I'm not sure if we're a 2nd world country now? 3rd? 4th?

[DragonGunner]

Hell, lots of foreign states could drop a nuke faster than that....all it takes is launching it from a ship off the coast.

NK easy
Iran easy

On and on.

Rump jockies get maternity leave and a mentally ill man that likes to pretend he is a woman is the assistant secretary of health....so all is fine.

FJB and those of his ilk....straight to Hades.

Back in the "good ole days" the mentally ill were put in a sanatorium. Now the Sanatorium inmates are running the country.

 

[DragonGunner]

Talked about this back in school 40 years ago with a friend. How would one destroy the USA. One way is to sneak nuclear weapons across borders, and assemble them in every major city. They all go off no one knows who did it. Another way is just send thousands of terrorists across the border and they go into cities, and attack same time blowing up nuclear plants, and setting every city on fire. Wouldn't need to conquer the USA, just knock us out and out of the playing field so we can't hinder whoever from taking over. But as years go by looks like the top elites, R & D all working together will destroy us first. Having the debt so high from taxes, trampling the Constitution and killing the Republic in exchange for Democracy, which the forefathers said will always lead to suicide. God help us.

 

[rooster]

Doesn’t even take a hypersonic nuclear payload to send this country back to the Stone Age.

Dirty bomb in or near the largest 1-3 shipping ports (LA, Long Beach, NY/NJ) and sabotage the electrical grid via nuking a couple key plants or even just knocking out substations/ natural gas lines in a coordinated manner.

County descends into chaos. No power means no gas pumps, no gas pumps means no goods move. People begin to die from starvation, exposure within 3 months, in the meantime people will be killing each other over food, fuel and water by day 12. Troops go awol for fear of their own families safety

The first Chinese troops land 3 months in to face a semi coordinated militia style defense after they roll right over the west coast ( lack of guns, too many people without resources).

End result, everyone west of the Mississippi is speaking Chinese by 2023. East of the Mississippi tens of millions dead from famine, exposure, tribal violence. Chinese setup factories in west coast conquered Territory paying slave wages of just enough bread/rice to survive and the west coast people who survive the initial event will be happy to work for their new overlords.

Chinese KIA will measure in the thousands but do they really care?

If I can plan this out then surely the Chinese are contemplating it, late fall October-December is perhaps our most vulnerable time as a country from a coordinated attack on infrastructure.

 

[buckwacker]

A bit off topic, but I don't understand the advantage of hypersonics (mach 5+) when ICBMs travel at mach 20. Greater maneuverability and lower altitude flight profile aspects makes them more difficult to defend against? More difficult to determine where they will be launched from? Granted the payload trajectory of an ICBM is perhaps more predictable shortly after launch and definitely after booster separation, but it's 4 time faster.

 

[cobber]

A bit off topic, but I don't understand the advantage of hypersonics (mach 5+) when ICBMs travel at mach 20. Greater maneuverability and lower altitude flight profile aspects makes them more difficult to defend against? More difficult to determine where they will be launched from? Granted the payload trajectory of an ICBM is perhaps more predictable shortly after launch and definitely after booster separation, but it's 4 time faster.

"Hypersonic" seems kind of like "assault" weapon... A term calculated to intimidate...

 

[ghuns]

...One way is to sneak nuclear weapons across borders, and assemble them in every major city... Another way is just send thousands of terrorists across the border and they go into cities, and attack same time blowing up nuclear plants, and setting every city on fire...

There's a 1000X easier way. Attack our power grid. And you'd don't need a fancy EMP to do it.

This is one of the scariest books I've ever read...

Total Power

There are a bunch of statements and scenarios in that book that leave you thinking, it can't be that easy. But minimal google-fu reveals that it kinda is.

A coordinated attack on 9 electrical substations, there are 55,000 of them, would create a nationwide blackout...

U.S. Risks National Blackout From Small-Scale Attack

Add in a cyber attack and the fact that much of the hardware that our grid depends on are bespoke parts with no spares and there's no telling how long the light would say out.

How many people would die in the first week? The first month? A s**tload for sure.

But a whole year? Estimates for that range from 60-90%...

- PROTECTING THE ELECTRIC GRID FROM THE POTENTIAL THREATS OF SOLAR STORMS AND ELECTROMAGNETIC PULSE

www.govinfo.gov

It is briefly dealt with in the Commission report of 2008, and there are essentially two estimates on how many people would die from hunger, from starvation, from lack of water, and from social disruption. One estimate is that within a year or so, two-thirds of the United States population would die. The other estimate is that within a year or so, 90 percent of the U.S. population would die. We are talking about total devastation. We are not talking about just a regular catastrophe.

 

[Leadeye]

Much like the Mig-25 when it was first introduced I think more data will have to be looked at before we can make any conclusions either way. I remember when all the stories about the Mig-25 were running, even leading to a movie with Clint Eastwood. The reality was that the plane was a big block of steel with two gigantic engines attached to it. Western intelligence made all sorts of bad guesses about it's capabilities based on western design of aircraft. In the end, it's short range and poor turning ability, made it a limited use airplane.

 

[HoughMade]

So the thought is that this Chinese development happened within the last 9 months? That's charmingly provincial.

 

[jwamplerusa]

Doesn’t even take a hypersonic nuclear payload to send this country back to the Stone Age.

Dirty bomb in or near the largest 1-3 shipping ports (LA, Long Beach, NY/NJ) and sabotage the electrical grid via nuking a couple key plants or even just knocking out substations/ natural gas lines in a coordinated manner.

County descends into chaos. No power means no gas pumps, no gas pumps means no goods move. People begin to die from starvation, exposure within 3 months, in the meantime people will be killing each other over food, fuel and water by day 12. Troops go awol for fear of their own families safety

The first Chinese troops land 3 months in to face a semi coordinated militia style defense after they roll right over the west coast ( lack of guns, too many people without resources).

End result, everyone west of the Mississippi is speaking Chinese by 2023. East of the Mississippi tens of millions dead from famine, exposure, tribal violence. Chinese setup factories in west coast conquered Territory paying slave wages of just enough bread/rice to survive and the west coast people who survive the initial event will be happy to work for their new overlords.

Chinese KIA will measure in the thousands but do they really care?

If I can plan this out then surely the Chinese are contemplating it, late fall October-December is perhaps our most vulnerable time as a country from a coordinated attack on infrastructure.

You must have read some Tom Clancy.

 

[BugI02]

If China's claims are true, they can drop a nuke on LA in 100 minutes and it sounds like there's nothing we can do to stop it.

Thank God we have the most diverse administration in US history. Clearly they're doing a great job and that was the appropriate criteria for selection.

1 Ohio class SSBN

24 D5 Trident II missiles

Up to 12 MIRV warheads per missile. That's 288 up to 475 kiloton warheads on targets

The question is if they would have the backbone to go to DEFCON 1 and retaliate

I imagine DC is safer with Biden ensconced in it, even the Chinese know leaving the weakling currently running the show in place will cause more confusion. A decapitation strike would leave capable, committed mid-level officers in charge and a burn off of the CCP and PLA would be more likely

 

[BugI02]

How does lebensraum translate to chinese?

五年计划

 

[BugI02]

Nothing is stopping any state or individual from walking across the border with a nuke in a backpack. That's a far more likely threat, that I'd be shocked if it hasn't already happened and been set up in a "just in case" capacity by someone.

China has too much to lose for that to be a rational play for them. It's a fear tool that would break them if they used it, destroying their biggest product importer, folding their economy up over night. Likely a scape goat for biden to use for when China invades Taiwan, so he can say "but we can't risk nuclear war!"

This country has already folded up, people are just in the denial stage of grief.

So, an EMP device or two and then supply personal to the UN mandated troops to help the US 'recover' from the chaos

Heck, the Dems and the Alpublicans might be in on it

 

[BugI02]

Nothing is stopping any state or individual from walking across the border with a nuke in a backpack. That's a far more likely threat, that I'd be shocked if it hasn't already happened and been set up in a "just in case" capacity by someone.

China has too much to lose for that to be a rational play for them. It's a fear tool that would break them if they used it, destroying their biggest product importer, folding their economy up over night. Likely a scape goat for biden to use for when China invades Taiwan, so he can say "but we can't risk nuclear war!"

This country has already folded up, people are just in the denial stage of grief.

"... Oh ye of little faith"

 

[BugI02]

Likely a scape goat for biden to use for when China invades Taiwan, so he can say "but we can't risk nuclear war!"

My thought was it is the Military Industrial Complex highlighting another 'missile gap' in order to get a huge increase in R&D/pocket lining funding (with 10% for the big guy, of course)

 

[BugI02]

Add in a cyber attack and the fact that much of the hardware that our grid depends on are bespoke parts with no spares and there's no telling how long the light would say out.

It is my understanding that transformers over a certain capacity (140 kV, I think) are only made currently in China and were a multi-month lead time item even before the supply chain breakdown - let alone that I wouldn't them to expedite a shipment for us
in an hour of need

Few if any spares on hand and they have to be built to spec if needed. The sun could bring about these scenarios tomorrow with a large CME with no hostile action required, but plenty of bad actors would be willing to take advantage of our dire straits

 

[rooster]

You must have read some Tom Clancy.

I’ve never read any of his stuff actually. This is the assessment I came up with last year when covid started. I’m honestly surprised it didn’t happen then.

I’ve worked in the power industry and ghuns is absolutely correct. If the power fails then watch the dominoes fall. It’s simply a matter of playing out what happens next.

Last year proved that the vast majority of people aren’t even prepared to live out of their own pantry for 2 weeks let alone through a long winter with little to no wild goods available even with their power still on.

 

[zippy23]

I think our dooms day fancy is being tickled here a bit, it is fun. I think you destroy the usa exactly like the left is doing. You cant do it overnight, that would send the entire world into chaos. Yes, attacking our electrical grid is not difficult, and would plunge the country into chaos in weeks, the stock market would be obliterated overnight, which would then be a domino effect on the world. Everything would stop. The US is the world currency, cant destroy us overnight or they destroy themselves. So they do it slowly and manage our decline while keeping their countries going. You get a media that lies about everything. You get public school to teach hate for your own country, and confuse them on literally everything from gender to 2+2. You tell them their parents are racists, you tell them everyday there is no right and wrong, and they grow up being idiots who vote one way their entire lives. Try going somewhere like a bowling alley, or a mall and look around. Its terrifying looking at American youth listening to their idiocy. I got a great example, the other weekend I had a bunch of neighbors over, we all got lots of kids, a neighbor daughter was over, a couple adults of course starting trashing biden, she pipes up saying she's a "socialist". Now where in the world did she learn that?? PUBLIC SCHOOL. I said "You arent old enough to even know what that means. She literally tried to argue with me. She's never had a job. After 3 minutes she got so upset she had to leave. It was shocking. I told her she needs to give me money right now to pay for my kids schooling. She was dumbfounded. But to actually be so dumb, and try to argue with a stranger....this is public schooling, social media, main stream media....its a battle that if you put your kids through public school, you will battle them your whole life. This is how you destroy a country. You do it slowly. You own memebers of congress like the chinese do, then you wait and watch and manage the soft punches that hit your country and you adjust until the usa is done. Its really that simple, and thats the smart way.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I think our dooms day fancy is being tickled here a bit, it is fun. I think you destroy the usa exactly like the left is doing. You cant do it overnight, that would send the entire world into chaos. Yes, attacking our electrical grid is not difficult, and would plunge the country into chaos in weeks, the stock market would be obliterated overnight, which would then be a domino effect on the world. Everything would stop. The US is the world currency, cant destroy us overnight or they destroy themselves. So they do it slowly and manage our decline while keeping their countries going. You get a media that lies about everything. You get public school to teach hate for your own country, and confuse them on literally everything from gender to 2+2. You tell them their parents are racists, you tell them everyday there is no right and wrong, and they grow up being idiots who vote one way their entire lives. Try going somewhere like a bowling alley, or a mall and look around. Its terrifying looking at American youth listening to their idiocy. I got a great example, the other weekend I had a bunch of neighbors over, we all got lots of kids, a neighbor daughter was over, a couple adults of course starting trashing biden, she pipes up saying she's a "socialist". Now where in the world did she learn that?? PUBLIC SCHOOL. I said "You arent old enough to even know what that means. She literally tried to argue with me. She's never had a job. After 3 minutes she got so upset she had to leave. It was shocking. I told her she needs to give me money right now to pay for my kids schooling. She was dumbfounded. But to actually be so dumb, and try to argue with a stranger....this is public schooling, social media, main stream media....its a battle that if you put your kids through public school, you will battle them your whole life. This is how you destroy a country. You do it slowly. You own memebers of congress like the chinese do, then you wait and watch and manage the soft punches that hit your country and you adjust until the usa is done. Its really that simple, and thats the smart way.

I started to read this, but then it hurt my head. Hitting the enter key once in awhile is your friend.. I made it through, and agree with it, but dang...

 

[phylodog]

This is how you destroy a country. You do it slowly. You own memebers of congress like the chinese do, then you wait and watch and manage the soft punches that hit your country and you adjust until the usa is done.

This is why I created this thread. The U.S.A. is almost done, they've almost completed their plans. It would have been more seamless but Trump threw a serious wrench in the works and they kicked things into overdrive.

 

[Ark]

Doesn’t even take a hypersonic nuclear payload to send this country back to the Stone Age.

Dirty bomb in or near the largest 1-3 shipping ports (LA, Long Beach, NY/NJ) and sabotage the electrical grid via nuking a couple key plants or even just knocking out substations/ natural gas lines in a coordinated manner.

County descends into chaos. No power means no gas pumps, no gas pumps means no goods move. People begin to die from starvation, exposure within 3 months, in the meantime people will be killing each other over food, fuel and water by day 12. Troops go awol for fear of their own families safety

The first Chinese troops land 3 months in to face a semi coordinated militia style defense after they roll right over the west coast ( lack of guns, too many people without resources).

End result, everyone west of the Mississippi is speaking Chinese by 2023. East of the Mississippi tens of millions dead from famine, exposure, tribal violence. Chinese setup factories in west coast conquered Territory paying slave wages of just enough bread/rice to survive and the west coast people who survive the initial event will be happy to work for their new overlords.

Chinese KIA will measure in the thousands but do they really care?

If I can plan this out then surely the Chinese are contemplating it, late fall October-December is perhaps our most vulnerable time as a country from a coordinated attack on infrastructure.

Ah you must be a science fiction reader.

It's all horrifyingly easy to bring down in kinetic ways, before you even start talking about the non-kinetic ways. It's enough to drive a man to drink.