Fighting Mindset and Martial Arts

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  • Jackson

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    So today at the martial arts class I have been attending for the last year or so, the instructor talked a little bit about mindset. He was specifically talking about how he believes folks that spend a lot of time in various grappling arts (BJJ, Wrestling, Judo, etc) gain a toughness and determination from that experience not matched in most other pursuits. He was specific about grappling because of the pressure and the discomfort that comes from it. He also hinted at the idea that this determination and fortitude would likely carry through to other areas of life.

    Later that night, I had a more experienced member of the academy on top of me attempting to choke me with my own gi. I had my chin down and it ended up wrapped around my face. So I had my head smashed to the mat under his elbow or forearm and a good deal of his weight on my head, my clothing wrapped tightly and uncomfortably around my face, and pretty much unable to get up or advance my position (I really think I was close to recovering guard, but... Maybe not). This went on for 30 seconds or a minute before I was saved by the bell. In that time I took a moment to reflect on what my coach had been saying earlier in class.

    Would I have reacted differently a year go when I first started? Somewhat I think. I would not have been as comfortable in the position. I would not have recognized that I was not in immediate danger, despite the poor position and the discomfort. I would have been a bit more frantic and probably done something to give up what little defense I had and been choked. But is this calmer approach due to some toughness or better mindset I've gained? Or is it specifically more grappling experience being applied to the specific problems related to the experience? I guess what I'm asking is, does it really carry over to other areas?

    The situation and the talk from our coach also reminded me of something Shay said at one of the Mindset Lab courses I attended. (I'll attempt to paraphrase and probably mess it up, but this is the best of my recollection.) Basically he said that one way to develop a tougher mindset was to do stuff that's hard and decide not to quit. That experience and repetition not quitting will lead to a no-quit attitude. Essentially that not giving up is a skill that can actually be practiced. (Okay, the last two sentences are mine. Italics is what I remember of what he actually said.)

    So, the questions for the board: Can mindset and fortitude in the face of adversity be developed? If so, do you do anything you feel increases your resilience to pressure and discomfort, to giving up and quitting? If you do, what is it? How do you feel it's developed your "fighting mindset"? Could be anything. I just used martial arts as an example because that's where I was getting my head smashed today. Tell me about yours.
     
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    Shay

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    I believe that Mindset can be taught. :yesway:

    When I was training JuJitsu I used to tap pretty early when getting choked. After a while I decided that I'd keep fighting and just postpone my desire to tap. My comfort zone expanded because I made it expand by my choice.
     

    cedartop

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    Of course. You and Shay are right and those are good examples. Paul Sharp really believes that about JuJitsu as well. I would say that parts of basic training in the military are designed to teach the same thing. Even more so in things like BUD/S I would suspect. Training to not give up is great.
     

    CavMedic

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    A big part of Basic was proving to your mind that your body can go so much further than you ever thought. Our 1st 10k ruck I thought I was gonna die (I went in after not working out for about a year...bad idea). In combatives it proved so even more. You fight beyond what you thought was your limit when a simple thing like pride is on the line...imagine if your life was on the line instead. Mindset is everything. If you think you are done then that doubt creeps in and takes up space for reactive thinking and your instincts. Just my 2C.
     

    Que

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    Jackson, along with my nephew who has been training in boxing for several years, have really made me think about getting into some form of physical defense training. I wrestled for many years and I am comfortable in the clutch, but I know I need more knowledge as I get older and weaker. I've not even been in a real fight in over 20 years, so I have no idea what I would do or take a punch to the face. I will investigate to see what's available in the area, but right now all I hear about is the MMA gym. Thanks for posting this, Jackson.
     

    Jackson

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    I believe that Mindset can be taught. :yesway:

    When I was training JuJitsu I used to tap pretty early when getting choked. After a while I decided that I'd keep fighting and just postpone my desire to tap. My comfort zone expanded because I made it expand by my choice.

    Similar to my experience, but does that carry over to other areas of life? Or does mindset training require specificity?
     

    Jackson

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    Jackson, along with my nephew who has been training in boxing for several years, have really made me think about getting into some form of physical defense training. I wrestled for many years and I am comfortable in the clutch, but I know I need more knowledge as I get older and weaker. I've not even been in a real fight in over 20 years, so I have no idea what I would do or take a punch to the face. I will investigate to see what's available in the area, but right now all I hear about is the MMA gym. Thanks for posting this, Jackson.

    I would definitely encourage it. I just think its fun and its a great workout (which I really needed).
     

    iChokePeople

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    I would definitely encourage it. I just think its fun and its a great workout (which I really needed).

    It satisfies the body's natural urge to choke the **** out of someone or punch them in the face, reducing the possibility that you'll do that in a meeting at work where it's less acceptable, socially.
     

    cedartop

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    It satisfies the body's natural urge to choke the **** out of someone or punch them in the face, reducing the possibility that you'll do that in a meeting at work where it's less acceptable, socially.

    If that's true I need to redouble my efforts at finding something somewhat local. Some days I think it is only the fact that I worked inside a prison and know I don't want to live there, that keeps me from choking out my boss and coworkers.
     

    rhino

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    This is an issue that I think we should address with respect to force-on-force training with firearms simulators/airsoft as well. I think it's in the best interest of all to encourage people to ignore when they are hit by the training projectile to keep fighting until the director halts the exercise. Teaching people to quit when they're shot is not a great idea. I know that I've shut down completely on occasion when getting hit by airsoft, mostly because I realized I'd made yet another stupid mistake. In other situations, I didn't even know I was hit until someone told me afterward or there were marks and blood.
     

    Jackson

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    I generally concur with rhino on not stopping exercises due to hits.

    I can see the value of stopping in some skill-based exercises to course correct and encourage better patterns in the subsequent iterations of the drill. However, in a scenario I think stopping due to a hit plants bad seeds.
     

    Shay

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    Similar to my experience, but does that carry over to other areas of life? Or does mindset training require specificity?

    General training to not quit is good, but the more specific it can be to the situation you later experience, the better.

    A lot of long distance runners are good at pushing through "the wall" where their body wants to quit. It's a skill and it makes them mentally tougher, but I'm not sure how much of that skill would carry over to pushing through being shot or punched or stabbed. There are naturally tough people who seem to have stronger Mindsets that cross many disciplines. But if your concern is defense, you need to make sure your focus is defense.

    That's my take at least.
     

    Shay

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    I generally concur with rhino on not stopping exercises due to hits.

    I can see the value of stopping in some skill-based exercises to course correct and encourage better patterns in the subsequent iterations of the drill. However, in a scenario I think stopping due to a hit plants bad seeds.

    Even in skill-based FoF exercises, I never want to train someone to give up. Every repetition counts. There's no reason to train reps that go against your highest goal.
     

    flatlander

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    You can be taught the desire to be "mentally tough" but it's up to the individual to actually decide to be "mentally tough". The more situations you experience, and get through, the more you will have the right mindset. Fear is a wonderful motivator. Some people use it to improve their mindset while others can't meet the challenge.
    Does it carry over to other parts of your life? You bet. Are you the one people look to in "exciting" or high stress situations? Are you the rock in your relationships? If so, you probably already have the right mindset or at least the base to build on.
    YMMV

    Bob
     

    The Bubba Effect

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    From Catcher to Police Officer, Lim a Legend Under the Gun - latimes
    Most of you guys probably know the story of Stacy Lim, but I linked it above in case anyone missed it. The article alludes to her sports experience giving her an edge in the sense that she was conditioned to ignore exhaustion and to stay in the fight. I don't know the lady and can not say if there is any truth to the sports angle, but I can say that she's a hero of mine and I think about her sometimes as relates to this fighting mindset issue.

    More specific to the OP and grappling:

    When you learn to keep a calm head while your chin is being shoved into your belly button and someone is choking you with your own shirt, you are learning to ignore that shrill voice that screams "PANIC!". When you make an intentional practice of engaging in difficulty, you are learning to ignore the little voice that whispers "quit".
     

    Latewatch

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    From Catcher to Police Officer, Lim a Legend Under the Gun - latimes
    Most of you guys probably know the story of Stacy Lim, but I linked it above in case anyone missed it. The article alludes to her sports experience giving her an edge in the sense that she was conditioned to ignore exhaustion and to stay in the fight. I don't know the lady and can not say if there is any truth to the sports angle, but I can say that she's a hero of mine and I think about her sometimes as relates to this fighting mindset issue.

    More specific to the OP and grappling:

    When you learn to keep a calm head while your chin is being shoved into your belly button and someone is choking you with your own shirt, you are learning to ignore that shrill voice that screams "PANIC!". When you make an intentional practice of engaging in difficulty, you are learning to ignore the little voice that whispers "quit".


    One of my favorite quotes that I think is very relevant to this topic comes from Stacy Lim, "You must prepare your mind for where your body may have to go."
    Whether it is sports, martial arts, or military training (in my case Ranger School and 11 years assigned to Ranger Units), by training hard you learn that you can push through pain and keep a calm demeanor when facing adversity.
     

    roscott

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    I wholeheartedly agree with the OP. I personally believe that self-control is like a muscle, and that anytime it is used, it gets stronger. Particularly any event that triggers your panic reaction, and you learn to overcome it, seems to help in a variety of fields.
     
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