How to serve a warrant: 1972 versus today

[j706]

I can smell your arrogance from here. I wish you luck raiding these houses (purple), there are some bad guys out there.

Well how kind and considerate of you. Thanks!

Arrogance? No not at all. I just grow weary of people thinking they have the answer when they have no clue. Tactics used today are not done on a whim. It is real easy to sit behind a keyboard and talk about walking up to the front door of some unstable nut jobs home to serve a warrant. But reality is quite different.

 

[SumtnFancy]

Well how kind and considerate of you. Thanks!

Arrogance? No not at all. I just grow weary of people thinking they have the answer when they have no clue.

I'll take the LT's experience over yours, sorry. To him, you are the kids behind the keyboard. New "problems" will always be used to justify unconstitutional acts. Now go crack some skulls, stormtrooper!

 

[j706]

I'll take the LT's experience over yours, sorry. To him, you are the kids behind the keyboard. New "problems" will always be used to justify unconstitutional acts. Now go crack some skulls, stormtrooper!

Hey man don't get all angry and stuff. Relax and enjoy your life some. Just try to remember that there are times when certain types of extreme people need to be dealt with in ways that make some folks feel uncontrollable.

 

[j706]

Exactly. The piece wasn't anti-cop, (hell, it was written by a retired cop who I have more than a bit of respect for), it was anti-militarisation, as you said. Cops who consistently deny this is occurring are either blind, faithful to the gang or lying. The proof is right in front of our eyes. Just because their department isn't excessively militarised yet doesn't mean it's not happening across the country. There are more departments than theirs in this country. And at least one of the responding cops in this thread is what I consider to be a tainted cop. He admittedly refuses to cite his fellow officers when they break the law. What else does he overlook? I'll take the good LT anyday.

Hmmm I am guessing I am the "tainted" cop because I don't write infraction citations to other cops. I have not changed. Heck I probably wouldn't even write you one either.

 

[PaulF]

Good evening, everyone.

Just a friendly reminder that insults are not tolerated on INGO, we need everyone's help in keeping things civil.

Carry on.

-Paul

 

[jbombelli]

They take SWAT teams on these raids because they have to. After all, they might be coming to MY house by mistake.


[video=youtube;JB_deAcoC2I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB_deAcoC2I[/video]

 

[j706]

They take SWAT teams on these raids because they have to. After all, they might be coming to MY house by mistake.


[video=youtube;JB_deAcoC2I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB_deAcoC2I[/video]

That guy needs to attend sensitivity training.

 

[wally05]

Wow... idiotic article written by a "cop"... if you can call him that. Like J said, 99% of warrants are served by beat cops knocking on doors. I get an occasional call to assist on a service. But, if the guy is known to be armed and dangerous, then it goes down a different way. People get pissy about police "militarization"... if that is what they call it. But, without cities having SWAT teams and other resources to handle such things, we would be resorting to using Federal officers or military. Anyone hear of Posse Comitatus? I doubt you want military guys doing it for us. At least the local departments have a citizenry that can get rid of them.

Things don't seem to change around here. The same people spouting the same idiotic crap.

 

[Liberty Sanders]

Well that was just about one stupid and slanted article. Someone with an agenda is how it sounds to me. SO was it really about no knock warrants or was it really about cops with FA guns, armored vehicles, dope smokers rights and asset seizure? Weird thing is in my 13 years of policing I have never been on one single warrant service like described. No knock warrants happen from time to time and for the right reasons. I would bet some good money that the dear ole LT. would not be to interested in knocking on some of today's criminals doors.

What's my agenda?

How do "today's" criminals differ from the ones I dealt with?

 

[SumtnFancy]

What's my agenda?

I believe it was dealing with your "chubby" over "something other than what you wrote about." Very nice article, by the way.

 

[Denny347]

Yeah, our SWAT guys only serve a small fraction of the warrants...SMALL. 99.9% of us knock on the door and if no answer...we try back later. I guarantee this is how most of the country serves warrants. The article is sensationalizing the issue...cop or not, it's BS.

 

[Liberty Sanders]

Yeah, our SWAT guys only serve a small fraction of the warrants...SMALL. 99.9% of us knock on the door and if no answer...we try back later. I guarantee this is how most of the country serves warrants. The article is sensationalizing the issue...cop or not, it's BS.

This is clouding the issue.

Several minutes ago I read an article about St. Louis County, Mo. that uses their SWAT Team to serve ALL felony warrants, regardless of the nature of the crime.

This is absolute insanity, and any law enforcement professional knows it, and any who don't know it need to be OUT of law enforcement.

SWAT stands for SPECIAL Weapons and Tactics...SPECIAL, not routine.

Every single time a SWAT Team mounts a forced entry to an American home the likelihood of an armed encounter rises astronomically. This should be risked only when absolutely necessary, NEVER as a matter of routine.

It is undeniable that SWAT Teams are now being used in operations where they never even would have been considered twenty years ago. Terrible mistakes are being made, wrong houses raided and innocent people killed in SWAT raids that are totally unjustified and should NEVER happen.

BS my ass...I stand by every word I wrote.

 

[gunworks321]

From HeadlessRoland: Anyone else need any while I'm popping up a fresh batch?

Yes please! and have Officer B.Fife deliver it.

 

[9mmfan]

Perhaps the majority of Indiana police departments don't routinely use these tactics, but a quick google search found this: How A Crazy Sex Drug Inspired Mass Police Raids Across America - Business Insider

I'm not pointing out the drug part of the story, but the overwhelming police response. This isn't the only story I found, but I chose this one because of the source, Business Insider. Not exactly an anti LEO group.

 

[churchmouse]

They take SWAT teams on these raids because they have to. After all, they might be coming to MY house by mistake.


[video=youtube;JB_deAcoC2I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB_deAcoC2I[/video]

Very good movie.

 

[churchmouse]

Shhhhhh! I think it's starting to get good....

Chewing very quietly.......pass the salt please

 

[Bunnykid68]

Hey man don't get all angry and stuff. Relax and enjoy your life some. Just try to remember that there are times when certain types of extreme people need to be dealt with in ways that make some folks feel uncontrollable.

This is the problem though
SWAT Team Brings TV Crew To Film Raid Against Threatening Internet Critic -- Raids Innocent Grandma Instead - informationliberation

 

[wally05]

What's my agenda?

How do "today's" criminals differ from the ones I dealt with?

If you have to ask that, you've been out of the game for awhile. We are not the only ones to say that. Ask any instructor at ILEA and they'll tell you the same thing. It's a different game these days. Better armed, bigger agendas, and absolutely no respect for LE.

As for the use of SWAT for all felony warrants... in what capacity are they used? Standby? Kicking in every door? There are departments across the midwest that bring officers from their SWAT units for various capacities on felony warrants, but that doesn't mean they are busting down the door.

For every one of those articles you all post, I could find just as many if not more of officers getting killed even serving misdemeanor warrants, when the beat cop just knocks on the door. If you see no use for "no knock" warrant services, Liberty, you've definitely been out of the game too long. No one has given a solution to keeping officers safe during a warrant service for possibly armed persons. If we bring too many street officers, people get upset. If we bring a smaller group of tactical officers, people get upset. Solutions anyone?

 

[wally05]

This is clouding the issue.

Several minutes ago I read an article about St. Louis County, Mo. that uses their SWAT Team to serve ALL felony warrants, regardless of the nature of the crime.

This is absolute insanity, and any law enforcement professional knows it, and any who don't know it need to be OUT of law enforcement.

SWAT stands for SPECIAL Weapons and Tactics...SPECIAL, not routine.

Every single time a SWAT Team mounts a forced entry to an American home the likelihood of an armed encounter rises astronomically. This should be risked only when absolutely necessary, NEVER as a matter of routine.

It is undeniable that SWAT Teams are now being used in operations where they never even would have been considered twenty years ago. Terrible mistakes are being made, wrong houses raided and innocent people killed in SWAT raids that are totally unjustified and should NEVER happen.

BS my ass...I stand by every word I wrote.

Once again, "routine" is not a word a cop uses. There are no routine warrant services. As for the comment about SWAT increasing the likelihood of armed encounter... well yeah. If SWAT is going in, there's probably a damn good reason they are (ex: Suspect's known to be armed and dangerous in some way). That statement doesn't prove anything.

How many mistaken houses have been raided in the past twenty years?

 

[Liberty Sanders]

If you have to ask that, you've been out of the game for awhile. We are not the only ones to say that. Ask any instructor at ILEA and they'll tell you the same thing. It's a different game these days. Better armed, bigger agendas, and absolutely no respect for LE.

As for the use of SWAT for all felony warrants... in what capacity are they used? Standby? Kicking in every door? There are departments across the midwest that bring officers from their SWAT units for various capacities on felony warrants, but that doesn't mean they are busting down the door.

For every one of those articles you all post, I could find just as many if not more of officers getting killed even serving misdemeanor warrants, when the beat cop just knocks on the door. If you see no use for "no knock" warrant services, Liberty, you've definitely been out of the game too long. No one has given a solution to keeping officers safe during a warrant service for possibly armed persons. If we bring too many street officers, people get upset. If we bring a smaller group of tactical officers, people get upset. Solutions anyone?

No, I didn't have to ask it...the question is rhetorical.

And no, it's not a different game these days. I know it's hard for you "modern" coppers to believe, but we geezers actually served warrants on armed persons. We did it without flashbangs, without battering rams, and without SWAT Teams.

Let me tell you what we did NOT do. We didn't bust down doors for every warrant that had the word "drug" somehow connected with it. We didn't make SWAT raids on people for selling milk to willing customers. We didn't make SWAT raids on houses where someone was living that hadn't made timely payments on their student loans. We didn't make SWAT raids on elderly farmers who have the temerity to care for an orphaned whitetail deer fawn.

And if I had it to do over again, I would change nothing.