Federal Budget Mess?!?

[Libertarian01]

Dross,

I agree with you that in the "real world" getting massive spending cuts through will be nigh impossible because of various special interest groups along with honest individual disagreement on the purpose of government and what its priorities should be.

With that in mind I have come to the honest opinion that we must economically "crash and burn!" Only when we fall flat on our faces and have our noses rubbed in the face of reality will we be able to start picking up the pieces and starting over from scratch. Hopefully to do it right the second time.

Because only when everything comes tumbling down will those living within their bubbles realize that we can't go anywhere. With our backs to the sea and the the massive debt and unfunded liabilities will we face reality, and it isn't a pleasant reality.

IF we don't want everything to crash and burn then we will need to make some massive reforms to bring our country into an economically stable long term position. A few suggestions:

#1) A flat tax of 20% on everything! Individuals and companies alike. This would generate about $2.6 Trillion to start and give us a reasonable target to attain. Of course there are NO rightoffs or special tax incentives. The only thing I would allow here is for a business to right off normal costs of business, but no special deals for anything in particular.

#2) Privatize Social Security... For REAL! Pres Bush talked about it, but if you actually read what he proposed it wasn't really privatized. By allowing every American who is on SS to be responsible for their own retirement it would promote greater responsibility. It would also infuse a huge sum of money into the economy and remove the governments ability to meddle.

#3) Health care reform! What Pres Obama did was essentially "health insurance" reform. We DO need to tackle massively rising health care costs and this can be done with minimal government interference. The government could work to impose free market rules on an industry that for the last many decades has operated without such constraints.

#4) To keep things simple cut every federal government budget by 20%, down the board. This would bring us into line with the revenue generated by a 20% flat tax.

I think these ideas are tremendously simple and could be sold to the American people because they are simple and across the board. They target no one group and address the major costs faced by the Federal Government, at least indirectly with Medicare and Medicaid reaping the benefits of lower health care costs.

It's not not best by any stretch but there is a plan!

I know it would never sell, that is why Plan A (Crash & burn) will win out in the end. Regrettably.

Regards,

Doug

 

[ATOMonkey]

Sunset all social programs and lock in the current spending levels.

Consolidate all security/police/spy/whatever alphabet agencies into one group.

If this won't fly, then just sunset SS and Medicare. Grandfather in all the current enrollees, and end new enrollment. Lock in current payment levels with no COLA.

Cut everything else by 35% and lock in the current levels of spending.

Combine this with even a modest projected growth and we'll see a balanced budget before the whole thing melts down.

Wish list also includes the implementation of the fairtax in the constitution so no one can dicker with it. Uncertainty in the tax code hurts business just as much or worse than actual taxes. At least when people know the rules of the game they can develop a strategy. Every business I interacted with last year said they were just waiting to spend any money until the new tax code came out. It was ridiculous.

 

[dross]

So, crash and burn. I think it may well come to that, too. Until then, however, I'll throw my support behind the best solution available to me in this moment.

My pie in the sky plan is more modest than yours. It's still completely unachievable, but here goes:

1. Eliminate corporate income taxes and capital gains taxes.
2. Freeze all spending to 2008 levels.
3. Reform SS modestly
4. Freeze all new regulations
5. Cut tax rates across the board by a few percentage points

Those simple things would almost immediately create an economic boom that would grow the GDP, which would reduce our debt and deficit as percentages of the GDP.

Now, there would still be things to fix after that, but we'd be out of immediate crisis mode.

Of course, none of that can actually happen.

 

[Johnny C]

Dross,

I


#2) Privatize Social Security... For REAL! Pres Bush talked about it, but if you actually read what he proposed it wasn't really privatized. By allowing every American who is on SS to be responsible for their own retirement it would promote greater responsibility. It would also infuse a huge sum of money into the economy and remove the governments ability to meddle.


I

This sounds good to me, as it should to all responsible persons, but unfortunately, MOST folks are irresponsible financially. This won't actually foster more responsibility, but folks will just cry about it when they get old and have spent everything they should have saved for retirement. This too is ok with me as long as the Gov. doesn't bail them out when they cry.

 

[dross]

Let's pretend that the current budget crisis is a yearly budget. The budget is roughly 3.5 trillion this year. Let's convert that to 35,000.

So, if the government was a human, let's say Suzy. Suzy makes 25,000 per year, but she spends 35,000 per year. That means she must borrow 10,000 every year. Suzy is 140,000 in debt right now, btw.

Now Suzy's Mommy and Suzy's Daddy each come up with a plan to help Suzy. Daddy suggests that Suzy cut $600 from this year's expenditures. Suzy's Mommy suggests that Suzy only cut $300 this year.

The whole thing falls apart based on this disagreement.

That's the current budget argument.

 

[ATOMonkey]

That SS money is already in the economy. It gets spent the instant it's taxed. Actually more gets spent than taken in the instant it's taxed.

Don't look for much of an economic boom just by changing how the money is redistributed.

It needs to be cut entirely out of the budget.

 

[jeremy]

What do I want them to do?!

That is actually pretty easy. Only spend the Money that you have...

 

[dom1104]

Re arraigning the deck chairs on the titanic.

I wouldnt trust anyone up in DC to cook a decent hamburger much less fix a broken system.

Let them do whatever they wish. Deck Chairs.

 

[ATOMonkey]

I'm on another board and suggested that we balance the budget and you would think that I wanted all service members and their families to live on the street and that I wanted to kill old people. sheesh....

 

[ATOMonkey]

Let's pretend that the current budget crisis is a yearly budget. The budget is roughly 3.5 trillion this year. Let's convert that to 35,000.

So, if the government was a human, let's say Suzy. Suzy makes 25,000 per year, but she spends 35,000 per year. That means she must borrow 10,000 every year. Suzy is 140,000 in debt right now, btw.

Now Suzy's Mommy and Suzy's Daddy each come up with a plan to help Suzy. Daddy suggests that Suzy cut $600 from this year's expenditures. Suzy's Mommy suggests that Suzy only cut $300 this year.

The whole thing falls apart based on this disagreement.

That's the current budget argument.

Suzy is also paying for Mom and Dad's retirement and has 3 kids to support.

 

[dross]

Suzy is also paying for Mom and Dad's retirement and has 3 kids to support.

The three kids doesn't cost her that much, but Mom and Dad's retirement and medical care is a big, big reason she's having to borrow that 10K every year.

 

[jeremy]

My big question is why do Politicians feel having a Surplus is bad?!

 

[dross]

My point with my little Suzy analogy, though is that when the suggestion that you cut 1.7% of the budget is met with strong opposition and dire warnings of starving seniors, how are we ever going to cut 25% or 30%?

 

[dross]

My big question is why do Politicians feel having a Surplus is bad?!

They don't. The get their power from the goodies they hand out. Less goodies = less power.

Also, the people who get those goodies (government workers, unions, retired people) will throw them out of office if they don't give up the goodies.

BTW, a surplus IS bad. It would mean that the government was taking more from the citizens than it needs to run. That's very bad.

 

[jeremy]

BTW, a surplus IS bad. It would mean that the government was taking more from the citizens than it needs to run. That's very bad.

Yes and no...

I would be willing to have a Government that had a Surplus of Monies. IF, IF they would be willing to trim this beast down to something that is not out of a Nightmare...

 

[ATOMonkey]

The government should never have a surplus, because any additional revenue is SUPPOSED to be used to buy back debt.

 

[ATOMonkey]

The system was set up so that some years you were red and some years you were black, and it was all supposed to balance out through the issuing and purchase of debt.

 

[jeremy]

The government should never have a surplus, because any additional revenue is SUPPOSED to be used to buy back debt.

Since we are in Fantasia...
Might as well wish for Laws that make sense also...

 

[Expat]

I think the GOP should make it clear, if we do not get our spending cuts, then we will vote with you and pass your budget. But be forewarned, we will not increase the debt limit in mid May. We will, in effect, pass our own balanced budget amendment by not increasing the debt limit. You will not borrow any more money. You will be limited to spending the money that comes in. Live with the consequences.

 

[drobpk]

Regarding this budget mess, the republicans must hold out for the benefit of the country. We are close to a collapse due to the tremendous debt which has piled up during the reign of Obama, Nancy and Harry. This amounts to an increase of almost 5 trillion dollars. UNBELIEVABLE!! My understanding is that the budget proposed is somewhere around 3.5 Trillion dollars. We only take in 2.2Trillion dollars from all of our taxes. The amount of 33 Billion dollars in budget cuts is only a drop in the bucket..

Stick by your guns, republicans. A government shutdown for 21 days did not hurt this country 15 years ago, and it will not hurt us now. The benefits of sticking it out FAR outweigh caving in.