I felt threatened

[Wheeler78]

I think in this case you should not stop and get out of your car but most of all you should not grab your gun and display it to the angry guy.
Unless the guy gets off of his car with some kind of weapon and it looks like he's going to attack you then do not pull your gun out just to make the guy calm down.
I think its very dangerous.
Imagine the angry guy is also a LTCH holder, as soon as he sees you with your gun in your hand ready to use it he could just shoot you because you would put his life in danger.
I agree with a previous post, having a gun on you made you feel powerful and that's dangerous.You are not the only guy with a gun out there and you could have got yourself shot if the other guy was armed too.
In this situation its a faillure to drow your gun.This is not a life or death situation who calls for the use of a firearm.
Then where is the limit if you take your gun out for anything?
A guy calls you names in street and you just pull your gun out and say "Hey if I were you I would calm down really quick!".?

leaving this thread because some people see me as a hot head who drew my gun because of some guy riding my butt in the street. truth of the matter is this. he had a truck that could go alot faster then me (out running not going to happen) he was about to put my car into a ditch at 45-50 mph (i could die or at least total my car i don't care about the car but if he throws me of the road and i'm hurt/dead do you honestly think he would call 911?) i felt like he was going to do this soon so i chose to pull off the road. me not having my phone is a dumb** mistake i know if i had it then i wouldn't be here talking about it. driving off once he got out was my first choice for pulling over but once i did i knew i couldn't out run him so only **** him off more. for the love of god please don't even begin to ask me if i'm prepaird to shoot a man cause i've just gotten back from afghanistan where i've been in that spot quite a few times. no this dosen't have to do with this situation but it dose feel like a personal attack on me and my training. i know when and when not to shoot i felt the need to have a wepion on me can have it on my hip so i had it in my hand. i'm done typing i'm just upset now.

 

[Hooker]

Don't take this personally Wheeler. This conversation is exactly what this forum is for. I for one have never before thought about what I would do in this scenario and your experience has made me think it through. Everyone saying you should've done this or should've done that is doing the same thing. I think you bringing this topic to the community was a good thing.

 

[JBob77]

I probably would have pulled off like the OP, but not exited the vehicle. At that point, you are safer, because the vehicle speed and control is not a factor any longer. At that point you have some options. I think making decisions or maneuvers while driving down the road, with an upset driver on your tail could prove difficult. If the other driver gets out and comes to your vehicle to confront you, then you have choices. You can proceed to drive off, hoping that the time it takes them to get back to vehicle and continue pursuit, you can get away from them. You can lower your window, just enough to try to apologize, and at that time, things could go two ways. they could start to calm down, in which case you are fine. Or , the other driver could try to gain access to your vehicle, illegally, in which case you then have reason to believe that person means you harm. I would have made my decision on making a phone call to 911while driving, based on whether I felt I could safely make the call and maintain control of my vehicle. In this case, one swerve, or unstable move could have been the window of opportunity for the enraged driver to try a pit-stop type maneuver.

 

[sbcman]

Frankly, I'm just amazed that the OP didn't have a cell phone with him. I thought I was the only man left that doesn't have a cellular constantly in my ear. Wait, how old school of me, I me texting constantly.

I wouldn't take any of this stuff personally. When you ask for opinions on this forum, you're going to get them.

 

[chocktaw2]

Threatened

OMG, your actions are full of fail.

Do NOT engage in conversation with another driver you pissed off.

Do NOT pull into a parking lot to meet with said driver.

Do NOT get out of your car if said driver is "stomping towards you" and you "feel threatened"

Do NOT get out with a gun in your hand(pink, come on now).

You need to seriously think things through if you are going to be carrying a firearm for SD. You made many bad moves here. Put on your flame suit, it's going to get hot.
I'll give you a rep!
What the heck do you think would have happened if you didn't have a gun with you? Apparently your gun made you feel powerful enough to be willing to stop in a parking lot with a pissed off guy? Would you have done that if you didn't have a firearm?

You should have called 911 and explained that you had a hostile guy on your 6 threatening you, and perhaps driven to the nearest police station.

You injected your self into more danger with your actions. You're lucky he didn't have a gun and open up on you.

I'll give u a rep on this!

 

[Htrailblazer]

I dont agree with everyone saying to drive off. Why put even more people in danger by your evasive driving and his enraged driving. I would have done a couple things different though. I would have tried to pick a populated area to perhaps alter this persons intended actions.. I would have stayed in the car, gun in my lap, doors locked, car in gear, and window cracked. That way you can tell the driver sorry, you didnt mean him harm and if he wished to push the issue there were options left. Like drive away with him out of his car, or if the worst case came true and he attempted to gain entry you could have protected your self with your firearm.

 

[femurphy77]

I wonder if OP would have been so quick to stop if he hadn't had his "courage" with him? It's easy to armchair quarterback but I "think" given the same situation until the other person involved in this road rage incident physically attacked by ramming that I would have made the effort to leave him to his own entertainment. If it means getting rammed, well at that point I'm physically in danger so it's highly possible that full defense mode would kick in.

I'm going to stereotype here and say OP is a 20 something that got "dissed" when he "dissed" the other participant and then "it was on". Grow up! Both in your actions that initiated this confrontation and in your response. I've done a lot of driving, and seen a lot of road raging fools and it always appears to me that the situation is easily diffused by one saying "uncle", in other words, exit, slow down, move over, whatever, just chill.

Flame suit on.

 

[finity]

In most cases while moving, your car is your 3,000lb sanctuary. Stay there and drive.

In most cases, yes.

In the case where a raging idiot has threatened you with running you off the road...not so much anymore.

Do NOT get out of your car if said driver is "stomping towards you" and you "feel threatened"

I actually agree with this part of your post.

Mostly everything else...not so much.

Based on my 36 years of CCW and training, the gun should not come out unless it desperately needs to be discharged. Any waving of it around should bring a charge of assault with a deadly weapon.

Unfortunately, I don't think there is such a crime.

As we've been told, your car is a 3,000 pound sanctuary. It is also a 3,000 pound weapon so the guy had a weapon. He threatened him. When he got out of his truck he was saying he was going to possibly kill him (by running him off the road). It's only prudent to take him at his word.

I agree that the OP shouldn't have got out of his vehicle. But showing it to him definitely de-escalated the situation & that wasn't illegal.

Ok, here is my opinion from 63 years of living. Once in my life, I had someone force me off the road in a road rage situation. I wished that I had a gun then, because he got out of his truck and tried to confront me. Fortunately, for me, when he got a little way away from his truck, I put it in gear and burned rubber getting away. I never saw him again. If I had been in your shoes, I would have done the same thing. . . you were in a tough spot. If you ignored him, I think he would have run you off of the road. So, I think you did a good job. . .you diffused the situation without violence. Calling 911 would have been good, but you did not have a phone. Your actions showed him you meant business, but you were not going to let him bully you. Your cool head and clear thinking prevailed.

I agree.

Unless the guy gets off of his car with some kind of weapon and it looks like he's going to attack you then do not pull your gun out just to make the guy calm down.

What part of "pull over or I'll run you off the road" makes you think that it looked like he WASN'T going to attack him?

For there to be a deadly threat there doesn't HAVE to be a weapon.

I think its very dangerous.
Imagine the angry guy is also a LTCH holder, as soon as he sees you with your gun in your hand ready to use it he could just shoot you because you would put his life in danger.

Now he MAY be thinking that to try to justify his actions but that's not the REALITY of the situation if that's what you're trying to imply.

The guy in the truck started it. The guy in the truck threatened him. The guy in the truck forced him (through threat of bodily injury) to pull over & stop.

The OP made a mistake, nobody was injured & he moved on. Which is the same as I would have done. The guy in the truck wouldn't allow it to end.

The guy in the truck didn't have "self-defense" available as an option for his defense. HE was the one who escalated it.

I'm with Sylvain. You are very lucky the other guy wasn't armed. Think about it in his perspective some guy just ran a stop sign and you almost hit him.

Key word there is "ALMOST". Stuff happens, get over it.

proceed to mess with him a little because he's in a van and you're in a truck.

So you think it's reasonable for the guy in the truck to "mess with" the OP but not for the OP to respond to a potentially deadly threat?

The guy in the van pulls over into an empty parking lot.

Because you just made him do it by threatening his life if he didn't.

Clearly he's looking for a fight.

Clearly, SOMEBODY is looking for a fight but it sure isn't the OP.

So you get out to confront the guy and then he steps out with an mp5 look a like. What would you have done in that situation?

Then I guess I shouldn't have chased him down, threatened him & forced him to pull over under threat of bodily injury & gotten out in an angry manner & walked toward the guy.

I understand you didn't have a phone but if your going to pull into an empty parking lot to confront either take your ass whippin or give one and go about your day.

WHAT!

Why should the OP take an ass whipping from some guy that he did not provoke? I know I sure as hell wouldn't & the law doesn't require it.

You were not in fear for your or your family's life so I disagree with pulling a gun to show him you mean business.

REALLY?

So you don't think that him threatening to run him off the road was not potentially life threatening or at a minimum might be likely to cause serious bodily injury to the OP?

Which is the minimum standard for using deadly force BY LAW, by the way.

People have this gross misconception that you have to be in fear of DYING in order to use deadly force. THAT'S NOT TRUE! READ THE LAW!

I probably would have pulled off like the OP, but not exited the vehicle. At that point, you are safer, because the vehicle speed and control is not a factor any longer. At that point you have some options. I think making decisions or maneuvers while driving down the road, with an upset driver on your tail could prove difficult. If the other driver gets out and comes to your vehicle to confront you, then you have choices. You can proceed to drive off, hoping that the time it takes them to get back to vehicle and continue pursuit, you can get away from them. You can lower your window, just enough to try to apologize, and at that time, things could go two ways. they could start to calm down, in which case you are fine. Or , the other driver could try to gain access to your vehicle, illegally, in which case you then have reason to believe that person means you harm. I would have made my decision on making a phone call to 911while driving, based on whether I felt I could safely make the call and maintain control of my vehicle. In this case, one swerve, or unstable move could have been the window of opportunity for the enraged driver to try a pit-stop type maneuver.

Again, another person who shows good sense. Thank you.

I wonder if OP would have been so quick to stop if he hadn't had his "courage" with him? It's easy to armchair quarterback but I "think" given the same situation until the other person involved in this road rage incident physically attacked by ramming that I would have made the effort to leave him to his own entertainment. If it means getting rammed, well at that point I'm physically in danger so it's highly possible that full defense mode would kick in.

How fast are you willing to drive to try to "leave him to his own entertainment"?

And what if by the time the idiot in the truck "rams" the OP it's already to late for him to defend himself because he's either dead or paralyzed?

I'm going to stereotype here and say OP is a 20 something that got "dissed" when he "dissed" the other participant and then "it was on". Grow up! Both in your actions that initiated this confrontation and in your response. I've done a lot of driving, and seen a lot of road raging fools and it always appears to me that the situation is easily diffused by one saying "uncle", in other words, exit, slow down, move over, whatever, just chill.

Flame suit on.

Oh please.

You're really blaming the OP for initiating the confrontation?

Because he accidentally ran a stop sign?

Have you EVER made a mistake while driving?

Did that mistake justify someone coming after you & threatening to run you off the road?

Like I said, I agree that the OP shouldn't have stepped out of his car.

Other than that I don't see anything wrong in what he did. He didn't point his gun at the guy & everybody went home without any injuries. Where's the problem?

Could it have turned out worse? Sure but it could have turned out worse if the guy would have followed through on his threat & actually ran him off the road, too.

It seems that the OP already did exactly what you suggested in your last sentence...& it didn't do him any good. The guy still came after him.

Now what?

Oh yeah, just keep driving (faster & faster?) until (hopefully) the guy gets bored & leaves you alone.

 

[Wheeler78]

ok so i lied i had to come back to this thread after i cooled off from some posts here.

In most cases, yes....

thank you so much for for spelling it out what i was thinking. i know i shouldn't of left my car but t was a split reaction. and if there's a next time i'll have learned from this. i already have. (cell/glock on me and check it before i leave home, just like my visa lol) a big +1 for this.

 

[nsheepdog]

I agree with most of these comments. You should have kept driving and called the police. But, I do think it's smart of you to have reflected on the situation and hopefully learned what you might do different next time.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

(cell/glock on me and check it before i leave home, just like my visa lol) a big +1 for this.

This ^ . Force yourself to be OCD about it , then it will become "second nature" and you won't have to think about it .

The phone gives you options like calling 911 , "I'm heading this way and this is going on , help " .

Sounds like you learned from it and now you know what not to do, so good on ya .

 

[BigGuyinMuncie]

Crazy guy in a car chasing you=stop and get out with a gun? No way! The phone is more useful than the gun here. Call the cops and try to hold out in your vehicle while moving. The situation could have been A LOT different if old hot head had been carrying also. Ran stop sign turns in to headline. Bad for you and for gun owners in general.
Your weapon should have been a last resort. Im glad your safe. And in the end, nobody was hurt.