must you carry defensive rounds?

[JettaKnight]

I will add that with a .32 ACP or even a .380 ACP it may be advantageous to carry FMJ round in the winter to reliably penetrate through heavy garments.

 

[JettaKnight]

I remember reading an article, which covers someone being cheap with not getting a LTCH because of the cost but ends up even more cheap to putting FMJs in his gun. He had to use it and ends up shooting a guy who is attacking him and his girlfriend. He ended up shooting the man 10 times, some of the rounds going through the attacker and the court used that against him along with the whole didn't get an LTCH because he was too cheap for that.

So a court ruled that the poor are not allowed to defend themselves?

 

[Tnichols00]

Legal and smart are two different things...

I would not carry FMJ because of the chances of it over penetrating and killing someone behind that is no threat to me. From my understanding two layers of drywall will slow a JHP to the point where it is very unlikely to kill if not stop but a FMJ will go right through killing whats on the other side.

 

[ASD]

In New Jersey this is exactly NOT what you want to do.

Where do gun store denizens get this crap?

You don't want to do anything in jersey. That's where I'm originally from and damn they are strict with guns there. You need to get a federal firearms ID card just to buy a long gun and than if u want a hand gun you also have to go and apply for a pistol permit.

 

[JollyMon]

I always carry hollow points, and suggest everyone do so.... and no IN law says you have to.

That being said... I think I do remember my instructor of my Utah CCW class bringing up something similar to this. I believe what our instructor was trying to say went something like this... While not a necessity to carry them, for the most point you want carry things that can be argued to be used solely for defense. He mentioned trying to figure out what the local pd is using and use something similar. That way, if you ever had to actually use you gun in defense, prosecution cant make a point that you were doing anything negligent. But then again this was a few years ago and I might not be remembering correctly.

This would be similar to the argument about trigger jobs and light trigger pull.... See how the prosecution tried to use that against Zimmerman.

I think I remember an article lately (this year actually) where a burglar was shot with old 22lr rounds that the homeowner had and maybe the family was trying to sue the homeowner based off the rounds being shot were degraded or something like that... let me try to find the article

 

[Hawkeye]

You don't want to do anything in jersey. That's where I'm originally from and damn they are strict with guns there. You need to get a federal firearms ID card just to buy a long gun and than if u want a hand gun you also have to go and apply for a pistol permit.

Waht is a "federal firearms ID card"?

 

[traderdan]

There is no doubt that a good expanding bullet is a better option for self defense carry..However,to feel under armed if you are carrying a large caliber weapon is a little silly. People spend too much time reading about extreme examples,where once upon a time, something happened somewhere...I double tapped a hog sometime ago,then butchered him..(FMJ .40 cal) You are gonna get the job done,if you put one center mass,follow up with another if you can.

 

[ASD]

Waht is a "federal firearms ID card"?

The name sounds like something that you would need everywhere but it's just NJ specific. It's an ID card that says your ok to buy a gun. But you must have one even to buy a shotgun in NJ. The process is the same as what we do to get out LTCH here. Fill out a form and pay them money than wait while they take their sweet time to process it.

 

[ru44mag]

I will add that with a .32 ACP or even a .380 ACP it may be advantageous to carry FMJ round in the winter to reliably penetrate through heavy garments.

I was waiting for this one. Just my opinion here. 9mm and above, go with a good defense round. I like Hornady green or red tips (Zombie or CD). Less than .380 use FMJ, or better yet, get something bigger. As far as .380...the jury is still out. I started a thread some time back...the opinions went both ways, so I still have not decided which is better in my .380s.

 

[Hawkeye]

The name sounds like something that you would need everywhere but it's just NJ specific. It's an ID card that says your ok to buy a gun. But you must have one even to buy a shotgun in NJ. The process is the same as what we do to get out LTCH here. Fill out a form and pay them money than wait while they take their sweet time to process it.

And its FEDERAL? Not NJ issued?

 

[halfmileharry]

I am more than happy to bet my life on a FMJ bullet out of my guns. Will you need to shoot someone more to have the same result? yes you will...Check out the switch from green tip to SOST rounds in Afghanistan.

The reason why i wont carry FMJ bullets is because unless you hit big heavy bones that round is going straight through that person and on into whatever is behind them. whether that be a wall or a 5 year old.

Us old Marines find it easier to manually insert a 230 grain hardball than JHPs. That's just in case the old outdated 1911s fall apart in our hands. (I'm color blind so IF you think purple should be used then it's up to the reader to make that determination)

 

[ASD]

And its FEDERAL? Not NJ issued?

You have to go through the state police to get it so I'm assuming its nj issued but it's still called a federal firearm id card

 

[Tinner666]

Nj, Ca. Ny, etc. are communist conutries to avoid at all cost!

I carry CD, ST, or whichever defense rounds I can find. I carry those because I don't want over penetration. In crowded city areas, that is very likely to cause collateral damage to an innocent bystander.
That said, I often carry two spare mags for balance, more than fire power. Mag one has SD rounds, and mag two has FMJ. That way, I'm not investing too much money in SD ammo, and it I was to empty my firearm, then the second mag, it's probably time to try FMJ. I can't imagine things ever getting that bad though.

 

[Goodcat]

As far as law is concerned you could load your own rounds with glitter. It won't do much good though.

 

[Slawburger]

As far as law is concerned you could load your own rounds with glitter. It won't do much good though.

So that's why those "Twilight" vampires sparkled. Someone shot them with glitter rounds.

 

[Excalibur]

Nj, Ca. Ny, etc. are communist conutries to avoid at all cost!

I carry CD, ST, or whichever defense rounds I can find. I carry those because I don't want over penetration. In crowded city areas, that is very likely to cause collateral damage to an innocent bystander.
That said, I often carry two spare mags for balance, more than fire power. Mag one has SD rounds, and mag two has FMJ. That way, I'm not investing too much money in SD ammo, and it I was to empty my firearm, then the second mag, it's probably time to try FMJ. I can't imagine things ever getting that bad though.

You do realize that FMJs will go through a person and out the back and most likely will cause collateral damage. I invest as much money needed no matter the cost to equip myself with proper defensive ammo. To me, FMJs will never be defensive ammo unless it's the apocalypse. My spare mag is full of Critical Duty. I don't understand the logic behind carrying FMJs unless your gun can't feed it, in that cause I'd get Federal Guard Dog.

Also you need to imagine more. A gun fight according to statistics might not last more than a few seconds and on average a person might not have used up their entire mag, but you can't assume that will happen to you.

 

[Tinner666]

You do realize that FMJs will go through a person and out the back and most likely will cause collateral damage. I invest as much money needed no matter the cost to equip myself with proper defensive ammo. To me, FMJs will never be defensive ammo unless it's the apocalypse. My spare mag is full of Critical Duty. I don't understand the logic behind carrying FMJs unless your gun can't feed it, in that cause I'd get Federal Guard Dog.

Also you need to imagine more. A gun fight according to statistics might not last more than a few seconds and on average a person might not have used up their entire mag, but you can't assume that will happen to you.

Do you really think I'll need to use my third mag? You even said

A gun fight according to statistics might not last more than a few seconds and on average a person might not have used up their entire mag,

an average person probably won't use their gun mag. Are you saying I'm above average and probably will need 40+ shots?

Your comments don't even appear to be in context with mine.

 

[Paul30]

Although not legally required, I must. I carry the best defense round I can find because my life, the life of my family, and the lives of the people behind the immediat threat that could be hit by my bullet if it doesn't expand and stay in the threat are more important to me than a few dollars. If figure as many times as I need to shoot them, I should only need to buy one box every blue moon when I start getting nervous that they are getting too old to trust. I have never had ammo not fire due to being old, but I guess one would start to wonder. I still have black talon ammo that I purchased new off the shelf when they were available. I like an extra magazine or two because if a magazine jams it may be faster to drop it and replace it if it has an issue that cannot be resolved with a basic recycling. If you carry a compact gun that only carries a few rounds, an extra mag or two could be a good thing too. I don't even want to think about how bad the attack from the rogue bikers in the news could have gotten if it had been against a CCW citizen.

 

[David D]

I almost always carry Remington Golden Sabres since they traditionally do well in ballistic tests and have always fed well in all my guns. Due to legal concerns if I ever need to use a firearm for defensive use I would not be comfortable using a less common round. In my .380 (short barrel) I load both Golden Sabres and Hydra Shocks (alternating rounds), as my research shows the heavy Golden Sabres are slow enough that expansion is not reliable, and although the Hydra Shocks do expand, penetration isn't reliable.

 

[TB1999]

so by their logic, it would be illegal to carry a gun with no ammo in it at all.