FTF Purchase Question

[Turtle]

!00% agre with asking to see the LTCH and i personally wont see to someone without a LTCH.... it really just feels safer this way.

 

[Expat]

Personally, I like to get fingerprints and a DNA sample (cheek swab). I don't know if their IDs are legitimate or not. One can't be too careful. I usually videotape the meet as well.

 

[ATM]

My INGO hat has always been enough.

 

[JetGirl]

Fixed age and yes, they are excepted to transport unloaded and in secure wrapper from place of purchase even without LTCH.

You can buy a handgun at 18 with a FTF deal, but not from a store/dealer?

Didn't know that.

 

[us_agent]

Personally, I like to get fingerprints and a DNA sample (cheek swab). I don't know if their IDs are legitimate or not. One can't be too careful. I usually videotape the meet as well.

+1

I'm also a fan of the biometric retinal scan as the icing on the cake.

 

[shooter1054]

Is my Channel 4 Kids Club Card good enough?....Janie Rocked!!!!

 

[us_agent]

While I would agree that seeing the LTCH is a plus, it's one of those things where on said date that person was cleared. You do not know if after they have received the license whether or not that individual has committed an act that makes them an improper person (unlikely yes, but definitely a possibility). I feel like you'd be in the same situation as someone who didn't have the LTCH if the firearm was used for something illegal. Either way you could make the case for yourself that you were justified in the appropriateness of the sale. Personally, I like to get a feel based off conversation, ask for DL, LTCH (as applicable if not its not a deal breaker), ask if the individual can pass a background check today, then its cash and carry. I'm not going to do anything more than is required by law.

 

[ljadayton]

Why can no one take me at me word that I am a proper person? I have seen at least 3 firearms in the classified that I would have purchased for the asking price but the seller wanted an LTCH so I did not even bother contacting them.

A gun shop wouldn't take you at your word

I wasnt the one who mentioned showing ltch on the transaction, he offered it up. But after I thought about it, I felt better knowing the guy i traded my pistol to for a rifle was legally able to have it. Now if he goes out and commits a crime with it and the gun comes back on me, I can say he had a license to carry. So in my knowledge the state gave him that permit because he wasnt a convicted felon which makes him a swell guy in my book But honestly, how am I to know who is a wanted man and who isnt? Most of us on this forum have ltch but how many of us r wanted right now? Its a pain in the ass to ask for and provide but, its the privlage of a upstanding citizen to provide proof. If I hadnt asked the guy for his ltch permit and just straight up asked him if he was legally able to own a firearm and he lied would I be liable?

exactly. If I was a seller, I'd want to know that the person I'm selling to is, to the best of my knowledge, a "proper person" just like I would expect something to be run on me when I'm buying a gun. I've had more background checks done on me then I can count. 3 gun purchases, IDK how many FFL transfers and multiples for different jobs. I'm a "proper person" and I don't care if they run my name. I'm squeaky clean

(not implying that anyone that has an issue with LTCH during a FTF isn't clean)

 

[Bill of Rights]

A gun shop wouldn't take you at your word

A gun shop wouldn't demand to see a LTCH, either; they'd do a NICS check. Some folks don't have a LTCH... the language of the questions for it might make issue to a person who's sought counseling for one or another problem (maybe depression over a divorce?) more problematic vs. the question on the 4473, specific to either being adjudicated mentally defective or committed to a mental institution.

exactly. If I was a seller, I'd want to know that the person I'm selling to is, to the best of my knowledge, a "proper person" just like I would expect something to be run on me when I'm buying a gun. I've had more background checks done on me then I can count. 3 gun purchases, IDK how many FFL transfers and multiples for different jobs. I'm a "proper person" and I don't care if they run my name. I'm squeaky clean

(not implying that anyone that has an issue with LTCH during a FTF isn't clean)

Lori, with all due respect, this is the "if you have nothing to hide" argument. I also have a squeaky clean record... I haven't even had a parking ticket since about 1987... but I still have a problem with having my name run... It's a tenet of American law that a person is innocent of crime until proven guilty, so why am I having to prove my innocence to be allowed to exercise my natural, fundamental, and Constitutional rights?

This also touches on the police practice of confiscating your gun, then "running the numbers to check if it's stolen"; of guns, cell phones, and car stereos, which is stolen more often? Yet the officer never wants to run the numbers on my stereo, my cell phone, etc. I don't have to prove my innocence to purchase a car, a chain saw, or a whole set of knives, so why do I have to do so to buy a gun?

Sure, if I sell a pistol, I'll probably ask for a LTCH or will use a FFL to make the transfer happen... not because I think it's right, but because, the law being what it is, I have to cover my "six". I don't fear the guy I'm selling the gun to, I fear my country's government's reaction to my selling that gun.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[ljadayton]

A gun shop wouldn't demand to see a LTCH, either; they'd do a NICS check. Some folks don't have a LTCH... the language of the questions for it might make issue to a person who's sought counseling for one or another problem (maybe depression over a divorce?) more problematic vs. the question on the 4473, specific to either being adjudicated mentally defective or committed to a mental institution.

Lori, with all due respect, this is the "if you have nothing to hide" argument. I also have a squeaky clean record... I haven't even had a parking ticket since about 1987... but I still have a problem with having my name run... It's a tenet of American law that a person is innocent of crime until proven guilty, so why am I having to prove my innocence to be allowed to exercise my natural, fundamental, and Constitutional rights?

This also touches on the police practice of confiscating your gun, then "running the numbers to check if it's stolen"; of guns, cell phones, and car stereos, which is stolen more often? Yet the officer never wants to run the numbers on my stereo, my cell phone, etc. I don't have to prove my innocence to purchase a car, a chain saw, or a whole set of knives, so why do I have to do so to buy a gun?

Sure, if I sell a pistol, I'll probably ask for a LTCH or will use a FFL to make the transfer happen... not because I think it's right, but because, the law being what it is, I have to cover my "six". I don't fear the guy I'm selling the gun to, I fear my country's government's reaction to my selling that gun.

Blessings,
Bill

Bill, all I was doing was trying to provide AN answer for why a FTF would ask for a LTCH. A gun shop would do a background check. I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying that's the way it seems to work in the world we live in. To cover your own ass, exactly. In a "perfect" world, the 2A and 4A would be followed. But it's not a perfect world and they're not always.

 

[Bill of Rights]

Bill, all I was doing was trying to provide AN answer for why a FTF would ask for a LTCH. A gun shop would do a background check. I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying that's the way it seems to work in the world we live in. To cover your own ass, exactly. In a "perfect" world, the 2A and 4A would be followed. But it's not a perfect world and they're not always.

Fair enough. Rep added (not that you can tell)

 

[ljadayton]

Fair enough. Rep added (not that you can tell)

And thank you Bill. I don't agree with some laws but I have to follow them AND cover myself. My son needs me around. and I will ALWAYS take fairly earned rep

 

[Bunnykid68]

I have sold several guns to members here. I asked each of them if they were a proper person, made the deal and shook on it. Everyone was happy.

 

[ljadayton]

I have sold several guns to members here. I asked each of them if they were a proper person, made the deal and shook on it. Everyone was happy.

You didn't look proper to me

 

[Bunnykid68]

You didn't look proper to me

Next time I will make sure my shirt is tucked in, will that help?
I am proper, maybe not right in the head but proper none the less.

 

[printcraft]

My INGO hat has always been enough.

Be Careful!! Those can tip off the non operators among us.

 

[ljadayton]

Next time I will make sure my shirt is tucked in, will that help?
I am proper, maybe not right in the head but proper none the less.

nah, you were perfectly proper...I don't care about the shirt lol

 

[Timjoebillybob]

A gun shop wouldn't take you at your word

When I bought my first gun, they took my mom at her word. They can't take you at your word now due to federal law.

Bill, all I was doing was trying to provide AN answer for why a FTF would ask for a LTCH. A gun shop would do a background check.

A gun shop is required by law to do a background check, it didn't used to be that way.

I do remember when IN law required a 3 day wait, unless you had a LTCH. Then gun shops would ask, because then they didn't have to hold it for 3 days.

 

[Bill of Rights]

You didn't look proper to me

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBxy3tUV4OM[/ame]

 

[Sheltie]

What is most surprising for me is that the members in this forum seem very intent on exercising their constitutional rights, yet put more restrictions on something they are allowed by law to do legally, because of fear of the government.