and eventually it makes it back to you and me.
Now i am probably going to get blow up for this opinion but do you really think Suing is going to make any difference? But if we must, I would be so much more impressed if the individual and attorney decided to give any proceeds from a win to a local gun awareness program to help educate individuals and officers, otherwise it is just another case that is tying up our legal system that keeps legitimate case from getting handled as they should. I mean really "emotion distress" for a 1 hour situation that in all reality the individual had control to make it go either way.
Just my
now fire away!!
So here is my take
. While i total agree it is within the rights of the individual to keep his mouth shut and not provide anything to the LEO, I dont agree it is the SMART thing to do.IF he is a law abiding citizen that like the rest of us is paying out taxes, living within our means, and has the greater good of the GREAT country we live in in mind, Then a simple, quick, and painless response to the officer like...
"Mr officer while it is within my rights to refuse to give any of this information to you per Ohio Code ... here is my DL and my CCW. MR Officer, what you are doing here is not only illegal but also one more reason why Law abiding citizens like myself that legally carry firearms get such a negative opinion of LEO's that should know such laws and rights."
I am sure this would of turned out very different.
Now unfortunately this is not the way that it happened so now we have a individual who is going to sue the local police department for 3million dollars. Great, now i agree they will settle out of court, so for the sack of argument lets say 2 mil. Of that 2 mil the attorney will take somewhere around 1-1.2 mil leaving the individual with 800K. so after taxes this guy is going to see around 500K. Now not that is anything to sneeze at. But who do you think is going to pay the 2 mil? the police officers?? No ... It is coming out of your pocket in the form of taxes. Even if a insurance company pays it, then the premiums go up and eventually it makes it back to you and me.
Now i am probably going to get blow up for this opinion but do you really think Suing is going to make any difference? But if we must, I would be so much more impressed if the individual and attorney decided to give any proceeds from a win to a local gun awareness program to help educate individuals and officers, otherwise it is just another case that is tying up our legal system that keeps legitimate case from getting handled as they should. I mean really "emotion distress" for a 1 hour situation that in all reality the individual had control to make it go either way.
Just my
now fire away!!
So here is my take
IF he is a law abiding citizen that like the rest of us is paying out taxes, living within our means, and has the greater good of the GREAT country we live in in mind, Then a simple, quick, and painless response to the officer like...
"Mr officer while it is within my rights to refuse to give any of this information to you per Ohio Code ... here is my DL and my CCW. MR Officer, what you are doing here is not only illegal but also one more reason why Law abiding citizens like myself that legally carry firearms get such a negative opinion of LEO's that should know such laws and rights."
I am sure this would of turned out very different.
Now unfortunately this is not the way that it happened so now we have a individual who is going to sue the local police department for 3million dollars. Great, now i agree they will settle out of court, so for the sack of argument lets say 2 mil. Of that 2 mil the attorney will take somewhere around 1-1.2 mil leaving the individual with 800K. so after taxes this guy is going to see around 500K. Now not that is anything to sneeze at. But who do you think is going to pay the 2 mil? the police officers?? No ... It is coming out of your pocket in the form of taxes. Even if a insurance company pays it, then the premiums go up and eventually it makes it back to you and me.
Now i am probably going to get blow up for this opinion but do you really think Suing is going to make any difference? But if we must, I would be so much more impressed if the individual and attorney decided to give any proceeds from a win to a local gun awareness program to help educate individuals and officers, otherwise it is just another case that is tying up our legal system that keeps legitimate case from getting handled as they should. I mean really "emotion distress" for a 1 hour situation that in all reality the individual had control to make it go either way.
Just my
now fire away!!
The validity of suing is so that the LEO dept realizes their misconduct. Often times the bottom line is what gets the most attention. (I'm stating the obvious, but chose to state it anyways)
Otherwise it would likely end up in some unread report (HR, PR or IA I would guess) and likely have no impact.
Please correct me if I'm wrong.
"here is my DL and my CCW. MR Officer, what you are doing here is not only illegal but also one more reason why Law abiding citizens like myself that legally carry firearms get such a negative opinion of LEO's that should know such laws and rights."
And add this, "you broke the law I here by place you under arrest" LEO's are not above the law! Place your hands behind your back, your going to Jail.......(ya right)
And add this, "you broke the law I here by place you under arrest" LEO's are not above the law! Place your hands behind your back, your going to Jail.......(ya right)
HenryWallace
Expert
Keep on giving them inches guys and gals!
Cause they're looking for that foot... Although they've already taken that MilE!
Cause they're looking for that foot... Although they've already taken that MilE!
Getting attention
I agree suing is probably going to get the most attention. But is that attention a good thing? I have seen 3 post this morning on INGO with guys ( some with friends in tow with Video cameras ) doing the exact same thing. Challenging and questioning police officers with OC. Look we live in a country were alot of people are scared of guns. I have a right to carry a gun and am greatful for that. It does not mean i need to make other people around me uncomfortable. If i am in a situation that i feel unsafe then by all means i display it. But as in a several of these situations to me it looks like people are just looking for thsi to happen and that is a bad thing. A simple act of handing over a LTCH would end the situation and then you can take that video or story to the dept. or local news outlet.
Look my general rule of thumb is that any time there is a situation were a gun is involved i want to diffuse the situation as quickly as possible, then when all parties involved have cooled down then we can have a open and much more meaningful conversation about it.
In this situation had he provided the information up front it would of been over immediately and he could still could sue for the exact same reason he is now.
I agree suing is probably going to get the most attention. But is that attention a good thing? I have seen 3 post this morning on INGO with guys ( some with friends in tow with Video cameras ) doing the exact same thing. Challenging and questioning police officers with OC. Look we live in a country were alot of people are scared of guns. I have a right to carry a gun and am greatful for that. It does not mean i need to make other people around me uncomfortable. If i am in a situation that i feel unsafe then by all means i display it. But as in a several of these situations to me it looks like people are just looking for thsi to happen and that is a bad thing. A simple act of handing over a LTCH would end the situation and then you can take that video or story to the dept. or local news outlet.
Look my general rule of thumb is that any time there is a situation were a gun is involved i want to diffuse the situation as quickly as possible, then when all parties involved have cooled down then we can have a open and much more meaningful conversation about it.
In this situation had he provided the information up front it would of been over immediately and he could still could sue for the exact same reason he is now.
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