NEED HELP ON .223 AMMO SPLIT CASES

[BIG TIM]

I just had a chance to fire some 223 ammo I bought from a member of INGO at the last 1500 show. Several of the spent cases have splits on the slug end of the case. What does this indicate and is the rest of this ammo safe to shoot? I had no FTE or FTF problems but these rounds seem to kick a good bit more than the last that I shot. Thanks for your help in advance.

 

[Mgderf]

I just had a chance to fire some 223 ammo I bought from a member of INGO at the last 1500 show. Several of the spent cases have splits on the slug end of the case. What does this indicate and is the rest of this ammo safe to shoot? I had no FTE or FTF problems but these rounds seem to kick a good bit more than the last that I shot. Thanks for your help in advance.

I'm NOT the guy to ask, that would be Melensdad, but something doesn't seem right?

What are you shooting this out of? If AR(type) is it also marked 5.56, or maybe "multi"?

My GUESS would be that a split case alone would probably not be a big deal. I COULD BE WRONG!

I would not try to re-load any of the cases that don't split!

 

[BIG TIM]

The rounds in question are reloads but, not to worry because even if they weren't, i'm not a reloader.

 

[Mgderf]

The rounds in question are reloads but, not to worry because even if they weren't, i'm not a reloader.

What is the rifle? What is the caliber marking?

 

[PwrCruz]

Are they 5.56 or .223 case's?

 

[Chefcook]

Sounds like the necks are thin from being reloaded too many times...

 

[Mgderf]

But are the rest safe to shoot?

That was his other question, and a good one I think?

 

[Chefcook]

I have reloaded all my life. And have had this happen after I had loaded the brass multiple times. Anytime I see stress like this I would discard the brass because this is a sure sign it is worn out. However I am not willing to accept the responsibility and say "yea sure go ahead and shoot them." Once the brass becomes thin or weak one might separate near the base leaving a sleeve inside your chamber etc. all sorts of things could go wrong. So really its up to the OP weigh the risk in your own mind and decide if its worth it. Now if it were me.. If they were my own hand loads I would probably shoot them and not pick up the brass. If they were loaded by someone else I would toss them...

 

[BIG TIM]

The ammo is .223 ammo and the Bushmaster upper is marked 5.56.

 

[DaveD]

Are these small cracks right at the neck mouth, or do they extend down to the shoulder?

You stated: "these rounds seem to kick a good bit more than the last that I shot." That statement raises a red flag, as you may have some hot loads there. Have a knowlegeable reloader check the fired brass for possible overpressure signs if you don't know what to look for. May not be a problem, they may just be a heavier load than you are used to, but worth checking. And as was stated before those cases may be beyond their life cycle. My

For the record: I am not knocking the reloader you bought them from, just what is a safe load in my rifle may not be in yours.

Brass does become work hardened/brittle from firing/resizing process and perhaps the case neck wasn't annealed prior to reloading. The annealing process involves heating the neck & shoulder of the case to the correct temperature and allowing it to cool. This softens the brass to prevent splits and allows more reloads. This is labor intensive for home reloaders so some may not do it, just do fewer reloads of the same brass.

 

[BIG TIM]

The cracks extend from the neck mouth down to the beginning of the shoulder but not down to the widest portion of the case.

 

[Lock n Load]

The cracks extend from the neck mouth down to the beginning of the shoulder but not down to the widest portion of the case.

Those are pretty severe cracks, if their just at the neck, then I continue to use my reloads, cracks like this I would tear down the rounds to components and scrap the brass....

I have also had some LC split at the necks and farther, these were not properly annealed and later learned they were recalled ammo that should not have been sold.... it was from an out of state dealer at a 1500 a few years back, the price was good.... maybe too good. They all fired safely but the brass was collected and went in the scrap bucket.

Personally I would message the seller and ask how many times these cases were reloaded, what the load data is to determine if its at the lower end or the higher end of the min/ max loading and pressure and see what you guys could work out on them: not knowing the original sales agreement.

Actually my biggest concern on my reloads would be an over max. powder charge, I inspect cases 100% a couple times during the reloading process (tumbling, seperating military, commercial and berdan from boxer primed, priming and then at completion/ bagging) and I use a single stage press, so theres plenty of time and several opportunities to inspect the cases and the process.

 

[DaveD]

Those are pretty severe cracks, if their just at the neck, then I continue to use my reloads, cracks like this I would tear down the rounds to components and scrap the brass....

Personally I would message the seller and ask how many times these cases were reloaded, what the load data is to determine if its at the lower end or the higher end of the min/ max loading and pressure and see what you guys could work out on them: not knowing the original sales agreement.

+1


BIG TIM,

My Those are very severe cracks, not minor .....I wouldn't shoot another round!

 

[BIG TIM]

Thanks for all the input guys! It was very helpful.

 

[IndyGunworks]

As others have stated, thats a pretty severe crack, i would shy away from shooting them without any knowledge of the casings track record

 

[hc4sar]

been loading for 20yrs still not a expert but all i can say is, BURY THOSE ROUNDS!!! or pull the bullets and save the components,if you know the powder type.

 

[triharley]

I agree, scrap the rounds before your weapon or worse yet you pay a price. A few 30 cent rounds aren't worth a hospital visit.

 

[BIG TIM]

Thanks for the info guys, but just a fair warning to all, the guy that sold me these is a member of INGO and I believe he sold 3000-4000 rounds to other besides me. BEWARE IF YOU BOUGHT .223 AMMO AT THE LAST 1500, YOU MAY HAVE SOME OF THESE TOO!!! I am currently trying to contact this guy if I can. I cannot remember his screen name.

 

[hc4sar]

Did he have a table? if so where? thanks for the warning !

 

[preachere]

Hey guys, Tim bought the ammo from me. No other INGO members bought .223 from me, the rest was sold to people I know here in my home town. A test lot of the ammo was broken down, powder charge weighed (24.1 grains if I recall correctly, but of an unknown powder), and bullet weighed (55 grain FMJ boat tail).

I was not the man who reloaded this ammo, I bought it as reloaded ammo and sold it as such. I also did not buy it from the man who reloaded it as he passed away and his family was selling the ammo.

I did not know about this thread till after Tim and I spoke today on the phone. I offered to buy it back from him and give him a full refund of his money, again, before I knew anything about this thread. Tim is a good guy and I don't screw people, period. He was nice but let me know he had concerns about the ammo, at which point I addressed the concerns and told him that he could either shoot up the ammo or return it and I would give him all of his money back. He opted to get a refund and the check will be in the mail tomorrow.

As for the issue with the split necks. I shoot a lot of military surplus ammo and Century brought in some 7.62x25 SMG/pistol ammo from Bulgaria a few years back. They got a lot of reports about split necks from a couple of the production years, so they began to advertise that some of the necks were split, from the factory, and that if you didn't like that then don't buy. I bought a bunch of this stuff and have never had any kind of problems with it at all. I even remarked that I found some split necks, loaded them up, and fired them with no ill effects whatsoever.

I didn't say that because I'm going to have another 1000 rounds of .223 to sell again pretty soon, but just to let you know that split necks typically are no big deal. As has already been said, as a reloader if you spot split necks after a range session you simply toss that brass into your brass bucket and drive on. I'm trying to show that from the other side of the coin if you see a split neck BEFORE your range session you can either break that round down for components for later use, or fire it. Yes, there could be a case separation, but that can happen with ANY brass, new or old, and with ALL the hundreds of thousands of that Bulgarian 7.62x25 that Century sold, I have yet to hear of one case separation from it, and those necks were split from the factory.

Regards,
Eric