Indiana "expungement "

[Gunner72]

I have s friend that got into some trouble about 20 years ago. Charged with D felony in Indiana. He wanted to be able to hunt again and possibly get his LTCH. Paid a lawyer a bunch of money and received his expungement about 10 months later.
He recently tried to purchase a firearm and was denied. Sent for his appeal. And waiting
Applied for LTCH waited 60 plus days for another denial. So he contacted ISP firearms division. They told him that they do not recognize Indiana expungement law. Contacted his lawyer and he said same thing.
The law just seals your record not really expunge it. Can you believe this ??
He also received a letter from the "Feds " stating that they also do not recognize the new law from Indiana therefore you do not have your gun rights reinstated. Hmmm
Sounds like 2nd amendment right violation to me.
So if any of you know of someone considering an expungement I would recommend that they get the charges reduced if it's a felony, to a misdemeanor to get their gun rights back.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

The law just seals your record not really expunge it. Can you believe this ??

Yes, I can believe it. I have been advising people since the first version of expungement came on line years ago that it is not a true restoration.

Indiana tries to be too cute and its "little bit pregnant" approach, an appeasement to LE, is ineffective.

I wrote LSA and my senator and rep about how to fix it. Nothing so far.

He also received a letter from the "Feds " stating that they also do not recognize the new law from Indiana therefore you do not have your gun rights reinstated.

Correct, as law enforcement can still see it, it is not a true restoration under §921.

Analogous to Wyoming Crank from the 10th Circuit.

https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=32965787035346881&hl=en&as_sdt=2&as_vis=1&oi=scholarr

Sounds like 2nd amendment right violation to me.

How so?

So if any of you know of someone considering an expungement I would recommend that they get the charges reduced if it's a felony, to a misdemeanor to get their gun rights back.

Well, if possible, e.g. a D or a 6, but that is not always possible.

I've had decent luck with PCRs, depending on what it is, PA might even agree.

Pardons are effective, but very limited envelope and take a long time.

 

[Gunner72]

His lawyer said that he had a couple of dozen people going after Feds for 2nd amendment rights violation. Have the NRA involved. Could take a long time. According to the Indiana law the can not discriminate.
Did you know that the law went in affect in July 2013. People that where expunged in the first year got their gun rights back. Then letter from Feds shows up and poof. They don't recognize the law anymore.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

His lawyer said that he had a couple of dozen people going after Feds for 2nd amendment rights violation.

There is such talk.

Have the NRA involved.

I do not know, but they do not tell me everything.

According to the Indiana law the can not discriminate.

Hmmm, well, there is something called the Supremacy Clause so I know who will win that contest.

Did you know that the law went in affect in July 2013.

Yes, and I've been advising people since then that this will not fly.

People that where expunged in the first year got their gun rights back.

No gun rights were regained. After the "emergency implementation" in March of 2014, ISP granted LTCHs for March and April.

ISP then learned of DoJ's interpretation of the new Indiana expungement statute and the issuance of LTCHs ceased.

hey don't recognize the law anymore.

They never did under §921.

 

[Gunner72]

I guess what and see what happens then huh???

 

[Kirk Freeman]

A legislative fix would be the simplest and most direct. However, this last session was for "economic issues".*


*Some jokes I just do for me.

 

[sbu sailor]

Can a person regain gun rights after a Governer's pardon? Kirk, is that what you meant by effective?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Can a person regain gun rights after a Governer's pardon? Kirk, is that what you meant by effective?

Yes. I've done 3 so far.

 

[Indy-Mike]

A legislative fix would be the simplest and most direct. However, this last session was for "economic issues".*


*Some jokes I just do for me.

made me laugh

 

[Gunner72]

Yes. I've done 3 so far.

Can you tell me a ball park figure for a governor pardon?? And is that a better way than getting d felony reduced?? Also do you know if "reduced" will give back rights??

 

[BIGnTall83]

Kirk Freeman, PM sent I am also interested in information on a Governor pardon for my wife.

 

[Vigilant]

So, technically, Indiana's "expungememt" law restores all civil rights EXCEPT firearms possession? You can get a license to say, practice law, or be a doctor or nurse, or hold public office again, but still can't own a firearm?

 

[Gunner72]

That is correct. Everything except gun rights restored. A different name for the should be required. Expungement does not really apply.

 

[hallcs]

It's very confusing, it appears to me that Indiana is trying to make it all the Fed's fault. In July of 2015 they took out the part about not restoring firearm rights and added " Except for persons convicted of a crime of domestic violence, I.C. § 35-38-9-10(c) now specifically provides that expungement of an Indiana conviction will result in restoration of the petitioner’s status as a “proper person” pursuant to the provisions of I.C. § 35-47-2.

If status of being a "Proper Person" is restored then your gun rights should be restored. The fed's don't see Indiana's expungement as a true expungement and also do not accept the restoration of rights as it says in the Indiana law.

 

[jay02insd]

New Ways in Indiana to Restore Gun Rights

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I can finally talk about it.

INGO, be advised that there has been a re-reading of the Indiana statute as to expungements by the United States Department of Justice. Indiana expungements pursuant to Indiana Code 35-38-9-10(c) are now treated as restorations under federal law (18 USC §921(a)(20)) allowing individuals with expunged disqualifiers to restore their right to possess firearms.

This is in part to litigation in Jay County, Indiana by Andrew "Andy" Maternowski, an attorney from Indianapolis, who pursued a Motion to Show Cause on a expungement order against ISP on a LTCH denial and a clarification by Indiana Senator Brent Steele as to legislative intent.

If you have such an issue, it is within your best interest to contact an attorney.

 

[HoughMade]

Is this through a court decision, a change in policy, or both?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Is this through a court decision, a change in policy, or both?

DoJ letter ruling (dated October 28th). PM me your new work e-mail and I'll have the staff send it up.

 

[eatsnopaste]

DoJ letter ruling (dated October 28th). PM me your new work e-mail and I'll have the staff send it up.

I love to hear people say...I'll have my people get right one it! it's so..'merican!

 

[Vigilant]

I've read a little about this since July, does the order from the court have to specifically SAY all rights, including the right to bear arms are restored? Or is the expungememt enough?