James Yeager - Iron Sights vs Optics

[esrice]

This is one Yeager video I actually agree with 110%. Anyone here feel he's wrong on this one?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdnnB7ttAf8

 

[phylodog]

Can't say I saw anything I disagree with.

 

[42769vette]

Agree

 

[Jeremy1066]

One of the few videos he's made that I completely agree with

 

[dross]

How is this even a controversy?

 

[rhino]

How is this even a controversy?

I've heard many people and read many internet messages asserting that iron sights are the only acceptable tool for verifying the alignment of your weapon with your target. I'm not referring to those who think you have to master iron sights first, then you can use optics, but those who eschew the need or usefulness or even acceptability of optics.

I think optics rock, both red dots and magnified.

I also have back-up iron sights on my rifles.

I can use both. I will only use the iron sights if the optic is unavailable or I need to practice with my irons a little.

I advocate the same to my students.

 

[42769vette]

How is this even a controversy?

You would be supprised how often I have the debate this topic.

 

[Mosinowner]

If I could afford one......


I totally agree with Yeager on this one. Dot/holo sights make your rifle 10x faster and 10x better.

 

[Sylvain]

This is one Yeager video I actually agree with 110%.

Im surprised.It's usually 100% for the other videos.

 

[Mosinowner]

Im surprised.It's usually 100% for the other videos.

You are on thin ice there sylvain

 

[Sylvain]

You are on thin ice there sylvain

 

[bob_dolemite]

The correct answer appears to be both. Hard to argue against that.

 

[jve153]

shooting 3 gun, my red dot blows away my irons, shooting kd with stationary targets/stationary shooting position, ill take my irons. i agree with this video in its entirety. i have never been in a gunfight, but i have had to use my rifle in odd positions, on the move, and under pressure of time. i love my red dot, it works. i really wish it were 2MOA dot vs the 4MOA dot i have, but i did not know any better at the time.

 

[singlesix]

This is my setup for my carbine.

 

[dross]

Back in the Dark Ages, when I was in the Army, I was a pretty good shot with the M16. With iron sights, of course. I shot well enough on a couple of courses that were designed to test speed that I became a little bit semi-famous in my little world. That was when I was in my early twenties.

Now I'm fifty, and my eyesight is problematic, but I'd bet a million dollars that I'm faster now with my Eotec than I ever was with irons, even back when my eyes were clear, my synapses snapping, and I didn't have a use for those blue pills.

I still like irons for their simplicity and reliability and for the nostalgia.

I also don't agree that kids should learn irons first. With an optic they can focus on learning trigger control and breathing and all the other physical skills that are required. My job requires that I understand how humans learn. It's wrong to think that if they can master something difficult and complex, they can master something more simple. Better to break down the skills simply, and learn them from easier to harder before you put them all together.

My daughter will learn to shoot irons, but when she learns them, she will already be along the trail towards mastering the other skills.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

Just wondering , with all that twitching , tugging and running going on , how accurate of a shot is he ?

 

[iChokePeople]

Just wondering , with all that twitching , tugging and running going on , how accurate of a shot is he ?

In before the "SAY THAT TO HIS FACE, B****" crowd.

 

[s-works]

he is wrong!

Sublime is still making music!

 

[Sgtusmc]

Ok, heres my take. First analogy. Yeager says thats why you see optics being used in competition. Well, duh. Give a kid a calculator for a math quiz and he'll do well also. Does that mean the kid has the skills necessary to succeed without the handicap?

I'm a Gulf War era Marine. We weren't taught with optics, we were taught marksmanship skills from boot camp on into the fleet. Now I felt like I was a good shot prior to the Marines with my pellet rifle and .22, but were talking 25 to 100 yards. I was taught well and given great tips throughout my time in the corps and every time I qualified on the range I shot expert and a few times I shot range high. Standard rifle qual for a Marine is 200, 300, and 500 yards using nothing but irons sights and the knowledge you've aquired to successfully hit your target. Think about it, your squinting to see a man size target at 500 yards, standing up, and still placing a round in the black. Theres more technique and control involved in placing rounds that are beneficial to you for the rest of your life besides just throwing an optic on and saying, put the dot on your target and squeeze.

Now understandably, if were at war and troops arent getting years of training but are instead being put on the front fairly quickly, then it makes sence to establish a quick and dirty way to make those troops effective ASAP. Time and money. The Army always gets new equipment before the Marines. I was always kinda irked getting issued equipment that had been used in Vietnam and Korea. Apparently due to all the warring, the budget has caught up and soldiers and Marines are getting issued optics. Anyway back to the point.

Optics are great, but please learn the essentials to marksmanship. Especially if you're using an AR platform, learn how to get your dope and make adjustments to the iron sights provided for you. If youve got a dot on top, its probably good for 200 yards if you have your zero. I dunno, one could also say that todays theater of operations would have you engaging targets in close range, so use of optics would be fine. I'm just saying that putting all your eggs in one basket in that cool looking and expensive piece of equipment atop your rail isnt the end all be all to whats best.

 

[devildog70]

Ok, heres my take. First analogy. Yeager says thats why you see optics being used in competition. Well, duh. Give a kid a calculator for a math quiz and he'll do well also. Does that mean the kid has the skills necessary to succeed without the handicap?

I'm a Gulf War era Marine. We weren't taught with optics, we were taught marksmanship skills from boot camp on into the fleet. Now I felt like I was a good shot prior to the Marines with my pellet rifle and .22, but were talking 25 to 100 yards. I was taught well and given great tips throughout my time in the corps and every time I qualified on the range I shot expert and a few times I shot range high. Standard rifle qual for a Marine is 200, 300, and 500 yards using nothing but irons sights and the knowledge you've aquired to successfully hit your target. Think about it, your squinting to see a man size target at 500 yards, standing up, and still placing a round in the black. Theres more technique and control involved in placing rounds that are beneficial to you for the rest of your life besides just throwing an optic on and saying, put the dot on your target and squeeze.

Now understandably, if were at war and troops arent getting years of training but are instead being put on the front fairly quickly, then it makes sence to establish a quick and dirty way to make those troops effective ASAP. Time and money. The Army always gets new equipment before the Marines. I was always kinda irked getting issued equipment that had been used in Vietnam and Korea. Apparently due to all the warring, the budget has caught up and soldiers and Marines are getting issued optics. Anyway back to the point.

Optics are great, but please learn the essentials to marksmanship. Especially if you're using an AR platform, learn how to get your dope and make adjustments to the iron sights provided for you. If youve got a dot on top, its probably good for 200 yards if you have your zero. I dunno, one could also say that todays theater of operations would have you engaging targets in close range, so use of optics would be fine. I'm just saying that putting all your eggs in one basket in that cool looking and expensive piece of equipment atop your rail isnt the end all be all to whats best.

There was no standing at the 500 in the USMC qual course. It was prone, slow fire.