New to AR

[Luke76]

I'm thinking I want to pick up an AR style rifle. However, I really don't know a whole lot about them. I know a lot of parts are interchangeable and I'd like to get something I can maybe do a .22 conversion on to make it cheap to shoot more often. Is this easy to do? Would it be better to pick up one of the AR style 22s like the mossberg 715t? I see they're going to have that for 299 at gander mountain on Friday. Or would the recommendation be to go with the conversion?

Also any particular AR brands I should stay away from or ones I should look closer at? I really have no idea what are considered "quality" brands. Or what kind of price range they run in. Any input is highly appreciated. Even a reference for a good place to start learning about some of this. I've read a lot of things, but a good newbie reference would come in handy.

 

[jay2981]

IMHO go with a true AR in .223/5.56. Conversions are easy and give you more options. You can find uppers all over the place. As for different makes the only ar I've seen people really talk bad about are the bushmaster carbons, but I have no experience with those to make an honest judgement.

 

[netsecurity]

Even the cheap AR's like bushmaster and DPMS are plenty decent these days for the range I think. The platform has been around so long that it is a solid recipe. The only problem I have with cheap AR's is the bug to have something better, which results in more spending eventually. So I'd say to do your research, and buy exactly what you want the first time, regardless of price, and then you can keep adding parts to it down the road, instead of upgrading to a new gun.

The 22 conversions are so expensive that you are better off buying a dedicated 22 platform IMO. I stay away from anything Mossberg. The M&P15-22 is great, but expensive as heck for a 22. None are really like an AR because the internals are for the 22. I'd recommend a Ruger 10/22, and just dress it up with a tacticool stock if you feel the need (or not).

 

[lumpagus1]

Well sir, you're walking into a world of ultimate customization. If it were me personally...knowing what I know now I'd much rather have an AR-15 that is specifically a .22 then buying a conversion kit. I'd just rather have a rifle that has one intended caliber, but that's just my personal preference. You could buy a .223/5.56 AR-15 and then buy a .22 upper receiver and then just swap them out. In case you didn't know...changing out the upper receiver on an AR-15 is simply popping 2 pins outwards and voila, your upper and lower receivers are separated. Then to install the .22 upper, simply place it into the lower so that the holes match up and push the pins in, dry fire the weapon, work the charging handle to ensure proper function and you should be good to go.

As far as brands go, I would probably be considered a "brand whore". I'm very particular about who the manufacturer is when I go to build a rifle. My 2 favorite AR-15 manufacturers are Noveske Rifleworks (Grants Pass, Oregon) and LaRue Tactical (Leander, Texas). Neither manufacturer is very cheap so I wouldn't suggest buying from them unless you know exactly what you want. Both manufacturers make high quality parts and also highly accurate, high quality AR-15's. The first time I bought an AR-15, I bought a production rifle (a rifle already completely assembled) from Olympic Arms at a local gun store. After about 2 years I decided I wanted something more then a stock production rifle...so I started to customize it, long story short I spent more money customizing it then I would have if I had just build a custom rifle.

I don't really concern myself with price when it comes to buying/building AR-15's because if it's something that I may have to use to save my life or the life of my friends and family...I spare no expense. So when it comes to price ranges of different manufacturers...I'm not the person you want to ask. As far as a good "newbie" reference, I think downloading an owner/operator's manual for an AR-15 would be a good way to learn basic function and nomenclature. I realize it's probably the most dry and boring thing to read but you have to start somewhere right?

 

[ckcollins2003]

Unlike everyone else, I highly suggest the .22 conversion in a .223/5.56 AR. Sure, you can spend the $300-$400 and have a .22 dedicated upper, buy the mags, and it will work the same, but if you are planning on putting a red dot or other type of optic on your AR, you'd have to buy 2 of them to have one on each upper. With a .22 conversion it, you simply switch out the bolt carrier group and use the .22 mags. Optics are the same as what you'd shoot with your big boy bullets and you don't have to re-zero it or buy 2.

Also, conversion kits are much much cheaper than a dedicated upper. You can get a conversion kit for around $160. Try finding a dedicated upper for that price . .22 magazines you will have to buy either way, however most of the conversion kits come with at least 1 magazine and you can get a conversion kit with 3 magazines for $209.95 plus shipping from MidwayUSA. That's still $80 cheaper than any upper I've ever seen. However, I'm also someone who wants to get the best bang for their buck. And as long as it works I don't see why I should spend more money to have the exact same operation.

 

[netsecurity]

Unlike everyone else, I highly suggest the .22 conversion in a .223/5.56 AR. Sure, you can spend the $300-$400 and have a .22 dedicated upper, buy the mags, and it will work the same, but if you are planning on putting a red dot or other type of optic on your AR, you'd have to buy 2 of them to have one on each upper. With a .22 conversion it, you simply switch out the bolt carrier group and use the .22 mags. Optics are the same as what you'd shoot with your big boy bullets and you don't have to re-zero it or buy 2.

Also, conversion kits are much much cheaper than a dedicated upper. You can get a conversion kit for around $160. Try finding a dedicated upper for that price . .22 magazines you will have to buy either way, however most of the conversion kits come with at least 1 magazine and you can get a conversion kit with 3 magazines for $209.95 plus shipping from MidwayUSA. That's still $80 cheaper than any upper I've ever seen. However, I'm also someone who wants to get the best bang for their buck. And as long as it works I don't see why I should spend more money to have the exact same operation.

The optics argument is the best reasoning I've heard. Optics are expensive, and if you really want to train with the real deal then this is the way to go. I still have two reservations about conversions though: 1) Reliability I've heard is hit or miss, but maybe that isn't a big deal on a trainer, and 2) Dirt and wax buildup on an expensive AR from cheap 22 ammo scares me, not just the barrel, but the receiver mainly (perhaps this is where buying a cheap AR could be appreciated). If someone can convince me that these two things are not really a bother I could be convinced to get a conversion myself. Money is the reason i haven't, because for $200 I can buy a new 10/22 and have a totally reliable gun that I don't care how dirty it gets.

 

[ckcollins2003]

The optics argument is the best reasoning I've heard. Optics are expensive, and if you really want to train with the real deal then this is the way to go. I still have two reservations about conversions though: 1) Reliability I've heard is hit or miss, but maybe that isn't a big deal on a trainer, and 2) Dirt and wax buildup on an expensive AR from cheap 22 ammo scares me, not just the barrel, but the receiver mainly (perhaps this is where buying a cheap AR could be appreciated). If someone can convince me that these two things are not really a bother I could be convinced to get a conversion myself. Money is the reason i haven't, because for $200 I can buy a new 10/22 and have a totally reliable gun that I don't care how dirty it gets.

Well, you don't know me so my word isn't worth much, but I can't even count how many rounds me and my cousin have put through my upper (his old upper) with the .22 conversion.

Mis-fires are hit or miss, all ammo problems really, just like any other semi-auto .22. Dirt buildup... haven't noticed any more than shooting Tula's .223 and we buy the Winchester and Federal bulk packs, so you know that's not clean ammo .

I realize a lot of rumors are floating around about .22 conversions, but honestly, that's all they are from my experience... rumors... just like "oh don't buy a Glock, it'll blow up in your face." or "The lifetime LTCH is being taken away! You better go get one now!"

If you know anyone with a conversion kit or have a chance to try one out, do it. Just remember to run it wet. That's the only thing I've noticed really is that if it's dry, it doesn't always go into battery, but spray a little rem-oil on it and it's good to go.

 

[netsecurity]

Maybe the problem is that you're using Rem-oil.

[It isn't wet, it's Teflon]

Try some Slip 2000 if you want wet...

 

[kbailey]

Are you sure you want to contract black rifle disease? The only known cure is to contract something even more expensive and addictive ... 1911-itus.

All kidding aside it's hard to go wrong with most of the big names like Colt, Daniels Defense, S&W, CMMG, etc.

If you can't find one you like you can always assemble one yourself. It isn't that difficult and there are plenty of people around to assist when needed.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

 

[LPMan59]

 

[g3man]

I recommend a dedicated .22 upper or rifle. If you want top end performance the Spikes Tactical dedicated upper is the way to go you can order it with the Walther/Lothar match barrel. The only problem is the price on this upper is almost $1,000 now. They have really shot up since I got mine a couple years ago. I also have a Ciener m16/AR15 conversion bolt that I have used in M16s full auto and AR15s semi auto. What I dislike about this option is how dirty .22LR is and what it does to a gas system on a conventional AR. A lot of cleaning after even a few hundred rounds. The Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 is a nice in between option but uses a different bolt design so the Mags are different than the Ciener design wich is employed by Spikes, CMMG and many others. The Ciener type mags are usually less expensive. I use Black Dog mags only.

 

[netsecurity]

Oh yipes, the gas tube! I don't want 22lr dirt in my gas tube, ever. You probably know that a 22 rifle normally doesn't have a gas system, but uses block back instead.

 

[Luke76]

So I'm seeing a lot of posts about the Troy rifle at Dicks and it looks to be a pretty good deal so I'm considering picking it up. Any thoughts on that one? I also might try to pick up the mossberg at Gander if I can talk my wife in to both. She tends to get a little easier with the checkbook this time of year. At first I was thinking building might be a good idea, but I might look at that down the road.

 

[Luke76]

Another question, how are these for left handed shooters? My kid is a leftie and I'm sure he'll be wanting to shoot them. I doubt he'll be doing that long if he's constantly getting hit in the face with shells.

 

[CptCrik]

I think that the biggest thing to do is just to take some time and continue to do your research. Sure, there are guides out there that we "newbie" friendly. But why read that, when instead it is better to research specific topics. Things like twist, chrome lining or not, style of stock you want, heat/hand guards, and accesories. Then when you get a good idea of what you want out of your gun, you can decide either to buy a complete rifle and have to do some minor modifications on a couple of the things you want changed or to build your own AR. Either of which, you will have gotten a better understanding of your AR before you even get your hands on it.