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  • Yeah

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    2   0   0
    Dec 3, 2009
    2,637
    38
    Dillingham, AK
    how do you forget a model 70?:D

    I wish I could.

    An impression can be taken from the thread thus far that all goods are created equal, though that is clearly not the case.

    Relative to a 700:
    - Winchester 70s are tanks, and their triggers pale by comparison. They redeem themselves with generous mag box constraints, but that can be had in a 700.

    - Howa 1500 / older Weatherby Vanguards, are very nice overall. Their triggers are good but saddled with a ridiculous safety arrangement that boxes in their range of adjustment. They've also far fewer upgrade paths, if you have an eye for that

    - A Bolts / X Bolts are first rate garbage, all around. I've never broken anything faster than an A Bolt and I've never hunted alongside more that ended up likewise. Shooting for kicks off a bench, your only exposure is going home early are hoping for better at the next outing, if that sounds like fun.

    - Savages are tougher than X Bolts but not by much. Their bolts design is a marketing stunt. Accutriggers are great if you don't know how to tune good factory triggers, but otherwise best left on the shelf. Accustocks are better than Remington's factory milk jug stocks, but your upgrade paths are again limited if you ever want something better.

    - TC doesn't have a clue, and can only take wild swings at product differentiation.

    - Tikka gets twist rates and triggers right. Which is unfortunate because they don't do anything else well. Stocks are lousy across the board, their milk jugs are the worst of the worst. Astonishingly for a DBM: Mag box length leaves you hamstrung, despite twist rates that can handle long bullets. On the plus side you can source replacement parts in the Barbie section at Toys R Us.

    - Weatherby Mark Vs have far too many lugs and a factory rifle is lucky to have more than 1 that bears. A tuned action might make 3. They are tanks as well. If that sounds 'good' to you, you just might be in their demographic.

    - Ruger 77s are as tough as anvils and weight about as much. Only rifle in the list that you couldnt put tougher bottom metal if you tried. Their laminate stocks are great as well. Trigger are middling and require either a stone or a replacement sear to approach acceptable. Scope mount options range from awful to really awful.

    - CZ 550s could do for a bench rifle if they could chamber / throat consistently, but they can't. Their stainless rusts if the forecast calls for rain and blue is worse. As above your upgrade paths are seriously limited.

    What does Remington screw up? Twist rates, pretty much all over the place. Their low end plastic stocks are junk. Their laminates not much better. Factory DBMs are fussy and easily broken.

    If I missed one listed is is because I don't own a copy to know anything about it. Of the above I'd only ever build on a 700 or someone else's copy. For a fair weather bench rifle a 70, 77, or 1500 would do.
     
    Last edited:

    roadrunner681

    Expert
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Feb 2, 2013
    969
    18
    henry county
    I wish I could.

    An impression can be taken from the thread thus far that all goods are created equal, though that is clearly not the case.

    Relative to a 700:
    - Winchester 70s are tanks, and their triggers pale by comparison. They redeem themselves with generous mag box constraints, but that can be had in a 700.

    - Howa 1500 / older Weatherby Vanguards, are very nice overall. Their triggers are good but saddled with a ridiculous safety arrangement that boxes in their range of adjustment. They've also far fewer upgrade paths, if you have an eye for that

    - A Bolts / X Bolts are first rate garbage, all around. I've never broken anything faster than an A Bolt and I've never hunted alongside more that ended up likewise. Shooting for kicks off a bench, your only exposure is going home early are hoping for better at the next outing, if that sounds like fun.

    - Savages are tougher than X Bolts but not by much. Their bolts design is a marketing stunt. Accutriggers are great if you don't know how to tune good factory triggers, but otherwise best left on the shelf. Accustocks are better than Remington's factory milk jug stocks, but your upgrade paths are again limited if you ever want something better.

    - TC doesn't have a clue, and can only take wild swings at product differentiation.

    - Tikka gets twist rates and triggers right. Which is unfortunate because they don't do anything else well. Stocks are lousy across the board, their milk jugs are the worst of the worst. Astonishingly for a DBM: Mag box length leaves you hamstrung, despite twist rates that can handle long bullets.

    - Weatherby Mark Vs have far too many lugs and a factory rifle is lucky to have more than 1 that bears. A tuned action might make 3. They are tanks as well. If that sounds 'good' to you, you just might be in their demographic.

    - Ruger 77s are as tough as anvils and weight about as much. Only rifle in the list that you couldnt put tougher bottom metal if you tried. Their laminate stocks are great as well. Trigger are middling and require either a stone or a replacement sear to approach acceptable. Scope mount options range from awful to really awful.

    - CZ 550s can do for bench rifles. Even their stainless rusts if the forecast calls for rain, and they can't be relied upon if the temp is low enough to freeze any moisture in the bolt, action, mag, or trigger. As above your upgrade paths are seriously limited.

    What does Remington screw up? Twist rates, pretty much all over the place. Their low end plastic stocks are junk. Their laminates not much better. Factory DBMs are fussy and easily broken.

    Everu
    what you expect a custom or something? in that mind set they all suck. im sure surgeon and mcmillans have down falls as well.
     

    Kirk Freeman

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    11   0   0
    Mar 9, 2008
    48,268
    113
    Lafayette, Indiana
    I want the rifle for no real reason other then shooting at longer rangers. Would rather have 308.

    Hmmm, I would advise shooting at rangers as they would shoot back.:laugh:

    The better question to ask is what is your budget. You can sink a whole bunch of dough really quick in the rifle and the optics.

    As there is a bunch of aftermarket junk for the Remington 700, why not buy a base model 700 and then you can piece it together.

    Where's that animation discussing the guy who wants to shoot at "1,000 yards"? We need that in this thread.:D
     

    Jeepers

    Plinker
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Mar 14, 2013
    13
    1
    I had the same debate a year ago and went with the savage model 11 lightweight hunter. It turns out the savage is every bit as accurate as owners say they are. In the end, the 700 was to heavy for what my need was. After shooting factory ammo and my own loads, I find this gun to be very accurate with almost anything. I did find it was sensitive to some factory loads but right on with everything else. The trigger is spot on and fit & finish are perfect. Good luck to yah.
     

    waross

    Plinker
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Apr 11, 2013
    32
    6
    I suppose it all comes down to what do you really want to do with the rifle? Target Shoot, Hunt, Personal protection when Obama ends society as we know it? And it also comes down to what you rare willing and able to spend. The talk has all been about the rifle but the glass on the rifle is just as important. So when making a decision on a rifle look at what glass you plan to buy, what ammo you plan to shoot, rings and mounts for the glass. I have seen people buy great rifles and put either cheap glass or cheap mounts on the rifle and then complain that the rifle isn't accurate. Also when you get a new rifle a lot of care in breaking in the barrel is important. If not properly broken in the precision of the rifle goes down. Lastly, how important it is that every bullet fired can travel through the same hole. (obviously this ultimately is reliant upon the shooter; however is the rifle capable of such)

    12 years ago I went through this process and for what I was using the rifle for and necessity of it being 100% reliable and accurate enough to shoot dimes at 100 - 300 yards I decided on a H&S Precision HTR in 300wsm. All my ammo was custom loaded based on a formula provided by H&S engineers which they had determined to optimal for this particular rifle. The rifle did and always has been 100% reliable and 100% capable of firing through the same hole time after time; whether it be cold bore or heated up.

    Good luck in making a decision.
     

    Kameseri

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    2   0   0
    Jan 20, 2013
    75
    8
    B-Burg
    I'm liking my MVP so far, but had looked at Remington 700s, and Savage 12FVs before it.

    Having another weapon that uses the same magazine made it a sale for me.
     

    mayor al

    Sharpshooter
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    May 25, 2013
    325
    18
    Floyd/Harrison Count
    I have used a Winchester Model 100 semi-auto in 308 as my primary hunting rifle (out of state) for 30 years. I love the gun. Never failed me yet...
    Last year I bought (among others) A new Ruger GSR bolt action 308. I am growing to respect this gun. I have yet to take it on a hunt as the primary rifle, but that will happen this summer. I am amazed at how easy that Ruger handles and sticks to the target between shots.

    It is a great rifle, and I am looking forward to using it, minus the bi-pod, as I don't get up and down easily. I shoot from a chair or blind with a support rail.
    12491.jpg
     

    Packrat67

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Jun 9, 2011
    121
    16
    Greenwood
    It is easy to get a lot of opinions fast in this forum. Here is mine. I have a Remington 700BDL in 30.06. I got it in the 70's and it is a beautiful weapon. My old eyes are not what they once were but if I get a target in my scope it will be hit.
    In Viet Nam the 700 was the sniper rifle of choice for our best snipers. Many Kong met their maker before these wonderful weapons.
    Some years ago a news show did a "Hit Piece on the 700. It was a load of bull crap.
    But bottom line I agree with those that advised you to consider what you really want and use your best judgment.
    I am sure that you will.
     
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